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Thread: A rare moment of regret

  1. #1
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    A rare moment of regret

    So I get mis-gendered a fair amount. Wrong pronouns, sir instead of maam etc. More than half the time people get it right. I think sometimes I pass and other times people are just smart and get it.

    I have probably been mis-gendered about 100 times in the 2 and 1/2 years since transitioning. Being in a public facing job and dealing with about 150 people per night 90% men I am sort of used to it.

    In the last 24 hours a guy politely held a door open for me, I said thank you softly in a decent voice and he said you're welcome sir.

    Then at the convenience store the clerk says thank you sir when I hand over my money.

    Sometimes it hits hard and other times it hurts. So I get to work and in the women's locker room ( I am legally female and nobody has expressed a problem with me being in there ) anyway in the locker room I am brushing my hair and looking in the mirror and think ......

    Who am I kidding? I look like a dude.

    Will I get over it? Yep. Does it hurt? Yep.

    Why will I get over it? Because I am living my authentic life and being an openly transwoman is in my opinion helping move the needle in society toward greater transgender acceptance. Would I like to be able to be stealth? Sure I would be lying if I said otherwise. And I would like to be a cis- woman too but that isn't happening. But I do believe that I am contributing in a small way to changing the world and creating greater acceptance. Many people have told me they have changed their mind regarding trans people because of their exposure to me. (true story)

    The reason I share this story is that I advocate on this website that people that feel strong dysphoria should transition if it would make them happier, but truth be told it is not an easy thing to do. Not to mention job, family and friends but just living with yourself and the rest of people in the world.

    My therapist told me once that I became minority overnight. It's true I went from being a white man with a college degree and good job to being transgender. I was privileged. And now I am not.

    I still believe in transitioning and I am confident I will never regret it on a regular basis but there are moments that shake you a bit. I think it's only fair to say so to those considering transitioning. It is 3 steps forward and 1 step back.
    Last edited by KymberlyOct; 11-19-2018 at 10:14 PM. Reason: typo

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    Thanks for posting this Kym. I’m sorry the misgendering happens. I find you to be courageous, and I don’t write that as a platitude.

  3. #3
    Isn't Life Grand? AllieSF's Avatar
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    Thanks Kym for posting the reality story for all of us. Life is not all honey and roses for everyone and even less so for trans individuals. I love your spirit and please keep on truckin.

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    Aspiring Member Dorit's Avatar
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    Kym, I love your post. It is honest and humble about the reality of our lives as trans women. We have been given a real challenge , we did not chose it, and yet you are speaking from a place of self acceptance and strength that is an inspiration to me. You are also one of the women gifted in written expression, a beautiful post. Thank you!

    I printed you post, it was so good!
    Last edited by Dorit; 11-20-2018 at 12:44 AM.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Hell on Heels's Avatar
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    Hell-o Kym,
    I’m sure those moments are hurtful, and you have no choice but to be you.
    There are people like that in all walks of life. Those that feel the need to be
    disrespectful of others for no good reason.
    I hope you don’t really believe those awkward steps you’ve taken are backwards?
    Much Love,
    Kristyn
    I smile because you are my friend, and
    I laugh because there is nothing you can do about it!!!

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    Hi Kristyn long time no talk, and thx Dorit, Allie and Nikki.

    I think a lot of misgendering is not necessarily mean spirited I think much of it comes from lack of awareness or empathy or just not being dialed in to social cues. I do think occasionally it is intentional but I think that is the minority of the time.

    Rather I think people are just speaking their knee jerk reaction and actually that is the part that hurts, that I am perceived by those individuals as a man, regardless of my hair, my makeup, my clothing etc. The fact that their instinct says male hurts.

    The purpose of my post though was primarily to talk about transitioning and living this life is hard. Do I regret it?

    98% of the time no I don't, but it is tough. Do I recommend it for those that feel it is their truth? Yes.

    Since I advocate for living authentically I think it is only fair to talk about both sides of the coin.

    I would love to hear thoughts on two topics if this thread grows 'legs'

    1. The positives and negatives of transitioning
    2. Being misgendered since that was the catalyst that made me feel bad.

