For me, at 5 ft 7 and 81Kg,
I'm to old to worry about passing, or spending more than 5 minutes doing make up.
so my give aways
- Voice
- My square chin and 5 o'clock shadow
- My workouts at the gym and pools to build a strong, fit and lean body
For me, at 5 ft 7 and 81Kg,
I'm to old to worry about passing, or spending more than 5 minutes doing make up.
so my give aways
- Voice
- My square chin and 5 o'clock shadow
- My workouts at the gym and pools to build a strong, fit and lean body
See all my photos, read many stories of my outings and my early days at
http://rachelsauckland.blogspot.co.nz
Right, but on closer inspection it becomes clear that they ARE women. It works in the reverse of that for us; the closer inspection reveals that we aren't womenOriginally Posted by Sometimes Steffi
I'm not out, so this is coming from someone who works with the public and needs to see who people really are in a very quick observation. The initial 'tell' will be either visual or sound. Voice is almost always the confirmation; even those CD or TS were still male when puberty hit, so their voices are not typical female about 99% of the time. Sure, there are some of us with Lauren Bacall lower register female voices, but those tick off people's radar to look for other clues to tell them what we are. Of course, if you look like Lauren did, then the inspection will almost instantly bring back the result of 'that person is female'. With us, that becomes either that person is male, or that person used to be male.I think my voice and comportment are my biggest "tells".
It only takes ONE tell, to begin someone's further inspection of us to turn up other clues that we aren't GG's.
In my experience, the first is usually how someone walks, because we see it at a distance. CD & TS often just overdo the female gait by just enough to draw extra attention to themselves just the way that a woman who puts a little extra swing in her hips, does. Now you might like to think, 'Oh, that means I'm passing!'. Nope. What you're doing is just drawing attention to yourself. THEN we start to look you over more carefully, for more clues as to who and what you are. A GG will give off plenty more clues that she is the genuine article. We don't. Sure, some of us will be able to pass the test in lots of other ways, but eventually something sticks out (pun intended) such as Adam's apple, forehead brow bone, bony knees, muscle definition, large/rough hands/feet (especially finger nails), hair where it usually isn't found on the 'model year' of woman that we're trying to portray (beard or overly covering a beard tone of skin are both give aways). And we collect all those bits of information in an instant. Then when the voice comes out, we're clocked.
That's how I spot one of us when they walk into the place I work. And it usually only takes a few seconds.
>99% of us will not pass in those first few seconds. Most of the other 1% will not either, under close inspection. We desperately want to believe that we pass. We come up with all sorts of rationals that support that idea. It's easy to get fooled by looking at 2D images where someone gets to put forth their best possible 'look', but put that person into real life up close, and the illusion disappears, just like the material called illusion that they use on ice skater costumes becomes very obvious that it's not the girl's actual skin.
That said, I wouldn't pass during a power failure in a coal mine at midnight, at 500 yards away.
Some causes of crossdressing you've probably never even considered: My TG biography at:http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...=1#post1490560
There's an addendum at post # 82 on that thread, too. It's about a ten minute read.
Why don't we understand our desire to dress, behave and feel like a girl? Because from childhood, boys are told that the worst possible thing we can be, is a sissy. This feeling is so ingrained into our psyche, that we will suppress any thoughts that connect us to being or wanting to be feminine, even to the point of creating separate personalities to assign those female feelings into.
Seriously? Perhaps some of us have a distorted view of women, but in my observation, 99.9% of women "pass as women". Perhaps they wouldn't be cast on a TV show as a women but they are clearly female.I don't know about India, but I find a lot of GGs walking around who don't pass as women.
Back on topic, some men can pass as women. The term "passing" is a moving target. Walking down the sidewalk 50 feet away? Many of us could pass. 20 feet away? Some of us could pass. Sitting in a restaurant at the next table for 30 minutes? Few of us could pass. Yet, there are men who will dress up as women, go to bars and fool men into buying them drinks and even having sex with them for money. So some men can pass pretty well.
You have to look ate yourself. If you are petite and work hard on the presentation, you have a chance. If you are built like Hulk Hogan in drag, not a chance.
Krisi
I find that it's usually the face that gives us away. You sound confident and look pretty good, but at the angle you took your picture I can see your rather strong jaw line and it screams "I am a man".
