So, it occurred to me today that it seems like there are many more M2F folks out there than the other way around. I may be wrong about this speculation, and if so, I apologize. But assuming for a second I'm correct, why do you think that is? Is it because women can already exhibit male behavior, particularly dress, without an issue and often it's considered stylish? Something else? What are your thoughts?
Staphanie,
I would say because it's more a sexual thing in men , the clothes tend to be more of a turn on, in a woman clothes may be worn to turn us on. Basically we are the ones that naturally have to be sexually aroused .
A TS was telling me that in a clinic in Manchester there were now more F/M than M/F . Who wants to be a guy , they're not missing anything ?
Teresa is on to something. Men a re turned on by almost anything that reminds them of the female form, including their sensual, stretchy, silky clothing and photogenic shoes. Guy clothes seem drab. Why women would want to look like guys, baffles me, unless they are more masculine in mind.
There are so many here that say it's not sexual for them, I'm not convinced that the turn-on explanation works.
(But it is a turn-on for me).
Why are there more right-handed people than lefties?
It would appear to me that there are less of us than them. The numbers of transmen is mind staggering. But they don't make headlines like we do, that's all.
Genny B
Dani (Genny before Transition)
All Girl!
As I am starting to get out a bit and slowly meeting people, I have met met more women that identity as trans then men. I believe it is normal for others to assume that they are gay in the same way as people often assume a male cder is gay. I don't personally know any male currently going through transition ( though do know one that has) but know two females that have started and one other that is waiting to come of legal age. I guess once transitioned you wouldn't know and after all the pain and trouble to go through the process wouldn't want to identify as exfemale. Why would you.
Stephanie. I believe there are many more f to M's than m to f's. I see many women wearing guys clothes every day. The answer to that baffles me. Why on earth would anyone want to wear male clothes.
Wearing women's clothing, now that I understand. Women's clothing feels better, it looks better.
When you look at history... Guys were the first to wear tights. Guys were the first to wear lace shirts. Guys were the first to have pierced ears. May be we are early explorers to the next generation where men dress in what today is considered feminine clothing.
What ever the answer is, I am glad that I am me. A cross dressing male.
I believe among younger trans people there are more FTM than MTF. This is my opinion and I'm just guessing. Like some of us they believe they are the opposite of their biological gender and just want to be their true self. We are all in the same boat but some are on the starboard side and want to be on the port side and visa versa.
I enjoy being a boy, being a GIRL like me!!!
We always get in trouble when we assume things.
Cheryl we have had many threads here on men wearing ruffles,powdered wigs.lace shirts,tights, shoes with heels all that. They did because that because i was the accepted style in that day. None of that was womens clothes.
Last edited by Tracii G; 09-27-2017 at 09:42 PM.
The official population studies say there are more transmen than transwomen. You probably don't see them here because this forum is specifically male-to-female crossdressing and the site overall seems to have a strong MtF component.
Interestingly, I'm reading a book right now that summarizes transgender research up to 2015 and they have eliminated some of the old favorite mechanisms we like to speculate on. For example, they have ruled out sex/fetish as a cause of transgenderism because the sexual aspect dissipates with exposure, but the TG aspects remain. When I finish the book I'll try to summarize it in a new thread. The current favorite as a theory is that it is a two-step combination of genetics and epigenetics that happens during gestation (i.e. there is an external factor combined with a genetic disposition.) If true, then our pitch that we are born this way will be confirmed.
I am not a woman; I don't want to be a woman; I don't want to be mistaken for a woman.
I am not a man; I don't want to be a man; I don't want to be mistaken for a man.
I am a transgender person. And I'm still figuring out what that means.
Well it depends if you are talking TS or crossdressing, not the same thing, not the same numbers. I think this topic has been raised her at least once or twice.
Depending on which research (and conclusion) you ascribe to, there are many different theories. I tend to believe that, first off, males displaying feminine characteristics are more discouraged than the converse. This lack of acceptance can do a couple of things. Lead to repression, or act as a neutral zone barrier. No one cares if a girl is a tomboy, in fact it is often rewarded. But the other way is not. Maybe those feminine characteristics remain hidden until they overwhelm the individual and they jump the barrier. Kind of like electron hole theory.
Girls can be kind of, guy is or aint. Maybe. Plus it's a woman's prerogative to change her mind. Guys are stuck with their stupid decisions
Umm, I see multiple studies showing M2F'ers are 2 or even 3 times more likely than F2M'ers (and sometimes even higher).Originally Posted by Pat (aka Jennie)
At "best," every now & then a study will show it kinda-sorta approaching a 1:1 parity when its survey questions are pretty vague re: how they feel about their gender...
I recommend some of the threads by FtM folks on this site. It's remarkable that they have the same paranoia that we see from MtF folks -- fear about going into the men's section of a store; fear of buying male clothing because they're convinced people will know it's for them; fear of coming out to parents or SO's, etc. And if being "a Tomboy" is rewarded, how are we to interpret the transmen who are assaulted or killed? Not as frequently as transwomen of color, but still it happens. Transmen have done jail time for wearing men's clothes. This is no picnic for either type of trans person and the meme of transmen having it easier is rather upsetting in an age where information is so easy to find if you look for it.
I am not a woman; I don't want to be a woman; I don't want to be mistaken for a woman.
I am not a man; I don't want to be a man; I don't want to be mistaken for a man.
I am a transgender person. And I'm still figuring out what that means.
