Disturbing Observation

[Paula DAngelo]

I was going back and rereading the replies to a post and have to say I noticed something very disturbing. I know and understand that everyone has and is entitled to their own opinion. With that being said I find that multiple members are making comments that are very disrespectful to what appears to be a minority group of members on this site.

I'm speaking of those of us that are trans-women. I understand that this is mainly a site for cross dressers, however I thought that one of the core beliefs was that trans-women are women, at least that is what is often stated. Lately I have been seeing a lot of replies that imply or out right state that a trans-woman is not a woman.

So if we're if we're not woman, and we know we're not men what do you think we are? Also when seeing comments like I've been seeing lately it makes me question if we're even wanted here and if our experiences or knowledge is valued. Maybe I'm getting the wrong impression from what I'm seeing but it does make me question if it's worth staying around and being insulted.

[Stacy Darling]

There's a whole heap of love in the some of us! we may all be not be about at the same time though!


We are all the same!
Stacy!

[Lana Mae]

Paula, I would say that these folks are not aware that many "trans-women" can not afford healthcare let alone HT and SRS! They are women but still have their male parts because they can not afford to get female parts! Does this make them any less women? No because it is how you feel that makes you a woman! The sum of our lives is not our genitals! I fully support ALL of our trans ladies regardless of where you are at physically! Hugs Lana Mae

[Kelly DeWinter]

Paula;

I recall the thread and I agree with how you feel. The reality is that for some here the journey they are on is to transition at some point. They don't realize it until some time later when they cross the line between being a cross-dresser to being transgender. Some people don't understand the difference between sex and gender and are like birthers (political reference) they hold to the notion that gender is in chromosomes.

There is a current theme floating on this site about MAID which is the new definition for being a Transvestite ( don't hammer me people, it's my opinion) For some being a MAID is their simple understanding of Cross-dressing without the complications of admitting to being a Cross-dresser.

The one thing this site does not have is a beginner guide to CD/TG that lays out what is and what is not in terminology.

The best way to remove any '"enemy"ammunition' is to educate the members in a persuasive manner. It just takes time.

One of the great aspects of this site is that it gives people time to learn by asking questions.

[Ashley in Virginia]

Its not all about money for transitioning. I am a transwoman, I still have male parts. I don't ever see myself getting rid of them for my own personal reasons. It does not make me any less of a woman than other transwomen who have had surgery.

Transphobia is rampant on this forum. Everytime I read someone saying about "choosing to be a woman" is a slap in the face. I am a woman. For years I chose to be a man. I couldn't do it anymore and I decided to be real about who I am. Being my real self is me being a woman.

[Piora]

Well, Paula....I would simply say, please don't judge an entire forum on the remarks and opinions of a tiny minority. I embrace the thoughts and opinions of all LGBTQ members here. And while yes, there is a large member base here for crossdressers, there are many trans men and women here as well. We all identify differently. And we should be happy for those that have found their identities and their sexuality, not critical of them. No one should be subjected to insults based on that identity.

[Lygophilia]

There is always going be haters, I would just ignore them. You know in your heart who you are. I do feel out of place in the forums though.

[bridget thronton]

I believe people determine their own gender - so transwomen are definitely women in my world view

[mykell]

paula i find that it comes from all directions, intolerance with'in our group towards our community....dont think its right, i try to point it out when i read about it. just recently felt like a troll doing so. some folks just find different words to give the same point of view or ask a question they really dont want the answer too.

when i conduct my social events at a LGBT center i meet many interesting folks and when you are looking directly into someones eyes i feel i am really getting a connection that way as opposed to here. I will also get some "disturbing vibes" there also with folks who dont "get" non binary though so its not isolated just to this forum. i try to explain what its like to have the brain of a women and the body of a man ......some folks just will never get it.

at the end of the day its what you believe about your identity that matters most but its nice when folks have your "6". surely you have had mostly positive vibes here so keep in contact with the folks on those conversations....

[Teresa]

Paula,
The problem is some may talk about wanting to be a woman without thinking about what a TS goes through , the mindset remains you can still float back and forth like a CDer . What you go through is permanent . The problem I have seen with some TSs I've met is their bodies are as they always wished them to be but their brain isn't fully letting go of some male issues , I would guess for some that never does completely go away . I realise this can be a very sensitive issue for some people and to have their gender challenged is totally thoughtless . It is a sad fact that some people do derive pleasure from hurting others .

We do need an input from TSs to give us a balanced forum , personally I hope you can ride over these people and help the ones that appreciate your input .

[Tracy Irving]

I thought that one of the core beliefs was that trans-women are women, at least that is what is often stated. Lately I have been seeing a lot of replies that imply or out right state that a trans-woman is not a woman.

