Difficult threshold!

[AnneForever]

Hello! I haven't been dressing up as a woman for very long and my wife hasn't had the easiest of times adjusting to it, so there are inevitably certain limits to how far and fast I can move forward without breaking up my marriage. So, I can't shave that much, cosmetics has to be done when she's away on some business trip and I don't have a wig (yet). But, I do have breastforms, a steadily growing wardrobe and some pairs of shoes for different occasions. What I want some advice on is this: without a wig especially, I am not able to pass at all so therefor I do not make an attempt to hide that I am a man, I just go out wearing women's clothing and try to look as good as I can. I am also wearing my breastforms on those occasions and that makes me a man with breasts, wearing clothing meant for women, but without makeup or a wig. So, even if I make an utmost effort to dress as good as I possibly can, does this make me look silly? And I am especially thinking about the breasts, should I leave those behind until I get my wig and makeup on? I feel I'm right on a threshold here, not hiding that I'm a man but at the same time having fake breasts which is so 110% female. So if any of you understand what I mean, please respond Love Anne

[Rachael Leigh]

Anne I think for most of us there is a part where yes we look at the mirror and think we look silly and to be honest if your going out without a wig or such things you may well indeed draw unwanted attention.
I've often wondered if all of us who dressed just went out in our cute clothes and skirts and such without any attempt to do makeup if we would ever go out again.
I just think trying our best to pass which is pretty much a near impossibility is why we try because of the challenge and as well as bending the socialital rules to a certain extant.

Anne I'm not sure exactly what your hoping for when you go out and what your need is but if it's like me we just want a bit of acceptance

[Alice Torn]

I am afraid. i just do not understand why any man would go out in womens clothes with no wig, or long hair. To me, it is scary enough looking quite a bit like a woman, but if i went out with my short male hair, and no wig or a little makeup, I would be watched even more than i already am, at six foot six! My first wigs were thrift store wigs, or ebay. Does your wife mind you going out wigless? Maybe under dressing beneath guy clothes is a place to start.

[CynthiaD]

To me, breast forms, wig, and skirt/dress go together. I seldom wear one without the other two. I would never go out with forms and no wig.

But you need to figure out what works for you. There's no official manual on how to cross dress.

[Allisa]

Anne there are several members here who dress and go out as men in womens clothes, I'm afraid I have forgotten their names but I'm sure they will respond. As far as wearing your forms, if they make the clothes fit better than by all means wear them, you don't want to be seen in ill fitting clothing.

[Leslie Langford]

Like Alice, I'm not sure I understand the problem here. Just buy the wig and be done with it.

If money is the issue, you can buy a half-way decent one from Paula Young for as little as U.S.D. $29.99. You can also order inexpensive man-made wigs on-line from any number of other sources, so a visit to an actual bricks-and-mortar wig salon for a proper fitting can be deferred until you are more comfortable going out in public fully en femme, if that's what's holding you up.

You already have a rudimentary female wardrobe, breastforms, some cosmetics, you wife (albeit unhappily) knows that you crossdress, and you have been out in public in semi-drag before. This is more than many here have been able to accomplish to date in their journey. And unless you normally sport facial hair, shaving should not be an issue either. On the other hand, if it is a case where your wife does not like the idea of you removing the hair from other parts of your body such as arms, legs, and chest - well, there are numerous ways to cover those areas up as well without making it too obvious to the uninitiated.

The answer to your quandary seems to be a bit of a no-brainer, so I can't help but get the sense that something else is going on here. If this is all just a set-up to get our "permission" to go out in public presenting in half male/half female mode, you don't need it - just follow your heart and do whatever floats your boat. The only ones whom you will ultimately be answerable to are your wife, your family, your friends, your workplace, and the public at large - all of whom may take a dim view of what they will undoubtedly regard as exhibitionist and/or fetishistic behavior, and this may negatively impact your future relationships with them. Only YOU can decide if this is a price that you are willing to pay.

Most of us here who go out in public en femme strive to "pass" as genetic females (or at least "blend in") so as not to draw undue attention to ourselves. In doing so, we attempt to go about our business without the risk of being stared at or mocked or harassed for what we are doing. Others - such as perhaps yourself - might get an adrenalin rush out of challenging accepted norms of behavior and eliciting confused - if not downright hostile - reactions from those whom they encounter.

Different strokes for different folks, and as they say, YMMV (your mileage may vary).

