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Thread: Let's dress while it still means something!

  1. #1
    Senior Member phili's Avatar
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    Let's dress while it still means something!

    We're in London for two weeks and I have been out among hordes of people all day- thousands of locals and tourists from around the world. My observation here is that >95% women now wear pants, or some version of leggings, and distinguish themselves from men with feminine cut pants and blouses, hair styles and shoes. Dresses and skirts are so few and far between- barely 5%- that it looks like a vanishing style.

    Of those in skirts or dresses, 99 % with black tights and very ordinary dresses- plain and not particularly feminine or fetching. in 2 weeks, I've only seen 5/5000 women dressed like I would like to be.

    I also notice no one is really paying any attention to each other. I saw a few MIADs, and they drew no more or less attention that anyone else in the mass of people. I saw a few good passing CDs, middle aged, but again, just part of the cast of characters in the world.

    This is what I experience in San Francisco, too, and I am sure it is true in most big cities. It is also what I experience in my own suburb. I think people mostly just are concerned with so many things about staying alive and trying to get by that what others are wearing just doesn't rate much attention.

    The good news is that we can go out and dress as we please, and it will be ordinary. I totally enjoy the pleasures of wearing women's clothes out in the world, and getting no reaction is just fine with me. It is the embodiment of the world I want- that people who like dresses can wear dresses and those that don't really like to don't care. There are already women in dresses who are more masculine or feminine, so being detectable as a man really is nothing new either.

    My experience is that seeing MIADs and anyone mixing gender requires just a slightly longer process of classification as man or woman, or trans^something, and then people know what they most commonly want to know. If you are not seeking a mate, it really has no consequence, anyway!

    The bad news is that the frivolity and flirtiness and feature-rich look of dresses is fast disappearing as women take steps to eliminate the dress codes that disempowered them in various ways. Women don't want to attract sexual attention because it is a lot less safe than we all thought. Granted, there is still a desire to enjoy dresses for shopping and lunch days out, or dinner parties, [and clubbing for sure] so our desire to wear dresses is at least going to be recognizable for a while.

    I feel it is hilarious and tragic that I am inevitably going to be perceived as a relic in outdated fashions! II am deliriously happy that for the most part no one will care, so I can still enjoy my dresses. But now I know I'm trying to cross over a bridge that no longer exists for most people.

    The contrast between men's and women/s styles is significantly less now, and shrinking, and the upbringing of boys and girls is moderating along with it.

    I expect now that the less the contrast between the lives of men and women, the less we are going to be seeing crossdressing arise in children.

    Do you see these trends?
    We are all beautiful...!

  2. #2
    Senior Member Asew's Avatar
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    I feel like you have made this observation before. In some ways, women are shying away from the dresses and housewife image. But their clothes are still different then men's clothes. And both genders have significantly simplified their clothes for easy and functional, not as many men wearing suits either. As a man I am not complaining since I would hate to have to wear a suit every day for work. As someone who enjoy's women's clothes, it makes me feel dated that I like skirts and heels where these are becoming a little more scarce over time (but like you said they won't be gone anytime soon, just less prevalent).

    And it is weird how kids toys are becoming more gendered. This article about kids toys shows how previously toys were mainly marketed for kids, now nearly all toys are marketed for a boy or a girl. And even if it isn't the society generating that marketing, it sure does shape our society. But this is the only example I can think of that is becoming more gendered.

    I think we will see more CDing in children. It will be more socially acceptable and I feel that similar percentage of people will have a desire to crossdress. Which means a greater percentage won't be in the closet so they will be more visible. I think they will be a lot more non-binary people who pick and choose what they like rather than being confined to two genders. But you might see a decline in CDing in skirts and dresses, and more CDing with leggings and cute tops since that reflects the direction the average female wears. Just like how already they is a huge decline in pantyhose in both young females and young CDers.

  3. #3
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    Dressing and presenting yourself the way you want is dressing when it means something. The only person you need to satisfy is yourself.

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    Seems the CDs are the ones wearing the skirts and dresses these days so they are easy to pick out of a crowd.

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    Welcome to my side of the pond, Phili, I hope you enjoy your stay! Did they inform you at the border control that it is frowned upon to make eye contact with strangers in the streets here? Much more to actually pay attention to what they are wearing! I am of course joking, well only a little... I will tell you what one of my guilty pleasures is, to do when I am in the City, our version of Wall Street. If the weather is co-operating (so not that often), I like to order a cup of coffee, sit outside and watch the men going about their business. Sharp, well-tailored three piece suits with bright ties and classy leather shoes always make my day. If I can't do that anymore, it will be a sad day indeed! So hoping that gender dressing lasts just a little longer, for my own selfish reasons

  6. #6
    I accept myself as is Gillian Gigs's Avatar
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    In my end of Canada I usually only see skirts in the summer time. The only time you see women in dresses is for the more special outings of dressing up or the more than casual times.
    I like myself, regardless of the packaging that I may come in! It's what is on the inside of the package that counts!