    Not necessarily for me ( well maybe a little - but I will be fine ) but more so for the majority of people that read these posts but don't participate. I know they are reading to sort through their own feelings but don't participate for a variety of reasons. I write these things with them in mind primarily.
    thanks to all of you :-)

  7. #7
    Just do it already! DaisyLawrence's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KymberlyOct View Post
    But I do believe that I am contributing in a small way to changing the world and creating greater acceptance. Many people have told me they have changed their mind regarding trans people because of their exposure to me. (true story)

    Not in a small way Kym but in a big way, bigger than most of us could ever achieve.

    Thank you for this 'warts and all' honesty about your transition. This kind of experience is absolutely priceless to many of us on this site.

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    Gold Member Lana Mae's Avatar
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    Kym, I will simply just say thanks so much for this thread! Hugs Lana Mae
    Life is worth living!
    "Foxy lady! You look so good!!" Jimi Hendrix

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    Call me Pam pamela7's Avatar
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    Hi Kym,

    I'm not sure regret is the right word. I think there are things that we lose such as the raw strength, which has its times of when it would have been useful. Being miss-gendered, I see most people do it without thinking, but few others with cruel intent. It only speaks of them.

    As to minority, I always felt in a minority. I'm still learning how to communicate in order to stand some chance of being understood.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJFyz73MRcg
    I used to believe this, now I'm in the company of many tiggers. A tigger does not wonder why she is a tigger, she just is a tigger.

    thanks to krististeph: tigger = TG'er .. T-I-GG-er

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    Aspiring Member natalie_cheryl's Avatar
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    Kim thank you for your post, hearing stories like this helps me come more to terms with my own wanting to transition. I'm at the beginning of my own story trying to hopefully save my marriage so that I can in a way. Have my cake and eat it too. I.e. get to transition and keep my wife and kids.

    So again thank you for your story an bravery.

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    Hi Kym,

    Such a needed thread. I feel the pain of those who committed to fully transition and are experiencing the intentional or unintentional acts of being misgendered. Both would hurt for sure. Not sure how much one is better than another.
    I don't want to hijack the thread but would add that for non-binary it is complex too. Being called "sir" when you dressed mostly female but not obviously as in skirt / dress - causes big discomfort even though I feel like mam would not make me feel comfortable either.
    I can only go to gym during lunch break at work where I haven't came out. I must wear my sports bra at this point when I exercise because my breasts are too big to exercise comfortably without. I feel not in right place in men's changing room to put it on and take it off and I feel that I can't simply walk to women's changing room either. So where do I belong? That is my story these days...

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    Interesting topic. Sorry that you weren't acknowledged as your right gender. You look very nice though as a woman. I would say that to alot of the others on this site, but the post count would be overwhelming. So, you'll be the first and only one.
    Last edited by Lygophilia; 11-20-2018 at 01:27 PM.

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    Member Carolina's Avatar
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    Thank you for the post and sharing your extremely valuable experience. You may not realize it, but you are a role model for many others that are way behind you.

    I admire and applaud your courage to live as you meant to live. I envy that courage as well

    My therapist also told me about the many difficulties I could face, but you put it very clearly, from being privileged to becoming a minority. I’m curious, did you lose your good job? You are the same person with the same college degree, the “only” change was a correction in the gender to make it right, but that shouldn’t change anything else, right? Well at least in theory (I know in my case it would be totally impossible to keep my job...)

    Even taking into account the incredible difficulties (some of them I’m sure I cannot yet fathom), reading your post I still found myself dreaming of how life could be...

    You are an inspiration for many of us!