It takes a lot of hair and make-up work to hide a man face.
The next thing I think is failure to balance our figure. Male shoulders are bigger and usually wider than their hips, women are just the opposite, GG shoulders are small and rounded and their hips are usually as wide or wider than their shoulders. I see a lot of us on here that do not pad their hips or butt and even talk about wearing a skirt two or more sizes smaller than their top. They look too broad shouldered and top heavy (specially if large breast forms are added), that is also a major give away.
Last edited by Robertacd; 04-20-2018 at 08:39 AM.
Yeah, this is the reality of the situation when one has a larger stature. I'm 6'2" tall, with wide shoulders, larger sized hands and have a deep voice. I did play football when in high school and was a defensive end, so there's no way somebody like me is going to pass. In the past, I have gone out to CD events and to places that were accepting for folks like us (gay and lesbian bars), but to just go to the mall or another public place like that while en-femme is out of the question for me, I won't pass and don't have the confidence to pull it off.
I get my height from my mom's side of the family. My mom was 6'2", but she was slender and a real beauty! Although I resemble her, I'm the guy version.
Last edited by Pat; 04-20-2018 at 12:11 PM. Reason: Trimmed quote to what seemed relevant. Please don't quote entire posts.
Lexi, your assessment is spot on! Brutally honest and accurate! I am out..occasionally..and though you may see a GG in some of my photos..and I do have a good female voice..up close under scrutiny?? BUSTED!!
Last edited by Pat; 04-20-2018 at 12:09 PM. Reason: Please don't quote entire posts.
Say what??? How did "they" succeed in "...trying to make larger, non-conforming women invisible..."? Did this involve the assistance of the likes of a David Copperfield, or else a Star Trek-like cloaking device? Point is...there were far fewer of them around in those days compared to now...period.What?Perhaps you mean when they were trying to make larger, non-conforming women invisible? I'm pretty sure non-petite women are not a recent invention.
Steffi is absolutely right. There is an epidemic of obesity going on these days in the Western World because of our addiction to empty-calorie junk food, and it affects both sexes. Did you ever notice when watching actual, real life historical documentaries from, say, WWII, how fit and trim the soldiers on both sides were back then compared to the more beefy current crop? And as for the typical out-of-shape, beer-bellied cops that are so common these days, let's not even go there...
Yes, women as a group are also far heftier than they used to be in the 1950's and earlier, as anyone who has ever walked through a shopping mall can attest to unless, of course, they are being guided by a seeing-eye dog. The average dress size for a woman these days is 14, whereas in the past, it was typically in the single digits. Genetics are also a factor here, and the younger women these days tend to be taller overall than their forebears. Size 10 used to be the normal upper limit for women's shoe sizes in "regular" stores. That has now moved up a notch to Size 11, and Size 12 is also now far more commonplace than it used to be.
So, if you combine the fact that women as a group are far larger than they used to be (both height and weight) and that they are gravitating more and more towards man-style and/or "unisex" type clothing, then yes, the lines between masculine-looking women and feminine- or androgynous-looking males are definitely becoming more blurred these day. That leaves us with facial features and mannerisms as being the final frontiers for us to cross in trying to either blend in or "pass" as women. Here, good makeup is definitely our friend, as are the many YouTube videos on female comportment that are well worth watching for pointers on how to emulate typical female mannerisms that we might otherwise have missed.
All that said, when it comes to "passing", our Asian sisters definitely have an edge over the rest of us with their typically smaller features, shorter statures, and general overall hairlessness. I'm not going to name any names here - you know who they are - but some of our fellow Asian Forum members here are absolute stunners. And if anyone really wants to make their own eyes bug out, all they need to do is watch one of the many YouTube videos featuring crossdressing K-Pop singing and dancing groups which seem to be all the rage there these days.
Talk about "making the boys cry", as our own michelledgg likes to put it.
People all over the world seem to be taller these days too and a bit stockier.
I have a close Chinese friend and he is 6'1" so Asians aren't always short in stature.
Judy, I humbly disagree. Based on the photo you've chosen for your avatar, I'd say you are being a wee bit hard on yourself. I think you look totally realistic and feminine.
I probably have as many tells as anyone...height, and masculine in shoulders, hands, facial structure throat. I dont even think about passing.
