Is the need to crossdress inherited?

[Bethany38]

My grand father was a cd

[Lexigurl]

I don't know about the generations before me or after me. Oddly, even dressing on and off almost my entire life, and knowing all the hiding that goes on with it, I'd still be surprised to learn of someone else in my family dressing. Accepting, of course, but still surprised. Anyway, I don't think dressing itself is genetic, but the predisposition to do so, if exposed to it, probably is. Whether it is forced, curiosity, or something else, we know that feeling of being hooked by it. I'm curious though what the incidence is of men who have tried dressing (for fun, or joking around, or curiosity) and then weren't hooked by it to continue. We're exposed to the stories of our community, how it started, usually but not always, curiosity. But we're not exposed to the stories of men who tried it once and never did so again. Do they exist?

[Jenny22]

If micromutations in gender genes/genomes are present in a male child, might it be they that cause a young boy to try on something feminine? Further, if not present, a young male would show no such interest? Interesting concept.

[Teresa]

Jenny,
Don't forget we are also functioning males , we will have normal sexual needs and thoughts like most males . The problem I had was the natural male instincts and needs became intertwined with my female trait and needs , this lead to a considerable conflict for much of my life .

[JoanneNY]

Jenny and Teresa, I think you are both on target. In my puberty my thoughts were a cocktail of all things sexual/sensual, it was after I married and lived with the new joy of all the wonderful items scattered about that my mind exploded and the idea of wearing them became compulsive. I did but it was some 25 years later that I was careless and discovered. Ouch, that was a bad scene but we got thru it and managed to make it 45 years when the big "C" came.
WW

[sometimes_miss]

Yep, there's about a 1 in 40 chance that you'll 'inherit' being a crossdresser. Same odds as if none of your ancestors were crossdressers.

[GracieRose]

Gretchen,
If a group of about 45 genes have been identified to have micro-mutations in transgender people, could a listing of those specific genes be obtained, and could anyone be tested for said micro-mutations. Even though it doesn't change anything, I would be interested to see if this applies to me. I suspect that others would to.
-Gracie

[Pumped]

I believe that genetics have a part in it. Nothing I can use for prof, but I see things about my dad that make me wonder.

[CallmeAlice]

Nobody else in my family crosses and I would be rather surprised if they told me that they did. But I had a old boss we though crosses as sometime he would come into work with some makeup on, he told us one time that his dad cross dressed.

[giuseppina]

I've suspected there is more to the story than just the X and Y chromosomes for some time, Gretchen. There were questions in my mind when I saw a presentation of the sex selection process in utero sometime in my school-age years. What happens when things don't go quite right that the switch doesn't get completely thrown from female (natural) to male? I didn't buy the idea that once a sperm penetrates the egg that the egg becomes instantaneously impenetrable to other sperm. It turns out I was right on that one; it takes about an hour, more or less, for that to happen, and that's how chromosomally intersex babies happen.

GracieRose, I suspect the cost of the medical testing to get that information would be beyond the reach of the average LGBTQ+ person, and not available from AncestryDNA, 23&Me, and like genetic testing marketed to the general public.

[Mermaiden]

This is a great question and would be perfect for a “twin study”.

[GretchenM]

Some good questions brought up regarding the genetic connections and the possibility of having a genetic test that can identify a genetic cause for a person's gender variance. Sadly, the science for this is still in its infancy even though very strong genetic connections have been found. As for Gracie's question on testing, the findings so far seem to be headed toward that being a real possibility in perhaps 5 to 10 years. Unfortunately, testing for micromutations is very difficult and would be very expensive to do and only indicative of a connection with no real valid conclusions at this point. There are only a couple studies that have been done using the large population analysis methods. The results need to be replicated and verified by other studies. One of the big problems with these studies is that finding enough trans people to examine and produce meaningful results is difficult because we are not common and we tend to be secretive. That makes it difficult for the scientists to do these kinds of studies or any kind of studies on trans behavior. That is becoming easier, but it still provides only a small pool of people to study. This is the first study I have read where the total number of subjects was close to a thousand and only a fraction of those were considered trans. Many trans studies involve less than 100 people and that is only enough to get indications and not enough to draw conclusions about a world wide population that probably includes many millions of people with various degrees of transgender traits and characteristics many of which live in very different cultures from the what we live with in the industrialized nations.