  14. #14
    Isn't Life Grand? AllieSF's Avatar
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    Positives:

    - You unload the burden of a lot of issues associated with hiding, white lies and living in two worlds with two different presentations,
    - You start living your life more realistically and truthfully, which can bring a lot of satisfaction and more importantly more inner peace,
    - You get to go shopping for a lot of new work clothes (shopping is fun),
    - You get to go shopping for a lot of everyday casual clothes to wear going about all your non-work hours (Yeah, Shopping is fun),
    - If on hormones for us MtF's, you can let them grow and can show them off when possible while letting the rest of your body adapt and hopefully transform itself into something more pleasing to the feminine eye,
    - You get to learn how mentally, socially and physically how to live your life as a new person (learning is always good),
    - You get to get a
    - And so on and so forth as others add to the list,

    Negatives:

    - You have to spend additional money to reconstruct your wardrobe when you have so many good clothing items that have years of good use left in them (I hate to waste anything),
    - You have to learn how to deal with mis-gendering (unintentional (most) or not) (this king of learning is not so good but will serve us well in the future, thicker skin where it counts),
    - You have to deal with society and all its good points and well mannered intentions, even when those intentions are given at the wrong moment,
    - You have to deal with the sadness, anger, frustrations and all those other feelings when you lose a good friend, work mate or family members (this sucks),
    - You may have to deal with loss of income or a reduction of income when you lose your job (regardless of what the law says), don't get that promotion, or get a demotion (sometimes called that "Lateral Transfer"),
    - You have to deal with all those new feelings of freedom and civil rights that for some reason just don't come your way,
    - You have to make new true friends (BFF's) when you lose some of your old ones, and you already know how hard it was to find the ones you lost,
    - You have to live with your physical, facial, body and mannerisms that sometimes just do not help to identify you as female, but rather some good aberration of the past male you,
    - And so on

    Being Misgendered:

    That rarely happens to me, so I do not have a similar experience as you do. However, when I happens, I will politely, in the moment, tell the person how they should address me. I have never had a problem after that in the same place. If I did, I would go to the boss and politely explain the current issue and my needs. I have mno idea how polite I would be if I had a lot of that happening. I am a person who is usually not easy to upset with certain things, and misgendering for the moment is not on one of my hot lists.

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    Allie thanks for that, I think it is important for people considering transition to have some idea of what to expect from different perspectives.

    Carolina - I did not lose my job due to being transgender, I was part of a corporate downsizing of management level people. And this is tough to admit but I do wonder if I would have transitioned if I were still in that job. I believe I would have but that's not how it happened so I honestly can't say so for sure. Just trying to be totally transparent.

    However, I firmly believe transition has hurt my career and income. I am not going to brag at length about my work experience but my resume is excellent. I used to negotiate multi million dollar deals, I will leave it at that.

    Now I am having trouble getting a job paying half of what I used to make. Most transwomen I know tend to stay in the same job they had before transitioning. Finding a new job post transition is harder. I know one person that has successfully upgraded their job and had a lot of great FFS work and is in her 30s.

    Just talking reality here. I also think people with specific skills - IT field - medical - technical skills etc are better suited to finding work post transition. I was a high priced professional schmoozer. Tougher to do now.

    I could have probably found a better job after the layoff if I had not transitioned but for me I decided this life is too short and when it's over are you going to care about how much money you made and the stuff you accumulated or how you lived. I made my choice. And I usually don't regret it. Except when it's time to pay my bills :-D

    I came back and am adding to this post after a couple of hours, I was thinking about what I wrote and wanted to add an additional thought.

    My response to Carolina was regarding her question of being privileged and now I am not to which she asked don't I have the same degree etc. Well yes of course I still have a degree but living as a transgender woman is a far cry from living as a successful white man. There are marginalized groups in our society and we are one of them. Is everybody out to get us? Of course not. Do many people support us? Yes, in varying degrees, but if you think misogyny and racism and economic class don't exist in addition to homophobia and transphobia then I strongly disagree.

    Can a person in marginalized group succeed? Absolutely, but it is harder. It was a lot easier being part of the good old boys network. I was sociable, friendly and I looked the part. People wanted to hire and promote me and do business with me. People are still comfortable with me but it is not the same, I am different from them now.