But i do know from trustworthy sources that im not grossly conspicuous either. When directly interacting with anyone, im sure i am considered a transwoman. From a distance no one can be sure.
Also Im not the tallest woman out there and in a country suffering an obesity epidemic, i have managed to stay fit...so some curves are in the right places.
And that’s good enough for me. I am.
To pass '100 per cent'?, almost impossible. Even if you look great something will give you away, your voice, big hands, adam's apple, any one of several things. Except for a really tiny minority, anyone who believes they pass completely is utterly self deluded.
Here today, gone tomorrow....
Passing in a photo is much easier than passing in 3-D reality. The OP is talking bout passing in the real world. I've met transgenders that are very passable up close, in person, but not many. I haven't met Judy-Something but being 5'10" per se isn't a deal breaker. I'm sure Judy knows her limitations.
Chloe, once you get your 10 posts you'll have access to many great photos of the members here! So many gorgeous photos and some that you will swear will be passable up close.
"You're the only one to see the changes you take yourself through", Stevie Wonder
Well I was just chatting with a guy on Facebook and he was telling how beautiful I look and how he wants to meet me, etc,etc. Then says " can I ask you something?" Why are so many crossdressers on your page? LOL! I answer because I'm one too! He still doesn't believe me. Then asks if I have man parts. Then he doesn't believe that I do and starts apologizing for saying something wrong thinking I'm making all this up so he goes away! Finally he says he doesn't care if I have one he loves me! OMG! From a 5 minute chat?
So yes pictures can definitely be deceiving.
Wow, poor guy. I would guess he has considerable difficulties in developing real world relationships.
Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one.
Eleanor Roosevelt
Natalie middle eastern men hit me up all the time and I tell them and its like no no no you are a woman I know you are.
I think they are just really hard up LOL.
Passing in pics is a piece of cake but in real life not so much.
Taylor,
I've realised looking for that Utopia is never going to happen there are numerous reasons why we don't pass, the important thing is stop looking for it and just be you . Your choice of clothes may or may not be suiatble for your intended trip , going OTT or out of context gives the game away as much as the male attributes you hopefully think you're hiding .
The saying is, " you can fool some of the people some of the time but not all of the people all of the time ! " The point is don't go out and try and fool them , it's not an act , you will get far more acceptance by being dressed appropriately and polite to people .
The desperation is ridiculous. And the pics they send lol. If mine looked all deformed like that I'd remove it myself!
Oh I get those pics too Natalie.LOL
I was going to comment on this but sometimes miss said it all perfectly.
OK. I was not going to bite but I will anyway. In my opinion it is always harder to pass when you are younger and the male hormones are at their strongest. Unless you are genetically gifted with a slight image and soft features like many Asian girls here and on the internet seem to be it simply is hard. However, for us older girls it gets easier with age. Simply because as the male hormones wane in men the estrogen in women is doing the same thing and we are meeting in the middle. Women's voice can get deeper and features get a little more masculine while men can get a bit softer looking. Being 69, I am observing women my age and even a bit younger and I am amazed how much easier it is for me to be out and about without raising an eyebrow. In my 30's I was blessed with nice skin and a diminuitive size so I just had to hide my biceps and enhance my makeup skills to pass. Now I can pretty much show it all without to much worry. Even getting older has it's benefits. In India I would still be very leary to test social norms there.
Last edited by Stephanie Julianna; 04-21-2018 at 04:31 PM.
I told him if he wasn't masturbating to a computer screen all day long maybe he could meet someone.
Lol. Great answer, and undoubtably true!
Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one.
Eleanor Roosevelt
Good point Natalie.
Got a .dick pic last night by a guy from the Ukraine and I asked him what that was a pic of?
He said must be a language barrier LOLOL.
Stephanie,
Does it get easier or do we just stop caring what people think ?
I have the age battle sometimes , am I getting too old for all this then the makeup goes on and it's a resounding no , the lifestyle is so much more enjoyable and fun . The last thing I would want to do is look through the male racks in clothes stores but I don't think I shall ever tire of checking out the female ones . To hold a dress against yourself and check it out in the strore mirror without anyone batting an eyelid is wonderful . Going back to the question of passing , it's moments like that when it feels 100% .
I'm not sure if we really have to pass as long as we appear friendly. A nice smile seems to go along way and others tend to reciprocate. Those that don't, I ignore!
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