Step One - Don't Lie to your SO

[Kelly DeWinter]

There is a Sticky Thread called "tips to a SO's acceptance link below:

https://www.crossdressers.com/forums...highlight=tips

This could almost be a step program

This thread has 9 great tips for relationships.
I was thinking it would be beneficial to take each one expound on Why you did not follow the advice and where you were in the PAST, where you are in the PRESENT and where expect to be in the FUTURE

Limit your replies to the Topic Don't Lie to your SO and not to the other topics in the Sticky

DON'T lie:
When you tell her, be an open book. Answer her questions when she asks. Tell her that you will answer any question she has and will be honest. This establishes trust.
Don't tell half truths, this will hurt later on down the line and we found this one out the hard way.



PAST - My ex and I split up for other reasons (my health at the time, it took over 10 years to get a proper diagnosis), I now know that we were doomed to separate from the beginning, but that's another story. For me honesty has always been important.

PRESENT - Jeannie and I have a completely honest relationship, I think it also helps that I respect her opinion.

FUTURE - I hope to always value the truth. Since my relationship is based on truth I really do not want to jeopardize that. My biggest concern is I struggle with where I want to be in the future, and as every knows, where you want to be and where your SO wants to be can change.

[docrobbysherry]

Step 2: Walk a mile in someone else's heels. THEN, tell them what to do-------

[sometimes_miss]

Ah, yes, of course. If only I knew then, what I know now.
Edit to comply with Kelly's request.
Past: I had not crossdressed for a decade. I really thought that it was just a phase I had gone through growing up, and that I had beaten it. So, no reason to tell my bride. 5 years after being married, the desire to crossdress returns with a vengeance. Knowing that I had 'beaten it' once before, I'm determined to, once again, but of course, fail. Eventually wife discovers I crossdress, and goes ballistic. We see therapist for several years, things keep getting worse, and she uses my crossdressing as a means to blackmail me for all our marital assets, and insist I take on all the accumulated debt. I'm financially ruined for almost ten years, and sink into depression. Try all the antidepressants, but it seems that as long as you can think, and remember WHY your depressed, you'll still be depressed, as western medicine doesn't believe that you should be allowed to be happy unless you suffer for it first, so they make any medicines that would make you happy, illegal. After divorce, I research everything I can about the dynamics of dating and human mating relationships. I find that we don't actually fall in love with a person; we fall in love with who we think that person is; we create an image in our mind of what we know of them, and fall in love (and lust) with that. If you significantly change the image of yourself in your mate's mind, it can destroy the attraction (and love) that they felt for you, because they now see you as something very different from who they thought you were. AND, THEY THINK YOU LIED TO THEM because they feel deceived, as if what you were doing was intentional, to get something from them (women feel like this whenever they have sex with a guy and he turns out to be not exactly what she was expecting, and they can become quite angry because they feel they were deceived, and they feel like a fool).
I realize that the only way to avoid this, is to tell any prospective mate that I'm a crossdresser. However, that seems to present a huge problem. Every book I read, tells me the same thing: Women aren't attracted to crossdressers. At least, not many. The statistics are always in the same range. Only about 6% of all women consider it acceptable for a man to ever wear woman's clothes. Only 3% will accept someone in their family or friendship who crossdresses. 1.5% MIGHT consider dating a man who crossdresses. And this is under polling situations. While in therapy, while discussing this with the therapist, it turns out that the actual percentages are about half that, because women who either thought that they could deal with it, or perhaps wanted to be perceived as more broad minded, when actually presented with a crossdresser, were only half as likely to be able to accept it as they had previously thought.
That leaves us with a 0.75% of the female population to date. So, if you date, and out yourself to each person you date, you will have to date about 130 women in order to find ONE that will be able to accept a crossdresser. Having read and participated on alt.transgendered newsgroups since 1972, compuserve forums, and here, when you see the number of active members and compare the number of women who are actually said to be quite ok with their husband crossdressing, the numbers of women out there who will really accept it is abysmal. The odds are you'll be more likely to win the powerball lottery. That's how rare those women are. This left me with two options:
1. out myself and live with all the potential problems associated with that, and still have virtually no chance of finding a mate, or
2. Stay in the closet, date, and carefully inquire how my dates feel about crossdressing. I have yet to meet a woman who is really OK with crossdressing.
Present: So I date, and hold back my emotions, as I got tired of falling in love just to have my heart broken when I realized she would never accept me. Instead, I wait, bide my time, and when I find out she will not accept me, I find some way to become unacceptable to her. That way I become just another guy she didn't think was good enough for her, and hopefully no one gets hurt. It does take it's toll on me, but I see no other way. In between dating (I need time off as getting my hopes up and then to have it all come apart still hurts), I get the affection I need (not sex, there IS a difference!) by spending time at gogo bars with lap dancers, and just pay to cuddle up with them for a while. It's expensive, but it keeps me from going crazy.
Future: Continue as above. I really don't foresee finding a woman who is really ok with crossdressing; the odds are simply too great. Sure, I might get lucky, but I can't count on that. I will continue to date, and enjoy the company of women, but know that they will almost all expect to move the relationship forward and when I don't see that happening, I will have to find a way to break it off once again. I've come to the conclusion that I probably will never have another long term female mate. And I'm now OK with that. Don't get me wrong, if someone wonderful comes along that thinks my crossdressing is a fine thing, great. But I'm not going to expect that. No expectations, no disappointments.