    That is what I meant from my comment - I was privileged and now I am not. It's not just about money, privilege is about fitting in.
    Last edited by KymberlyOct; 11-21-2018 at 12:47 AM. Reason: Additional thought

  16. #16
    Aspiring Member grace7777's Avatar
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    Transitioning is the hardest thing I have ever done. I feel that I am now a much stronger person mentally. Now I am able to live authentically. Also, I find that I am a lot more motivated.

    Career wise, transitioning has not set me back. When I decided to transition, my career was not going anywhere. That made the decision easier, since I felt I did not have much to lose. This year is now my 3rd best as far as earnings, and with over a month to go, it should easily be my best earnings year. The job is not ideal, but it does bring in the money.

    Transitioning is not cheap, but what good would having the money be if I was very unhappy.

    Being misgendered is the worse thing that can happen to me. I am looking at FFS so my face will be more feminine. Also, looking at procedures for my face that do not involve surgery, but will make me more feminine looking.

    Voice has not been a major problem. Often at work when I answer the phone, people who have no idea who I am will address me as ma'am. I have an android app on my phone that has helped me to develop a feminine voice.

    Grace

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    Thanks Grace, I am glad it is going well for you. I do want to be clear I still advocate for transitioning and I am absolutely glad that I did.
    My intent in my last reply to Carolina and in my original post was to say there are two sides to this coin of transitioning. I don't think it is fair to those that are considering it to tell them that it is all rainbows and unicorns.

    That said I will always support transitioning if it is what is in your heart. Letting fear and judgment of others is a recipe for unhappiness. Transitioning was the scariest and the best thing I ever did.

    Also it does not mean a lifetime of poverty and unemployment. For me it was a hit to my career and money because of the nature of what I did but I do have a job. It's OK. I did get hired post transition and I was invited to apply. I am a professional poker dealer. Nothing wrong with that job. Some people would be thrilled about it. A far cry from what I used to do but that's fine. I am going to explore restarting my career with some of the more progressive companies in the area. And I do know many transwomen in all types of jobs from senior to entry level.

    Being openly trans is not a death blow to your finances or career, but it does make it more challenging and I do stand by my statement that transgender people are not as privileged as white men.

    At the end of the day you have to decide what your priorities are and then go from there. For me my priority was living as the real me. Doesn't make me better or worse than anyone, just authentic.

    Find your own priorities, with honesty and lack of fear and then live accordingly.

    Grace BTW I recommend filler injections such as juvederm / botox type stuff. I did juvederm and was happy with it. It hurts for a few minutes. Your face swells for a couple of days but within a week it looks good. It definitely softened my face.

    Not as effective as FFS of course but alot easier and cheaper plus almost no health risk. Results are temporary, they start to fade after 9 to 12 months. If I get back on my feet financially I would probably spend about $2500 per year on it. That's what I spent 16 months ago but the effects are fading.

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    I always appreciate when transitioned people share the unvarnished truth. It’s important to keep grounded.
    Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one.

    Eleanor Roosevelt

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    happy to be her Sarah Doepner's Avatar
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    This post was a good starting point for me to begin the attempt to rank Transition in with everything else in my life. I've managed to make it almost to 70 years old, so there is quite a bit to draw from. I had the struggle with dysphoria in there at first, but then I had to add those times of self-discovery that opened the doors to where I am now. The list of bad stuff is emotionally brutal, but I've made it past those things, so it's worth listing to provide myself an overview and allow a bit of ranking.

    Watching my late wife slowly waste away and die from cancer was the hardest thing I've ever done. Next to that has to be multiple other deaths in the family all within a short 14 month period of time, while at the same time I was forced into retirement. Adopting a needy sibling group of 4 kids was very hard as well. But now I have a stable income, good health insurance and I'm out to my immediate family and a few friends with positive results. Strangers opinions, as long as they don't require me running, are no longer much of a problem for me. I'm thinking transition will be easier in comparison now, but I could be wrong.

    But as I look at your original description of taking 3 steps forward and one back I immediately thought of a new dance craze, "The Transition Tango". It involves going with the flow, keeping a sense of perspective, being willing to recognize when we need help and asking for it, maintaining a sense of humor, learning from the negatives and remembering the positives will get us through to the end of the song. I hope.
    Sarah
    Being transgender isn't a lifestyle choice. How you deal with it is.