[Rachelakld]

My thoughts - seeing a few in my city dress the same as you.
When I was younger I would have thought weired, but with more life experiences under my belt, I believe it would just make you look different.
I've also gone out without make up or wig.
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When we hear or see something, we make decissions and interpretations based on our "own life" experiences, not the experiences of those who look one way or another.
So you should be you, and let the world make of it what they want.

[suzanne]

I own neither wig, breastforms, or makeup. So when I go out dressed in a skirt or dress, I am unmistakably, unabashedly, unapologetically a man in a dress. The clothes I wear are carefully chosen to fit right and look good on my large frame, otherwise I don't buy them in the first place. When I shop for clothes, I can be dressed or drab. It makes no difference. I am accepted as I am by the sales staff, often with lots of hugs. And I use the store fitting rooms every time. The sales ladies are honest when they tell me a dress look good or bad on me, and the look I put together is tasteful and age appropriate.

I have been told, and this is my message to you or anyone else, the biggest thing about me is the way I carry myself. I own it with confidence. I hold my head high in a way that says "I'm not some drag queen putting on a show to attract attention. This is just me at my best. If you don't like how I present, don't look. The problem is with you, not me." If that sounds too "In your face", it's not what I'm trying for. I'm just claiming my own space in this world. And I don't go into that world unless my look is as good as it can be.

[Teresa]

Anne,
I have only done the man in a dress thing in the house or garden, when I go out it's all or nothing, to me the in between stage is weirder for people to accept than the whole thing, I'm afraid I have the same comment about facial hair, to me it's a contradiction, you either want to appear female or male otherwise you do give people a confusing message.
Also I would prefer to have a wig before breastforms, you can fill a bra with anything to get the shape but the wig to me is when the guy disappears .

[docrobbysherry]

We all have different comfort zones and personal taste. I know a few CDs who only thro on a dress, or dress and forms before going out.

I do not like looking like a man in a dress in my own mirror or when I go out. But have no choice when I go.

[Vikky]

Hi Anne
I am in a DADT relationship and don’t go out, so the only person who sees me - is me (in a mirror). I think I can look OK – as far as the neck, above the neck I look a bit silly.
I have a couple of wigs, but don’t always bother with them, and never do make up (got a beard anyway).
For me it’s creating the female shape, wearing the femme clothes, and acting feminine. I am happy with that.
Vikky

[AnneForever]

Hi and thanks for all the interesting replies! The reason why I haven't got a wig yet is that I haven't found the right one yet so in the meantime I stumble into dilemmas like these. It's not about money, it's about looks and the right feeling. And, my relationship makes it hard to go all in when I dress, so that's also a reason for why I asked you guys about this. If I were supposed to go all in every time I feel like dressing up, it would limit my chances to be Anne so much that it would be a big problem for me.

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No, I am not asking for "your permission " So your wrong about that. I only wanted some feedback since I am doing this completely on my own, there aren't that big of a CD/TV community where I live. But, I see why you presumed that.

[Tina81]

suzanne,
I admire your attitude and confidence although it's easier said than done; however, I'll hear your voice when I begin to have doubts. There's another member here who goes to work wearing skirts and heels/wedges. And, you're right, it's attitude. Just own it! I think most women would understand that wearing a skirt is more comfortable than shorts in the extreme hot weather we've been having here in the northeast.

[AnneForever]

It's important for me to also point out that I don't wear a dress or skirt when I go out as Anne.

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Suzanne: You're the inspiration, to quote Chicago

[Tracii G]

Its only a difficult threshold if you let it be one.
Have you researched trans or CD groups in your area? To make a blanket statement like that makes me wonder how do you know that?

[AnneForever]

If they're there, at least they are awfully good at keeping a low profile! Which in some cases are understandable.

[Jenniferathome]

... I don't have a wig (yet). But, I do have breastforms, a steadily growing wardrobe and some pairs of shoes for different occasions. What I want some advice on is this: without a wig especially, I am not able to pass at all so therefor I do not make an attempt to hide that I am a man, ... I feel I'm right on a threshold here, not hiding that I'm a man but at the same time having fake breasts which is so 110% female. ...

Allow me to dispel your last presumption Anne. Late breasts on a man are "moobs" and not at all feminine. None of the normals are going to say, "Hey, that's a dude but he has breasts, so I guess he's 50% female." No sir, not going to happen.