Is that better, Kelly?

[Kelly DeWinter]

Try to keep replies in this format. Thanks in advance.

PAST -
PRESENT -
FUTURE -

[Teresa]

Kelly ,
In the past :- When I came out to my wife twenty years ago maybe naively I thought the hiding and associated shame and guilt would be behind me, sadly after a couple of weeks the DADT wall went up , so the chances of being totally open and honest faded .

The present:- After my sessions of counselling we nearly separated but tried to work out a compromise that works for everyone, I guess again that was a naive notion, one good thing to come of that situation is that I now go out socially dressed once a month. The problem is finding out that I need more ,after digging deeper into AGP away from the forum I feel I know why I need far more than going our once a month as a woman .

The future:- Like you I can't make promises I can't keep , if I took the separation route I would be finding a new life possibly dressed full time. Despite being TG rather than TS I want to be seen and accepted as a woman , I know personally it's AGP , others in the same situation have transitioned to satisfy the overwhelming need. For this to happen I would to have to put some distance between me and the family, I know that would hurt me and them.

Going back to your thread title, living the double life inevitably leads to all the truth not being said, it's not lying, it's working with the situation you're faced with. If my wife wanted to know she would ask because she knows now I will tell the truth, I've made that clear .

[Bailee]

PAST - Wasn't honest with the EX, much ugliness ensued. She said it was the dishonesty that was the problem, but what she really had a problem with was dealing with the truth. She did her best to make my life Hell until I had enough. I swore I would never again give someone that kind of power over me.

PRESENT - Was totally honest with my current lady about who I am, and what it means. She's very supportive, and we love to shop together. I try to maintain a balance between dressing and guy time, and take my head out of the "pink fog" now and then. Life is good, but I feel like I'm continuing to heal, and feel like I still have a lot of trust issues.

FUTURE - Hard to answer. I feel I'm on a good path. A big part of this is being ok with who I am, and being honest to myself, and with others. I'm beginning to figure out that a lot of things I once thought were important really don't matter at all, and some of the things I always took for granted are actually what it's all about. It's an interesting journey we're all on!

[Steph_CD_62]

Past - Didn't tell the ex-wife, thought it was in my past. Used lingerie as a teenager to satisfy myself, thought it was in my past. When I re-discovered my love of lingerie when I was married I didn't tell her and she found myself satisfying myself in our back bedroom. Not a good situation, but we worked through it and she accepted on MOST days.

Present - When I met my current wife I told her right away about my love of lingerie, and told her I enjoyed wearing it within a week of meeting her. I knew if our relationship was going to last she needed to know before we got too far into the relationship. Since she has accepted me for who I am, I have started wearing other women's clothing (and recently necklaces) and she is still accepting of me, just not 100% thrilled with it.