Mermaiden: You are quite right about twin studies being useful and they have been done. And the results were very compelling and often found that in identical twins when one shows gender variance the other does as well, but not necessarily in the same pattern. Problem is, some fraternal (non-identical) twins also show a bit of this pattern. So, one would have to conclude that although there is a strong genetic element in explaining our desire to behave in this way there is a lot of environmental influence as well. Sorting out what is from where is not easy when they have been blended together for years and years in most study subjects. That said, the identical twin studies have shown such a strong genetic connection that it is clear that genetics are definitely involved to a large degree, but it is not the whole story. Rarely are such things that simple. You had a good insight to suggest that.

All in all, at this point, there is very strong evidence for at least a moderate influence from genetics and possibly an even stronger influence than has been thought to be the case in the past. The largest speed bump in finding out more definitive conclusions is the lack of subjects to examine. The stigma that society attaches to trans behavior, although its intensity is rapidly declining, still causes trans people to be wary of being involved in studies so the scientists have enough subjects to examine to come to some firm conclusions. And anti-trans talk in some social and political groups does not provide much assurance that retribution at some point would not occur. It is a thick wall that needs to be scaled or broken down so people like us are really willing to be guinea pigs to get at the truth about why we behave the way we do. I would volunteer in a heartbeat, but I am a professional in the sciences. Many others I know would have to think about it - a lot. Perhaps finding subjects to study could be easier if they were to draw subjects from forums like this or from the many support groups that are active throughout the world. I suspect some subjects are drawn from those sources in some countries. But even those have well considered privacy policies that are strictly enforced - and rightly so. Then there is the funding. Genetic studies on large populations, even with the low cost of genome sequencing these days, are still very expensive when you need to examine 20,000 people, both cisgender and transgender and figure out what the characteristics of each person is which usually requires paper questionnaires and followup interviews. Who funds those studies when the socio-political environment is unfavorable? Big problem.

[Teresa]

Gretchen,
The point about insufficient numbers to prove the theory is a shame , I'm wondering if tests were carried out a random selection how many non CD/TG people would show positive reults . My thought is there is another trigger that tips the balance or unlocks that part of us .

When we discuss this situation it's often from a male - female but are the same tests valid in the situation of female - male TGs . Going back the the trigger idea it could be the same one in both genders .

[Beverley Sims]

WilleWallie asked a question and I immediately stepped in and gave my candid opinion.

That is what I believe anyway.

I am open to suggestions, and after the comprehensive replies from Gretchen and others I have found this thread a good read and very informative.

I honestly don't know, but I do believe others who have questions should take time to read the thread.

I have printed it out and can read it at a lesiurley pace taking it all in.

I may have constructive comments later in the thread.

Meanwhile it is a good discussion and there are some interesting points made.

So much for my original comment, you learn something new every day.

[JoanneNY]

Thank you Beverly, Gretchen and everyone who contributed to this thread. The more you learn you realize how little you know.
WW

[GretchenM]

Teresa,

You bring up a good question regarding whether the same indications are present in FTMs as in MTFs. The answer for micromutations and for some other causal factors, it appears to be highly universal. But in some suspected causes, particularly hormonal shifts, the triggers for the two forms seem to be quite different but with similar results. It appears that many of these micromutations are not necessarily found on X or Y chromosomes but rather are scattered around in the other chromosomes called the autosomes. Does that mean it is not sex linked? Maybe, maybe not. That is not necessarily significant, as many of our genes for particular functions are scattered more or less randomly all over our chromosomes. Sort of like data on a computer hard drive - it is pretty fragmented. Unfortunately, there is no defragmentation tool available for our genes. But there are biochemically based "directories," often genetically based, that somehow keep track of where the instructions for making this or that chemical compound are located. Very mysterious, but solid evidence for such a system being there in a our gene regulation equipment. A lot of genes have been found that seem to be directed toward that kind of cataloging and directory function. Keep in mind, that about 80% of our genome is involved in gene regulation rather than in producing proteins to maintain our body and keep us going.

At this point there is a widespread consensus that this behavior form is a predisposition that we are born with and only becomes active if triggered by something. Most predispositions are that way - they need a trigger. Thus, even though the genetics are perfect, if there is no trigger then the predisposition is not turned on. This is thought to explain why some of us are not launched down this highway until later in life - no triggers earlier. That said, the prevalence of this showing up as young a 2 1/2 years old to about 10 years old with a peak around 7 or 8 years old seems to indicate the behavior is rather easily triggered and the late comer is quite unusual.