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    Hi

    So I was inspired after reading this post ... I was standing at the subway stop, waiting for a train home and decided to count the number of women and the number wearing either skirts or dresses. In my immediate area there were 8 people that I could chalk up as women - (whether GGs, T, CD, ... I don't know and wasn't about to ask!). Two of them (25%) were wearing a dress or a skirt.
    To count I had to be able to tell if the person was more or less a woman and determine whether she was wearing a skirt/dress or pants/jeans/leggings -- this narrowed the field a lot since this was in a subway station, lighting wasn't all that good, and it was crowded, hard to see a lot of people well enough.

    Just so ya know, I work in the technology industry where the standard uniform is definitely informal - jeans and informal tops (tshirts, polos, sweatshirts/hoodies, etc) pretty much for everyone. So to get 25% in this environment seems pretty encouraging to me.

    I'll keep the survey up for the next week or two & let you all know how it goes :-)

    This morning, October third, on the subway heading in towards the city, in my little section of the car there were 11 women, 6 in a skirt or dress (1 was a hijab, which I counted as a dress).thats over 50%. The difference, compared to yesterday evening, is probably that these women were a broader cross section ... some were techies getting off at my stop, others heading further into the city to the financial, law, commercial areas.

    There was one woman in scrubs ... I didn’t count her. Presumably she was going from/to a medical job where scrubs are almost a required uniform, so she had no real choice.

    Sorry to be so nerdy ... but fran’s Gotta be what fran’s Gotta be !
    Fran
    Last edited by Fran-K; 10-03-2018 at 06:56 AM. Reason: Updated data!

  8. #8
    Stop that, it's silly.... DIANEF's Avatar
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    I have found you have to go to the city center to see any amount of women in dresses and skirts, fortunately for me that is only a ten minute drive away. Away from there probably 80 percent of women are in jeans or pants of some kind. I don't think, just yet, seeing someone in a skirt or dress marks them out as a crossdresser.
    Last edited by DIANEF; 10-02-2018 at 06:54 PM.
    Here today, gone tomorrow....

  9. #9
    Nylons lover GeorgeA's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracii G View Post
    Seems the CDs are the ones wearing the skirts and dresses these days so they are easy to pick out of a crowd.
    So true. I always say that I don't dress like a woman but as a crossdresser.

    [SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]

    Phili,
    I always enjoy your observations. You have a good eye and analyse your sightings very well.
    GeorgeA
    formerly Salerba

    "a miad" Man-in-a-Dress

  10. #10
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    Diane I was being sarcastic LOL
    But on this forum skirts and dresses are very popular.

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    I love, as you do, that being a MIAD is becoming No Big Deal. And it does seem, sadly, that women these days are dressing more for comfort and anonymity than style. But women haven't given up on dresses everywhere. A few years ago, I took a short trip to Turin, Italy. I estimate that 90% of the women there were in a dress or skirt. I think the warm weather was a factor. It was August and a skirt permits better cooling, right? On the other hand, a MIAD might have caused a riot there.

  12. #12
    Platinum Member Beverley Sims's Avatar
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    There is more blending in these days, they are still womens fashions but in London they seem to dress down a little.
    Work on your elegance,
    and beauty will follow.

  13. #13
    Just do it already! DaisyLawrence's Avatar
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    Phili.

    You have experienced London in the Autumn. No other part of the UK is the same as London. That being said, if you had been in London a few months ago at the height of summer you would have seen lots of summer dresses and skirts worn for comfort in the hot weather. Other cities with less tourists dress differently. Many women still wear skirts as office attire and you will see them out and about at lunchtimes and before or after work hours only. Casual wear may well have been taken over by leggings and jeans but the same can not be said for 'going out' in the evenings. It's just about convenience and 'outfit matching'. Think about it, a bloke gets his favourite pair of jeans and every single shirt, T shirt, sweater, hoody etc that he owns will go with them. There is no need to outfit match. This really helps if you are carrying all your clothes in a cabin bag. Now take a woman who likes her printed skirts, suddenly you need a different shirt and sweater for each skirt and when the skirt is a visual statement you can't just keep wearing it everyday like jeans. Now, give the same woman some jeans or a pair of black leggings and the outfit matching problems have just vanished and her suitcase is half empty like a mans. Suffice to say that in the touristy parts of London, the majotrity of those you see during working hours have, in fact, brought all their clothes with them on a plane. They do not have the luxury of putting together a different outfit for each day. Simple as that.