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    Sarah, your ranking of life events helps add perspective as well. The loss of loved ones ranks above any and all personal struggles in my own life. I guess that affirms the value of those relationships. And having learned to cope with loss makes other life circumstances seem more manageable.
    Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one.

    Eleanor Roosevelt

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    Gold Member Kaitlyn Michele's Avatar
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    Kym

    Thats a gutsy and heartfelt post

    Thanks for sharing it.

    You did the right thing for yourself

    When you feel a tinge of regret as you call it, or remorse or you wish you mad e a different "choice"

    it can be helpful to remember how it was before... we dont get to choose between easy alternatives... and I think you chose survival... sometimes I call it existential survival because for me I was not gonna kill myself... my death was totally inside... I was an abyss

    im sure you felt it differently, we all do...

    but what I will say about you and all of us is this... We are survivors. and we should take great pride in it, and nobody can take it away from. us
    I am real

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    Interesting observation on regret. I doubt any thinking person can claim not to experience, in moments of reflection, some sense of regret. I blew up a marriage, which I deeply regret, but I don’t regret trying to be honest about who I was and am, even though the latter clearly contributed to the former. I am at the same time grateful that through that honest expression I’ve shed really regrettable behaviors that once seemed imbedded in my personality.
    Remember always that you not only have the right to be an individual, you have an obligation to be one.

    Eleanor Roosevelt

  23. #23
    Aspiring Member Dorit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele View Post
    but what I will say about you and all of us is this... We are survivors. and we should take great pride in it, and nobody can take it away from. us
    Kaitlyn, you really got it right for me. I have often explained it like this too.
    Last edited by Rianna Humble; 11-23-2018 at 05:34 AM. Reason: Reinstated quoting mechanism

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    Member Carolina's Avatar
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    I think you are courageous survivors. It takes courage to take the plunge to be who you really are. I envy your courage

    Kimberly, thank you for your honest comments. Fortunately (mostly) or unfortunately in a way, I’m in a pretty good, high flying job. Fortunately because I’m having fun working and dealing with the top professionals in Europe and NAmerica. Unfortunately because I don’t see a way out for me, not being able to live as who I’d love to live as. My therapist tells me that I could/should wait for retirement to really contemplate transition. That’s several years from now! I feel trapped in a golden cage and I may regret the lost years at some point.

    My therapist also warns me of the many setbacks I would face if I were to transition, because as you said, there is discrimination everywhere in society and many people still don’t know how to deal with those who transition. I try to rationalize it, we are the same person, same capabilities, same intellect and values before and after transition. Who cares how we present ourselves or look like? However I know that’s all in theory. In practice life is quite different, thus my huge appreciation for sharing your experience and helping me open my eyes to real life. I still fantasize about a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow (being able to live as Carolina) but need to weigh in the difficulties.

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    Carolina, And anyone else in a similar position, you have to do what is right for you. I won't presume to know what would make you happier. But from reading your comments it sounds as though you want to transition but don't want to give up what you have. That is a choice only you can make.

    Not everyone that transitions has to make an either / or choice. I know many people that stayed in their same jobs, then transitioned and are doing fine. It also depends the type of work you are in. If appearance, acceptance by others, (business politics so to speak ) play a major role it's more difficult. If you have specific skills then it's probably easier.

    In my opinion, and I emphasize, MY OPINION, I think it is a mistake to trade living as your real self for a career. When all is said and done all you really have is yourself. If a person's gender dysphoria is not particularly strong and they are satisfied with keeping these issues in the background then that is your decision alone.

    I was similar to Kaitlyn, I would never have committed suicide due to my gender dysphoria, it was not that crushing, but I did feel dead inside. I knew I was a woman since an early age and I spent most of my life trying to distract myself from that fact through building a career and gaining superficial self worth from that and from chasing the romantic love of women.

    Transitioning for me was decades overdue. But Carolina and others in the same boat have to decide what is right for them. I hope years from now you feel as though you made the right choice.

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