I have seen this also and commented on it in the "I'm a Transbian" thread.

Maybe they are just thinking about it biologically and ignoring gender? Or maybe they actually feel that someone identifying as gender female isn't a woman and can't be a lesbian. Perhaps we will get some clarity.

[Giselle(Oshawa)]

to me a trans woman is a woman and went through a hell of a lot of anguish and effort to become one

[Stephanie47]

I have seen this also and commented on it in the "I'm a Transbian" thread.

Maybe they are just thinking about it biologically and ignoring gender? Or maybe they actually feel that someone identifying as gender female isn't a woman and can't be a lesbian. Perhaps we will get some clarity.

In general without regard to this site or any other written discourse the problem of using a single word to describe anything is to invite a multitude of perceptions of meaning. I have commented many times do not assign a singular word to a detailed subject. Express in sentences and paragraphs. Frankly, until that thread appeared, "I', a Transbian" I never heard it before. I don't think I live in a closet, but, if I as a participant on this site never heard it before and really do not know what its meaning is, does anyone really expect the general public to understand it.

If Paula has read something which upset her or is in conflict with her beliefs I would suggest she or anyone else should ask for a clarification from the poster. One of problems with written discourse is expressing oneself with clarity when the poster is maybe also thinking with non verbal communication. Written discourse does not readily project non verbal communication such as voice inflection or facial expressions.

[Tracii G]

I saw those two threads and the titles alone made me not want to read them.
Knowing full well what would happen in them I chose to stay away.

[Beverley Sims]

Paula, you stay here, comments like yours are good as it keeps the rest of us on our toes.

What you say is a reminder for others to remember how others have to live.

I think the comment before mine sums some of it up nicely.

[Rachael Leigh]

Paula, I’m going to be honest here over the years I’ve struggled with this and can it be true trans women are women.
I’ve been through a lot in the last year, from planning on transition and then not going through with it. However with all of
this now living a more non binary life I know I am more female than male. Gender identity is a very tough issue for many
of us I respect everyone here no matter who they are or their daily life and presentation

[Shelly Preston]

Moderator note

No one should ever feel insulted here this is a Support Forum for everyone in the community

I would urge anyone with an issue to report it.

[Tina B.]

Paula, as far as I'm concerned I think we all have the right to self identify. Remember we are mostly just a bunch of men trying to figure out our own place in society, who among us has a right to tell another where they fit on the spectrum. If you choose to identify as a trans-woman, or as a women, your call not mine. I'm still working on my own, crossdresser, or transvestite, or trans gendered so who am I to choose for you. We are a large group, and just like the real world, you have to pick and choose who you will listen to, and pay attention too, and who you need to just ignore, but please not run off, we need to hear from all the community.

[Roxanne Lanyon]

I am, of course, what I choose to be, unless, of course, I am not who I am but am what I want to be, unless, of course, some of you disagree with what I am not thinking.
Roxanne

[Patricia_Campi]

Paula, I believe that when we discover our non binary gender (and there is a huge variation inside this spectrum) we begin a fight. The first fight is with us, with our inner self, and this is a tough one. This leads us through various emotional states (questioning, anger, acceptance, deception, sadness, happiness, and so on) and some of the people on this forum can be on some of this states and will behave according to them.

So, try to accept these people and imagine that they are in a roller coaster of emotions and are only trying to understand themselves and win that fight.

That´s how I see these haters, because I have been there once.

Kisses

Patricia

[GaleWarning]

One thing I have learned from this site is this:
We are all somewhere on a VERY wide spectrum.

[Alice B]

In my mind it is a simple answer. If you are transitioning to become a woman and feel like you are a woman, then you are a woman.

[Fran in skirts]

Paula, You stated you are a "trans-woman" then as far as I am concerned you are a woman. I am a man in a dress or skirt. Others here are full cross-dessers, many are somewhere in between, there is no room for hate or such ugly stuff. If it some one causes you to be hurt because of what you are then they need to be reported. I accept all forms of trans gender people as they are who they are.
Fran

[Bobbi46]

Gender tolerance is what is needed, throughout. Paula you should never have to put up with nasty comments against you and I totally agree with what Shelly says if something comes up which is a direct insult to you you MUST report the thread. This is a forum for help and support for everybody irespective of our dressing or gender level we should all support and help each other and not go out to hurt someone just because of some warped outlook on something.
If for no other reason your place is here with us as I say we are here to help and support just as much as your life's experiences are of worth to us in turn.
There are huge numbers of good people here just for you.

[GretchenJ]

Hi Paula,

To piggyback Shelly’s post, this is a support forum for all and anyone who feels excluded or insulted should report it.

Although there are are varying opinions around here, but no one should be slighted. But I have found the vast majority of the members here are very supportive