  14. #14
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    Phili, what a sad a negative picture you paint of our fine capital city I have to agree with Daisy (#13) that there are reasons why London would be the way that it is. As for the regional cities, away from the tourist areas? I don't think that it's as bleak as you paint. Also, I would imagine that as the edges of the genders blur then we could see a rise in cross dressing, not a decrease as public acceptability (glacially slowly) increases. And, I'm more than happy to put in the hard yards at the coalface to help the sales of the type of clothes that I'm sure we all like to see and wear.

  15. #15
    Senior Member GretchenM's Avatar
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    Interesting observations and I agree that, in some respects, I see this trend as well. But I don't think it is a general trend as dramatic as you describe. It varies so much with weather, season, where you are when you are sampling the population, city, town, wilderness, etc. So, I have to agree with Daisy and Charlotte on this one. I think if you widen your sample environment to include many more situations you will find the trend is not quite so dramatic. Another factor is that my wife tells me that women don't dress to be flirty or the like. They dress to be comfortable and appropriate for the situation they expect to be in. Thus the motivation for a particular gender expression may be different between GGs and CDs. Although sampling on the street is probably somewhat of a cross-section of the total, it is still very limited and influenced by many different factors. If you sampled in, say, law offices you would come up with a very different result, but that is also a biased sample just like street sampling has limitations in its validity. Sampling on the street in London or San Francisco might produce a very, very different result than would be found in Des Moines, Iowa or a similar sized community in Italy or Hungary.

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    Interesting that I read this Thread while at the airport. I always keep an eye on the fashions that the GF’s are wearing but this morning I’m looking specifically for Dresses/Skirts. Maybe 99 in a hundred are wearing jeans/leggings/ yoga pants. The GG’s that are dressed (or Skirted) look very polished and classy. The Flight Attendant on my flight was wearing a grey flannel uniform dress... drop dead gorgeous. Maybe my next dress will be a Flight Attendant uniform. As a side note. Whatever happened to dressing nice to travel, slovenly and ridiculously casual is the norm now. Sad.
    Lace and Smiles and looking pretty,
    Lisa!

  17. #17
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    Philli & Asew,

    You both see more CDing in children and society will accept CDing in adults and the toys and clothes blending?????? So little boys will start to want to wear girl clothes?????? Adult males will start to want to wear women's clothes and society will accept????? I'm not sure a lot of men would want to wear women's shoes, sexy skimpy panties, bra hell no. Only CD's, and you both being CD's are you looking thru rose, oops I mean pink colored glasses? As I set here fully dressed I would love to go out as such especially with my D's which make my soft peach colored V neck T look very feminine but not accepted in my neck of the woods. I do notice when I go out dressed to blend (no boobs) that I blend and no one notices. Hope you are both right and I am wrong and the sooner the better. BTW, what's the difference in me and my D forms and a woman with breast implants; both fake but women do have protruding breasts, men don't.

  18. #18
    Super Moderator char GG's Avatar
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    from confused_cathreen:
    Sharp, well-tailored three piece suits with bright ties and classy leather shoes always make my day
    Good observation, Cathreen. Men don't seem to dress up to that level in smaller towns but it's fun to see them in large cities!

  19. #19
    Stop that, it's silly.... DIANEF's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tracii G View Post
    Diane I was being sarcastic LOL
    But on this forum skirts and dresses are very popular.
    It's okay Tracii, nothing I said was directed at you
    Here today, gone tomorrow....

  20. #20
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    Phili,
    London like most big cities is in too much of a hurry to give anyone the time of day . I do London when I really need to but I'm so glad to walk away after a few hours . It is a great city with so much to see but it's hard for a visitor to find the heart and soul in short space of time .

    You raise a very interesting point about the percentage of dress/skirt wearers , I do wonder where all those lovely items go in the fashion shops ? We hardly ever see them on the street so who is buying them and where are they wearing them ?

    If you choose the right location to remain safe it must be a CDers heaven because no one takes any notice but then I'm out full time in my new home town and haven't had a single problem . Only today I chose to go out in a skirt and Tshirt with wedges and a lightweight jacket , to most people just another lady shopper but then I'm not looking for a reaction .