Future - Since I don't see myself ever getting a divorce I don't see the future being a problem, but if something happens I will be up front and honest from the beginning because now I realize that my love of wearing women's clothing will never go away.

[Sarasometimes]

Past I agree with Doc, Step 2: Walk a mile in someone else's heels. THEN, tell them what to do-------
Present I agree with Doc, Step 2: Walk a mile in someone else's heels. THEN, tell them what to do-------
Future I agree with Doc, Step 2: Walk a mile in someone else's heels. THEN, tell them what to do-------

[Lana Mae]

Past: Panties 5-6, 13-14, Married 34+ years panties 3-4 times in those 34+ years wife totally disapproved, Happy marriage, two great kids, wife dies, pink fog sets in, a lot of learning takes place , Fully dress a few times! Transformation buy a wig
PRESENT: Happy to be me, both sides, want more of feminine side, daughter does not want to see daddy in a dress but lives in same house, Must set up rules for dressing(sounds like a DA/DT ! LOL)
Future: More Lana Mae time, outings for lunch and shopping better make up skills Another Lady????? Who knows? LOL Hugs Lana Mae

[suzanne]

Past - I didn't tell my wife about my dressing until we had been married about 20 years. Lots of fear on my part and a big struggle with self acceptance. After that, if I tried to talk to her about my needs and feelings, she'd shut down and not say anything good, bad or indifferent. A total Antarctica freezout. Impenetrable. Eventually, I started wearing whatever made me happy. The freezout got even deeper, but I figured she's a grownup and will speak her mind. Nope. During this period her attitude toward me was that she'd rather see me dead than in a dress.

Present- After going to a counselor, where I opened with "I'm a crossdresser" I tried to establish that she could, and must, freely speak her mind andit wouldn't hurt my feelings. She still won't say anything to me. She tells me she still has a problem with my dressing, that she feels she's the bad guy for being unable to move forward. I've said "I am at my very best and happiest when I'm dressed, so if you can't be happy with me can you try to be happy FOR me?" She seems to think that could work. A big first is that my wife went clothes shopping for herself and then showed me everything she bought to get my opinion. She can now look at my outfit and tell me what she thinks of it. I have learned she prefers me in a skirt rather than a dress, and she likes my skirts below the knee, not so much above (where I like them).

Future- I will be honoring her preferences for my clothes by buying and wearing more often those things she has told me she likes. And sometimes not dressing at all (gasp). I will continue to elicit her opinions by asking in a way that leads toward objective answers rather than her feelings on the subject. Example "Does this combination works together?" rather than "Do you like this outfit?" As a pharmacist, she is more comfortable with facts than feelings. I think this is an imperfect solution, but may be the best way forward in our relationship.

[BLUE ORCHID]

Hi Kelly, That usually doesn't end well......

[sweetdreams]

Past - Wife and I married when she was 18 and I was 20. I didn't share because I really didn't understand the CDing at the time very well. Within 6 months of our marriage it came up. It would have been a good time to end the marriage if it was a deal breaker (no kids, no mortgage, short history, etc.). She generally tried to accept it and for the most part did. 20 years later we separated and divorced, but not because of my CDing. In counseling it was a topic of discussion but not what drove us apart. After the divorce I had two GGs I became involved with. I promised myself I would make sure this was in the open prior to any meaningful relationship. The first GF only lasted a few months. I showed up on her doorstep in a dress one Halloween. She was OK with it and played along (put one of her wigs on me). She did not know the full extent of my CDing but I believe she would have been OK with it. Second GF I was very upfront with her once she asked me to move in with her. It ended up being a turn on for her. We had some good times. We lasted a few years and then it ended. My ex had remarried but decided she wanted to be with me. We ended up remarrying and of course she knew everything at that time. We just couldn't stay apart.

