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Thread: Bathroom bills and other laws , discussion thread

  1. #351
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    Gov. Pritzker signed into Illinois state law the bill which requires all single occupancy restrooms to be designated as gender neutral and have signage to reflect gender neutral in a place of accommodation or a public building.

  2. #352
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    Surprised this thread is still going.
    All this time I have had no issues using the ladies room in Ky,Ind,Ohio and Tenn.

  3. #353
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    You're lucky! From news articles I've read some women go totally insane when encountering what they presume is a male in a "woman's" restroom, especially if mom is accompanied by a daughter. Just about all the single occupancy restrooms I have encountered are small and have locks for privacy.

  4. #354
    Silver Member Aunt Kelly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stephanie47 View Post
    You're lucky! From news articles I've read some women go totally insane when encountering what they presume is a male in a "woman's" restroom, especially if mom is accompanied by a daughter. Just about all the single occupancy restrooms I have encountered are small and have locks for privacy.
    Like Tracy, I have never had more than a second glance turned my way in the restroom, and even that is rare.

    We hear about incidents like that, but we never hear how they turn out. I believe that (if they actually happen), the vast majority end with the complainant being told to get over it or get gone. FWIW, I'm pretty sure that the oft-made claim that there has never been a successful prosecution of a transgendered person for using the appropriate restroom. That's because it's just not the issue that arm-flappers behind the bathroom bills would have us believe.
    Calling bigotry an "opinion" is like calling arsenic a "flavor".

  5. #355
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    In one of my previous comments concerning my city (Tacoma) the ordinance was enacted at the request of the transgender community. There is certain logic to the request. If the signage for single occupancy restrooms is gender neutral, then there is no basis for anyone to question anyone using the facility. As to never hearing anything about issues arising, there are instances. There were protests at the libraries in King County, WA during "Drag Queen Story Hour." According to an attendee some of the protestors were "guarding" the women's restroom. With the anti transgender rhetoric coming from the top protestors are becoming emboldened.

    Anyway, making a restroom gender neutral eliminates anyone's claim on the territory.

  6. #356
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    No problems for me, but I get in, get it done, and get out.

  7. #357
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    I was at the library 6 months ago dressed and had to go. It was empty so i ran in there used it while the librarian called for me to come out by knocking on the door. When finished i cam out and they called the library police.
    Nothing happened and they said nothing to me.

  8. #358
    Yes, that avatar IS me! Bailey_in_Mansfield's Avatar
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    I'm only just recently brave enough to attempt going into the women's bathrooms en femme. No wig, hair around the length of a pixie cut (although it's not cut as a pixie cut, it's a more traditionally masculine look), and a cloth mask covering from the nose to about half of my neck. (Yay for hiding stubble)

    Have only done this twice: once in Target (because I knew their policy) and once at the local mall. No trouble either time. But I'm still nervous about this and would like to know if there's an index somewhere of each state's bathroom laws and/or various companies' bathroom policies? (I live in Texas so... yeah...)
    Last edited by Bailey_in_Mansfield; 05-30-2020 at 09:23 PM. Reason: post text showed up twice for some reason

  9. #359
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    I have used the ladies toilets when fully dressed with no problems or second glances for years. That includes standing in queues outside . I wash my hands and touch up makeup in the mirror in crowded busy toilets no problems. I wouldn?t dare do so if I didn?t feel confident that I look like a woman. I?m concerned to see that in UK there are possible proposals to outlaw the use of the ladies toilets by anyone who is biologically a man. I hope this comes to nothing as I can?t possibly go into the gents toilets dolled up in my finest!

  10. #360
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    Cheshire girl, I can't see how any such law could be enforced. If one looks like a woman then the only ways to find out are through accurate facial recognition which requires expensive camera systems in the loos (and everyones face already on record) or if someone actually gets a look at your block and tackle while you are in there. There are plenty of GG's who don't look particularly womanly who would be offended if there gender came into question and, for the transgender community, it would open a can of worms in a supposedly very accepting nation where to be LGBTQ is almost becoming compulsary. I don't think any political party would even think of going there (at the moment).

    As a man I've always hated going into mens public toilets. I feel like a fairy going into a den of grunting ogres. I can almost smell the testosterone. Yuck.

  11. #361
    Silver Member Aunt Kelly's Avatar
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    Eventually, we're going to see "bathroom bills" viewed as the hate crime that they are. As I've heard Judge Fry put it, all the things that such laws purport to protect "our wives and daughters" against are already crimes under existing law. She also points out that there has never been a successful prosecution of a transgender person using the facilities corresponding to their gender identity. Never. Not one.