    Don't forget when comparing SF to London , SF is a walkable small city with a very different climate , I walked the whole of Market Street , then right along the waterfront taking in the sites and some great pictures , then worked my way up to the Japenese Tea Gardens and caught the cable car back to the bottom of Market St .
    Last edited by Teresa; 10-03-2018 at 11:10 AM.

  21. #21
    AKA Lexi sometimes_miss's Avatar
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    As much as we might be lead to thing that everyone will eventually be wearing unisex outfits, I don't think it's going to happen. I thought that would eventually happen back in the seventies, yet, women who want to attract men still wear ultra feminine attire that accentuates their figures, and men wear standard men's wear that either attract women, or, as in the case demonstrated by crossdressers, avoid wearing things that repulse them.

    It's not going to change much. While the current move towards tolerating gender benders will accelerate, the sexual attraction probably won't follow. As we all know, toleration and actually being sexually attracted to something, are two very different things.
    Some causes of crossdressing you've probably never even considered: My TG biography at:http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...=1#post1490560
    There's an addendum at post # 82 on that thread, too. It's about a ten minute read.
    Why don't we understand our desire to dress, behave and feel like a girl? Because from childhood, boys are told that the worst possible thing we can be, is a sissy. This feeling is so ingrained into our psyche, that we will suppress any thoughts that connect us to being or wanting to be feminine, even to the point of creating separate personalities to assign those female feelings into.

  22. #22
    Miss Judy Judy-Somthing's Avatar
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    I think it's unfair how society wants women to dress. It's way to much work and time consuming getting dolled up.

    But I admit I love really fem women who wear dresses.
    Back in my dating days I would only date girls who wore dresses.
    "This is ME" I am not CRAZY, I'm just a GUY who likes dresses!
    Since allot of men dress up in woman's clothing that makes it a manly thing to do!
    Much more fun than fishing.
    I do construction like house building and I love CD-ing, what's the difference?

  23. #23
    Silver Member Rhonda Jean's Avatar
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    As much as I love that so many of y'all are love your dresses, I must say my interest in dresses has diminished over the years. To get real, I don't look as good in dresses as I used to. I sure don't look as good in the dresses I want to look good in. I know it's blasphemy, but I think I and a lot of other women look better in... get ready!... Tight jeans and short shorts!

    I dress frequently. You can do that when you live by yourself and have a lot of free time during the week. The dress is iconic. Just telling someone, "I think I'll wear a dress tonight" or having someone ask me if I'm going to wear a dress STILL just makes me feel warm and tingly all over. Wearing one though, unless it's one of those that I shouldn't wear just doesn't do it for me like it used to. I still wear them. Always will. But it's not my best look.

    A couple of weeks ago I bought a pair of skin tight to the ankle jeans. Actually bought them for male mode. Wore them a few days ago to run errands with just some blingy sandals and a loose V-neck top. Maybe questionable as male mode, but I was unquestionably male. Also found out from seeing another woman wearing identical jeans that the way to wear them is to turn them up about 6". Even better! Skipped work this morning to get my brows done and went casual fem with the same jeans and heels. Loved it! Comfortable, casual, and (I thought) sexy. I can see one of my minor obsessions coming on. I seem to take those on every so often until I run them to a hole in the ground. I've worn a lot of tight women's jeans, but none of them have been quite as awesome as these!

  24. #24
    Member Davinnia's Avatar
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    The sad thing is, times have changed. The concept of dressing up for an occasion is passing. For a funeral I always wear a black suit & tie but most people, male & female, seem to wear their scruffy jeans & make no effort to dress well as a mark of respect. I can recommend the movie. Ladies In Black, set in a Sydney department store in 1959. The store is busy pre Christmas with ladies buying cocktail frocks , does anyone buy a cocktail frock for Christmas today ? Some great clothes in this movie. Maybe us crossdressers live in a timewarp when women dressed more elegantly than today, I know I do.

  25. #25
    Gold Member Helen_Highwater's Avatar
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    I was out in my local city centre (in drab) the other day and as the post says most GG's were in some form of jeans/leggings/trousers.

    There is also a fashion for young males to wear skinny jeans and with the fashion for sneakers m/f footwear boundaries are also blurring.

    Does this signal the demise of skirts and dresses. No, it just means when they are worn has reduced to different activities.

    Go into a town centre on a weekend night and the girls will still be "dolled up". Usually something tight fitting as well as revealing. Heels will be the order of the day.

    Let's also not loose sight of the fact that we're talking about fashion and that changes all the time. In 2 years all could be different.

    As for me, I'll carry on wearing modest skirts and tops when out enfemme daytime, punctuated by the occasional simple dress both accompanied by flat boots. Out for the evening then dress and heels.

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