Present - wife is well aware of my CDing. It continues to evolve and she is supportive. We are pretty open about it. We have girly talks (stockings, pantyhose, makeup, etc.). Just started shaving my legs a few weeks back. Discussed it with her first. We also discussed her helping with makeup (I've never done it before). Told her I want to see if I can be pretty. I'm not optimistic but want to give it a try. She's on board with helping.

Future - not sure. If I can find a presentable version of me that won't make babies cry, I'd like to go out in public. Maybe a support group or I'm really thinking about next Halloween as an opportunity. We'll see. This will be a new challenge for the wife. She is very protective of both of us when it comes to sharing this with the world. We'll have to talk about this and see what is possible.

[Karu]

Some great stories here. Moral of they story seems to be: Be honest to your SO and to yourself.
I recently came out to my wife (married 5 years), and she was more upset that I didn't trust her enough to tell her from the start. We are closer than we ever have been since the announcement of 'Karu'.

[Becky Blue]

Good thread - this may buck the trend a bit
Past - Decided not to tell my wife much for a range of reasons. Almost did when my feelings were at their peak. But due to an unrelated reason I waited and then Becky left me for over 3 years. I often wonder what would have happened if i had told her and then lost Becky.

Present - Becky has returned to me, although she still goes away for short spells. We have a very happy marriage and I can still see no reason to tell her as I do not know what i would tell her. I will say that she does know a little bit.

Future - Impossible to predict, not saying I won't tell her one day, but circumstances will have changed from what they are now. I have no intention of hurting my wife unless I need to.

[kimdl93]

Past: In my case, I revealed what I thought was true very early in our relationship. But the challenge for me, and perhaps others as well, is knowing what the truth really is, and how that perception can be shaped over time.

I'm afraid I misled myself and by striving for openness, I grasped at accessible explanations and erroneous interpretations.

Present: I am revisiting my truth, or in other words, I will no trust gut instinct, emotions or my heart, knowing that feels are most likely wrong.

Future: Before I share any ideas about who I am and how cross dressing fits in my life I will need a lot more confidence that I have clear thoughts, free of presumptions, misleading memories, and subject to critical questioning. There's no substitute for testing, challenging and, arriving at the truth, based on thoughtful analysis of the best information we can assemble. Even then, today's truth may turn out to be tomorrow's illusion.

[Kelly DeWinter]

.... try to keep replies in this format. It's a great way to see where someone has been, where they are and where they want to be in relation to a topic. Just copy and paste whats below then reply.

PAST -
PRESENT -
FUTURE -

[NicoleScott]

Past - like many others, I married believing the sexual desire for my bride would replace the sexual excitement crossdressing brought me. Of course I was wrong, and eventually she busted and divorced me. For those who like TRUTH, here's one: some women cannot, will not, be married to a crossdressing husband. I remarried. She was reading a magazine article with a crossdressing character in it, and asked me what I thought. "Harmless fun" I answered. That started a conversation. Eventually, she asked: did you ever? (yes) did you like it? (yes) do you want to again? (yes).......SO DO IT!! The next day we were ordering a wig and high heels online and went shopping locally for clothes.
Present - I love to transform in the style of everything over the top, and she's supportive. Actually, rather indifferent. Doesn't participate. She knows I enjoy it and she isn't threatened by it. We agree that my crossdressing is private and kept between the two of us. Only child, now 21, doesn't know.
Future - crossdressing has always been exciting, and while it still is, as I age that excitement will wane. But it's still an interest and I believe I will always be interested in online browsing for wigs, high heels, and clothing, reading about other crossdresser's thoughts and experiences, and enjoy viewing pics of CDers (including my own). Our marriage is solid. If crossdressing would cause problems in our marriage, it would have already.

[~Joanne~]

DON'T lie:
When you tell her, be an open book.

Ok, this alone could be considered a Lie. The whole time that you haven't told her is viewed as a lie around these parts even though a lot of us have valid reasons (at least to us) as to why she hasn't been told from the get go. I will agree that IF your telling her, then yes, You should be truthful and put it all on the table. There can't be any half "reveals" in this department unless of coarse you honestly don't know the full extent of what this means to you or where it may possibly lead to.