    So these laws are little more than a kind of straw man argument, designed to consolidate support from a fearful and naive group by presenting a threat that does not exist. If we did that on the basis of race, the outrage would be instant. I am just old enough to remember when that was not the case. I pray that I live long enough to see the same transformation of our society's norms when it comes to the LGBTQIA+ segment of that society. Recent events give me a great deal of hope.
    Calling bigotry an "opinion" is like calling arsenic a "flavor".

  12. #362
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    That was scary And it can happen to any of us.

  13. #363
    Gold Member Helen_Highwater's Avatar
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    Without getting political, I do suspect that the election of a new POTUS will have a positive effect on our community and the way it's viewed.

    Hopefully some of the more draconian measures, such as those effecting military personnel will be rolled back. Time will tell no doubt.

  14. #364
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    Helen, a couple of things you mentioned will swing back to where there were 4 years ago, but a lot of the bathroom stuff and some of the marriage stuff is going to continue to be a fight. There is still a large portion of the population that is on the Uber conservative side, and aren't shy about trying to throw their weight around. Especially in certain States. Also keep in mind that the courts have been heavily stacked to support them. Not just the Supreme Court, but many lower courts as well. The right might grouse about this election, but they got what they really wanted over the last 4 years, which will be difficult to change for a long time barring some drastic measures.

  15. #365
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    The best thing we can do, the thing we must do, is to continue to provide facts. For example... There already are laws, in virtually every jurisdiction in this country, against the things "bathroom bills" are purported to prevent. There has never been a successful prosecution of a transgender person for using the restroom which corresponds to their gender identity.
    Calling bigotry an "opinion" is like calling arsenic a "flavor".

  16. #366
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    MA is strange because it’s a True Blue state, it’s also the most Catholic state and many legislators are quite socially conservative and against abortion and also transgender.

    It was a concern for me because I was going out a lot and worried about - everything!. During a physical I told my primary care this was an issue for me and I was working through it with a counselor. He made a note of “gender disphoria” and while that first conversation was awkward, from a legal basis I’d become transgendered.

    As a practical matter, first clubs, then restaurants stores, and schools started breaking up their large single sex bathrooms into more, smaller ones. First they added “Family” bathrooms and then expsnded to small “Unisex” bathrooms. So worrying about where and how to pee became much less of an issue.

    Haven’t been out in a few years and no idea how Covid cleaning measures will change all this.

  17. #367
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    I sometimes contribute to this thread when I have a thought and I just had one..... As most if not all of y'all know, I live in the state of Mississippi. I'm not 100% sure on the bathroom laws here regarding transgenders or CD'ers, I'm sure it's the same just about everywhere, where you're allowed to use the public restroom corresponding to the gender you identify as.

    Now of course, I'm only a CD'er, I'm not transgender. But a while back, I posted in the forum with a question about using the restroom while out dressed and really, the replies I received were to go to use the ladies' room, act like a lady, walk like a lady, do my business, wash my hands and get out..... I have used the ladies' room while out dressed on more than one occasion and I have yet to have an issue.

    When I go into a ladies' room to do my business, that is ALL that I intend to do, then wash my hands and get out of the restroom, just as I would if I were in "male mode" and utilizing the men's room..... I have YET to have an issue, thank goodness. I think some women who have seen me in the ladies' room sort of questioned my gender, (only to themselves, based on the way they looked at me but didn't say anything) but I wouldn't chalk that up as a major issue. If I ever get arrested or questioned by authorities in any way, shape or form, I suppose I'll just tell them that I'm trans..... That would be a lie, but if it kept me out of jail, then so be it! LOL

    Anyway, just my two cents cause it seems like some of y'all are constantly over-analyzing this issue.
    Last edited by char GG; 01-13-2021 at 12:03 PM. Reason: That minor detail is not an allowed topic
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  18. #368
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    Just saw this thread so I wanted to add in my two cents. I live in upstate NY which is fairly liberal. I have used the ladies room many times with no problem. But I am nervous wondering if I will be caught. I don't think much would happen if I were but it would be a bit awkward. Luckily with a smaller frame I have an easier time passing but I am still careful.

  19. #369
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    Like many others I have not experienced any issues with using the female facilities. That being said I also just go to do my business, not lingering any longer that to wash my hands and take a quick look in the mirror. The ladies present for the most part never give me a second look, and those that have give me nothing more than a quick glance and a look over if for nothing more than curiosity or the womanly look they do when checking out the others appearance.