Studies I have seen tend to reflect what you are saying. Also in going to group therapy meetings which include both transmen and transwomen, the numbers appear to be fairly equal.
Darn. Hoist by my own petard. I was working from old sources. The very same book that I mentioned I was currently reading that summarizes information up through 2015 says:
The remark about "Conway and the engineers" just references a population frequency study technique that was used to get a rate for MtF transgender folks that the author felt was more accurate than the classic method which uses numbers of people seeking clinical help. So the latest story is that there are more MtF than FtM and I apologize for the disinformation.Studies of the population frequencies of FTM TG follow a similar pattern to those of MTF TS except that the frequencies are consistently lower and there is no research contribution from Conway and the engineers. The frequencies are at least half those of the MTF studies but over the years, the frequencies are trending upwards.
Bevan, Thomas. The Psychobiology of Transsexualism and Transgenderism: A New View Based on Scientific Evidence: A New View Based on Scientific Evidence (p. 54). ABC-CLIO. Kindle Edition.
I am not a woman; I don't want to be a woman; I don't want to be mistaken for a woman.
I am not a man; I don't want to be a man; I don't want to be mistaken for a man.
I am a transgender person. And I'm still figuring out what that means.
Everyone knows girls have more fun.
Of course I want to be a girl. Still do.
There resides within me a Woman, and she is powerful.
She has been my Grace and Bearing on the stormiest seas.
I could no more deny Her than I would my own soul.
According to some figures they are actually about equal. And there may be a trend to more women transitioning to being men than men becoming women. Problem is, any data is really based on those who actually transition and not the part-timers like most of us who don't transition. No good data from that group. So, any conclusions are necessarily biased because of sampling bias. Not much you can do about it. I think the sexual aspect for males who emulate women is a big factor in creating an erroneous picture. I have known two transmen and neither of them ever experienced the sexual component that men experience when they were feminine/female. For them it was an intense internal need as it is for transwomen. Sex had nothing to do with it and even among the transwomen I have known (quite a few more of those) sex is a minor component. Sex seems to be more of a factor in identity shifts among part-timers. That may be an important distinction that gets somewhat lost in the rhetoric.
This is the important point that the OP didn't specify. As far as crossdressers go, historically there have been far more MtF and I believe it's because of the sexual aspect. While it's true that most CDs on this site claim there's no sexual thrill in dressing, it seems most started out that way during adolescence. Those feelings don't completely go away and it's a strong force.
As far as transsexualism goes, there seems to be an increase FtM TS and those numbers are probably higher than MtF now days.
"You're the only one to see the changes you take yourself through", Stevie Wonder
could it be that FTM don't feel the need for an on line community on which to discuss their clothing choices/gender presentation?
Maybe we're forgetting something. Go to a crowded mall and you'll notice that most females are wearing female versions of traditionally male clothing. Pants and shirts and athletic shoes.
Their crossdressing is just normal and accepted.
I've waited so long for this time. Makeup is so frustrating. Shaking hands and I look so old. This was a mistake.
My new maid's outfit is cute. Sure fits tight.
And then I step into the bedroom and in the mirror, I see a beautiful woman looking back at me.
Smile, Honey! You look fabulous!
I agree.Well it depends if you are talking TS or crossdressing, not the same thing, not the same numbers. I think this topic has been raised her at least once or twice.
Depending on which research (and conclusion) you ascribe to, there are many different theories. I tend to believe that, first off, males displaying feminine characteristics are more discouraged than the converse. This lack of acceptance can do a couple of things. Lead to repression, or act as a neutral zone barrier. No one cares if a girl is a tomboy, in fact it is often rewarded. But the other way is not. Maybe those feminine characteristics remain hidden until they overwhelm the individual and they jump the barrier. Kind of like electron hole theory.
Girls can be kind of, guy is or aint. Maybe. Plus it's a woman's prerogative to change her mind. Guys are stuck with their stupid decisions
Female CDs are all around us.
One more thing .
For SRS......it is medically easier to go from M to F than from F to M... as far as functionality and appearance.
I don't know about the numbers but, I have met a few F2M , if they don't tell you who they are you could not pick them out of a crowd. They have the same problems with acceptance from family, friends, and the public as we do.
Hiya
Well though not officially recognising that they have adopted Crossdressing, most women crossdress as most women today wear trouser suits, slacks, jeans, shorts(Hot Pants) and so on, some even go as far as to have short cut hair does, so yep I think they know what they are doing and no one bats an eye lid. A Crossdresser after doning the skirt or dress and gave make up a fair shot, will either luckily not be clocked, whilst unluckier ones will. seems women have it for now. That said Men are now buying skirts due to an increase in Male skirts. So hey the tables have started to turn, even though this is in New York mainly at the moment.
First off, Pat, thank you for your observation on FTM TS experience of personal acceptance and relational difficulties.
I stick by my comment for the general population however, as an impetus to cross dressing. I do not think that women wearing slacks are crossdressers, and women crossdressers are in fact far rarer than male crossdressers. But because of more acceptance of masculine (sterotypical) behavior in females than the converse reduces the NEED for females to crossdress for them to celebrate that expression vs the male to female experience.
That's the same thing women think about us to be honest. They are always baffled as to why we would want to wear heels and hosiery, dresses? maybe a bit more understanding about the freedom a dress provides. It's a hard question to answer, probably the one that comes right after "why?".
Flip Flops were made for Beaches & Bath Houses, We have neither in 2017. Lose the flip flops!
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