I think that a lot of people here take for granted that starting as a CD is going to lead to being transgendered automatically and that living as a full time woman is the road that this all leads and that is the wrong assumption. A lot of us are just happy being plain ole CD's and don't plan on it going any further than that.

I know this sounds scary because people want us to fly a banner for their cause when their cause isn't ours but for some of us it's strictly about the clothing and look. I feel at ease, relaxed, and very comfortable when I am fully dressed (or even partially dressed) but never do I think, oh lord I am going to become a woman. I think the "pushing" that tends to take place here hurts us more than it helps us especially when you just don't know sometimes what all of this means.

I also agree with Doc, "Step 2: Walk a mile in someone else's heels. THEN, tell them what to do-------" seems like pretty sound advice we ignore a lot around here.

[Tina_gm]

Past-ex wife didn't and still does not know. Current wife did not know, was not told until 6 months into marriage. The next few months were especially for her times of great uncertainty. My wife, for whatever reasons is not one who seeks knowledge. That does not mean to imply stupidity, far from it. But, my God, she is the least curious person I've ever known, male or female. In time, a basic somewhat secure feeling did resume, anger of not being told up front ( real big deal) lessened a bit. (Still has flare ups occasionally) and our life just rolled onot.

Present- life has been busier than before which I've typically been a busy person as is she. Late last year I began questioning my future in terms of gender and my identity. Over time, my acceptance of myself has shown me my femininity is deeper than I originally thought.

I hid none of this from my wife. Eventually I realized transition isn't a likely path for me. But, the process of realizing the depth of my femininity, the questioning of my gender identity has created new insecurity for my wife. Other than the gender aspect, our life is better than ever. Darn that asterisk....

The future- only as I can see it now, I am hopeful my wife will become more secure. Dressing whenever however is not likely in the cards so long as her and I are together. This is a compromise I know I will always likely make being together with her. She hopefully will continue to be ok giving me time to dress, which she is very good about. My big hope for the future is to deflate the pink elephant of it all. I'm pretty much without any real hesitation as far as my personality goes, mannerisms etc etc. Hopefully this continues and without her insecurities that it is leading to me becoming a woman. She asked me once not all that long ago if I could promise that that would not happen. I said no, I could not truly promise anything, just like I'm never making promises never to drink again. I can only say for transition that I don't intend to. I don't see it in my future with or without her. But I also didn't see the depth of my femininity at the time I told her of crossdressing either. So, no promises other then to be truthful regardless of how it impacts our marriage.

[Swimtran]

PAST: total secrecy. I didn't want anyone to know, least of all my wife. Meanwhile I would periodically borrow some of her things when she wasn't around, even though I had my own stash most of the time. She never asked, so I never told. I was terrified that if she ever found out, she couldn't love me anymore.

PRESENT: DADT. She found out by accident 6 months ago, and it was painful for her. She had absolutely no idea. She was particularly upset that I hadn't told her, and felt cheated into making a choice of mate when she didn't have all the pertinent information. She asked a lot of questions. I answered as best I could. She's still very confused and conflicted about it. She tries not to think about it. She has told me she wishes she never found out, and could continue to live in blissful ignorance of this habit of mine. She asked me to stop doing it, and I told her that's impossible. I saw a therapist at her request, who confirmed my assessment of the situation, and recommended couples therapy. She spoke to the therapist, too, to clarify it. Ever since then, she doesn't ask any questions, and I don't tell her anything about it. I have started to build up a new stash, because otherwise I find myself pilfering her things, and I can't just stop. I haven't told her, and I feel terrible about it. I don't want to break her heart again, but here I am sneaking around again. Meanwhile, we're very happy together, we just don't talk about this at all.

FUTURE: This comes up again, but it's not as much of a shock. She can handle it better (I just paid for a kitchen remodel, that should help, right?). She still doesn't like it, but she loves me enough, and realizes it, so she won't leave me or resent me. I don't provoke her by dressing in front of her, but she knows I do it, and knows I have some feminine stuff in my dresser, and tolerates it.