  20. #370
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    This may be a very bad year for hateful and ignorant anti-transgender bills in many states...
    https://www.hrc.org/resources/unprec...ender-american

    Twenty three of these bills specifically target the most vulnerable members of our community, transgender young people.
    Please, do what you can to prevent these reckless attempts to politicize something on which virtually all credible experts agree.
    Out of respect for the rules of this forum, let us not debate the politics of these issues here. If you have questions or suggestions, please PM or email, and I will do my best to assist.

    Thank you.

  21. #371
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    According to the AP, Tennessee 's bathroom law was signed which now has penalties for not posting signage at multi-person bathroom indicating transgender persons may be using the facilities. Not posting the signage can lead to a financial penalty as well as jail time. To me this seem a little bizarre. So, the law is not discriminating against transgender person, presumably under the civil rights acts for public accommodations, for using the facilities, but is alerting the general public in the sense of "beware." So, Tennessee is going to "scare" little girls and their mothers' that there may be a transgender woman using the bathroom? What happens when a daughter is out with her father? Does he stand outside the women's bathroom trying to screen for transgender women and go to jail for trying to block access or is he going to take his daughter into the men's room past all the guys using the urinal?

  22. #372
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    I don't know if anyone else has noticed but there has also been a coordinated attack on transgender youth, like denying types of medical care or not allowing participation in sports. It seems to be blatant discrimination and more likely a call to unite bigoted people with similar thoughts. What ever happened to live and let live??

  23. #373
    Silver Member Aunt Kelly's Avatar
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    That is exactly what it is; yet another ploy to garner political support be demonizing "the other". In this case, it's especially despicable because they're pitching it as a "think of the children" thing, when in reality, it's doing those very children very real harm.
    Calling bigotry an "opinion" is like calling arsenic a "flavor".

  24. #374
    Life is more fun in heels Genifer Teal's Avatar
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    I have two thoughts on this. One is that it's becoming information overload for the public. I get we need to educate them but I think they feel there's too much all the time and there's constant correction of their mistakes. That's enough to frustrate anyone and make them Rebelle. It's great that we're pushing our issue forward I think we need to slow up a little bit let the public get used to things as they are and then go a little further. It's not how much we deserve it's how much we can push to that point without pushing too hard.

    Along with that I was using bathrooms here in New York City and just outside so kind of been accepting area without much trouble until the push came for bathroom equality. Things actually got worse at that point. I think part of the reason is it's Noble to fight for everyone's right but is it easy for the public to accept that anyone can say I belong here regardless of how they look? I know I'm going to take some heat on this but if Grandpa suddenly says I feel more like Grandma and starts using the women's room in a public place that's a hard sell on any one not part of our community. There's no police outside the bathroom so yeah anyone can walk in including someone with bad intent. Being able to claim they belong there isn't suddenly going to make it happen more. I don't think the laws will change that. I just feel that once we started declaring anyone should have the right there was more and more push back.

    I think a better strategy would have been to show some prime examples of people who have transitioned and would look out of place in the opposite bathroom. People would be more willing to understand and accept that their ID may not match their appearance but they should be able to use the place which matches their appearance. This would not be the end goal but it would be a starting point to get the public on board. Then after a certain level of comfort and acceptance was gained, a push could be made full inclusion, with the explanation that not everyone appears the way you would anticipate and see how the public goes with that concept. I just think we've reached a point that the harder we push the more push back we're going to get. I think we need to take a softer approach. You get more flies with honey.

    [SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicole Erin View Post
    So we know about transgender and the standard FTM and MTF.

    What about all these invented genders that some come up with for themselves. If someone who was in high school band and identifies as a different gender, say calling themselves "TransSiberianOrchedechtomy" or whatever, does Target still let them use the restroom of their choice?
    Trans-Siberian-Orchiectomy. Love it!!!
    Last edited by Genifer Teal; 08-08-2021 at 12:54 PM.

  25. #375
    Silver Member Aunt Kelly's Avatar
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    If "the public" were the problem, I'd agree, but that's not where the challenge lies. The public, by and large, does not see us as a problem. Those that do are, by and large, responding to the fear mongering from certain quarters as they attempt to use us as as the latest "other" that only they can protect against.
    We should never, ever, back off from calling out this kind of deliberately generated hatred. WE are not "...declaring that anyone should have the right..." That's the assertion of those trying to make us into something we are not, a threat to "our women and children". That assertion pretends that there are not, already, laws against all the things they're trying make everyone fearful of, and that too is something that we should be making plain in our response to their tactics.
    Last edited by Aunt Kelly; 09-06-2021 at 03:58 PM.
    Calling bigotry an "opinion" is like calling arsenic a "flavor".

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