With respect to your "passing" notion, its a virtual impossibility to pass as a genetic woman EVEN IF, you have a perfect wig, perfect makeup, perfect clothes, are slightly built, you name it. That stated, a man dressed as a woman WITHOUT hair seeming to belong on a woman will be noticed sooner than otherwise.

It's important for me to also point out that I don't wear a dress or skirt when I go out as Anne....

So you dress as a man but with breasts and makeup? That will be noticed more quickly as well.

Is it that you want to go out and blend in?

[mechamoose]

Correct me if I am wrong, but I hear two issues here.

One is you justifying or explaining your expenditures.

The other is what your mate thinks.

You really downplay the second option, but perhaps that is the bigger issue.

We all have questions about if we pass or not, if we cross or not. All that shrinks in front of your partner's opinion.

You don't have to be pretty or perfect. Heck, you don't even need to be passable. You just need to be YOU.

Is being YOU enough?

Will that be enough for your partner?

THAT is the part you need to work on.

There is no crime here. Person A has betrothed themselves to person B. The rest is negotiations.

}:>

- Kitty / Moose

[Charlessa]

I go out dressed in female clothes looking very much like a man. often have a beard going. it does draw tons more attention but nothing has been said to me. I really don't have a desire to pass. I just like women's clothing

[Tracii G]

OK I take it you haven't researched to see if there is a trans group in your area so you are assuming there isn't one.
Also you assume there aren't that many in your area because you haven't seen any. So what does one look like exactly?
How would you know? You haven't put much effort into looking now have you?
Your difficulties are of your own making so don't blame someone else if things are not as you want them.

[Teresa]

Tracii,
I feel Anne is a little confused as to how she wants to present herself, she hasn't found herself yet and the DADT situation isn't helping. Why do have to go at her like that it's not going to help. She can help herself by sitting down and thinking where she wants her CDing to take her, at the moment I feel she's going to get more negative reaction and possibly put her off attempting to go out again, she came to the forum for help .

[phili]

As a man in a dress, I go out without fear. People understand perfectly, and 99% either don't care, are thoughtful, or warm and friendly. A rare person is afraid or mocking, but my clothing is a message about emotional freedom and liberation from the awful and often cruelly enforced norms that limit the lives of a lot of men and women. As I am at peace, people just can't get too excited about it.

If your desire for feminine feeling and expression is met by your level of dressing, you're done- go out and enjoy it!

[Krisi]

You say you don't have a wig (yet). You know you can go out and buy one today or you can buy one from an Internet vendor and have it in just a few days. I don't see where there's a problem unless you choose to make a problem.

It's your choice to go out in public in a dress and breasts but as a "man in a dress". Since you asked, in my opinion, you would look silly.

You should remember that anyone who knows you will recognize you and this could affect your family and your job. You might want to think about this.

[Tracii G]

Phili has the positive attitude and I applaud that.
Teresa my intention was to point out to Anna she needs to be honest with herself and accept herself first.
If she doesn't do things for herself and take the steps to remedy her situation nothing will change.I just called her out in a tough love kind of way.
It seems being honest and not sugar coating things has gone out of favor in the UK.

[UNDERDRESSER]

I own neither wig, breastforms, or makeup. So when I go out dressed in a skirt or dress, I am unmistakably, unabashedly, unapologetically a man in a dress. The clothes I wear are carefully chosen to fit right and look good on my large frame, otherwise I don't buy them in the first place. When I shop for clothes, I can be dressed or drab. It makes no difference. I am accepted as I am by the sales staff, often with lots of hugs. And I use the store fitting rooms every time. The sales ladies are honest when they tell me a dress look good or bad on me, and the look I put together is tasteful and age appropriate.

I have been told, and this is my message to you or anyone else, the biggest thing about me is the way I carry myself. I own it with confidence. I hold my head high in a way that says "I'm not some drag queen putting on a show to attract attention. This is just me at my best. If you don't like how I present, don't look. The problem is with you, not me." If that sounds too "In your face", it's not what I'm trying for. I'm just claiming my own space in this world. And I don't go into that world unless my look is as good as it can be.

It sounds that you treat it rather like I do. My tops are all (so far) men's stuff, and I do try to take care to make them work with the skirts. I get no hassles anywhere so far. I bought a pinafore style dress in khaki the other day, (at a bible for missions thrift store no less!) the other day, and the lady at the till said she could see me looking good wearing that.

YMMV and all that, but be confident and approachable, and so most issues disappear.