Lots to think about and lots of theories. But as I said to Jenny in a PM, knowing the cause, although very relieving and a joyous moment for any of us, the real problem is still living with the behavior pattern. That is where the rubber hits the road. But knowing the why could make it a little easier to navigate the highway. My sense is that gender variance from the tried and true gender binary has been present since forever, but it is a complex of several factors interacting in complex ways that cause a shift to this behavior pattern in 1% to maybe 5% of humans. Depending on your definition of transgender, the number affected can change dramatically. But, in my view it is an extension and exaggeration of the normal feminine and masculine sides present in most cisgender people. The fundamental exaggeration is genetically based and once triggered into activity it gains a life of its own. And can become the life of the person. In other words, it is just a matter of being a part of the normal variation in the complex world of human behavior. It is not bad; it is not good; it just is a part of the totality of human diversity.

Gretchen

[Teresa]

Gretchen ,
Sometimes I feel I probe too deeply but I felt it was my responsiblity to know not only for my own peace of mind but also to be able to explian it to others . When we take that big step to come out or as you put it the rubber hits the road , it's not much help just to shrug our shoulders and blithely say I don't know why we do it . Discovering we're TG is life changing , we may not know for certain what did trigger it but the outcome is again as you say something we have to live with and more to the point so do others .

Going back to point of M/F and F/M differences the big one appears to be M/F is more sexually orientated so we are possibly looking at difernt trigger mechanisms . It sort of begs the question do more F/M want to transition , is their GD more defined ?

You are so right our situation is far from bad , lets face it our genes could produce far worse characteristics .

Just a final thought on trigger mechanisms , something did occur in me at the age of 8-9 but I also relate that triggered state was locked in like a combination lock and no one has the combination to open it , it's for life !!

[GretchenM]

I agree fully, Teresa. It is difficult to be in a situation where you don't know why you do it and all you can provide are the various theories and some of the findings. But one can follow up with "greater minds than mine are hot on the trail of finding the cause." That seems to work for me. There will always be some who are suspicious.

The differences between MTF and FTM can be quite great in pre-transition and that is thought to mainly be due to the differences in the basic structure and physiology of males and females. Interestingly, when you look at the fully transitioned people those differences seem to fade away to some extent. Or perhaps that is just what it looks like. I got acquainted with a FTM that was fully transitioned and found him to be a rather nice and interesting fellow and quite acceptably masculine/male. Maybe even a little stronger than the average male. He said, "Overcompensation." Of the fully transitioned MTFs I know there is sometimes a bit of overcompensation there as well and they admit it. Fine by me. Makes them even more genuine and likable.

I have never figured out what my trigger was; it was kind of a progression from about 4 1/2 to 8 when I told my mother I wanted to be a girl. That was 1953, so that request did not fly very far - about a meter in the way you folks measure things. But it was triggered well before I was 8. After 8 and until 67 it was deny, deny, deny. Then I said I couldn't do this anymore and decided to take a crack at accepting. Holy cow, it worked! But then arose the usual problems of wife, children, family, etc., etc. Six years later I have found a gender home for myself in a kinda-sorta non-binary blended male/masculine and female/feminine identity that still bugs some people. But, hey, you can't win them all. It works and I am happy. But I still can't find the trigger other perhaps being raised by my mother, grandmother and three aunts and no father. I had a grandfather that loved me dearly and I loved him to no ends, but he was afflicted with a lot of medical issues and couldn't do normal fatherly things. That might do it. I really don't know.

All bests to you and to all others who are following this somewhat riveting thread. It has been a great discussion. Love it all.

[AngelaYVR]

I had a great uncle who did, a cousin who transitioned and I know my oldest brother dabbled for a bit (I was nosey). I do believe there is something contagious about this

[t-girlxsophie]

Dont think there's a link.My dad wasn't a CD and seeing my son hasn't spoken to me for 5 years he certainly isn't one.

Sophie

[Diane Smith]

I believe my maternal grandfather dealt with gender identity issues, especially in his last few years of life. The evidence is somewhat sketchy, though. As far as I know, he was the only one in my family to have any TG issues at all. But the kicker is that although he was my most important male influence growing up, he wasn't a blood relative - he was my grandmother's second husband and therefore, technically, my step-grandfather. So any traits of his I have adopted were passed down socially rather than genetically (and we certainly never talked directly about anything CD- or TG-related).

- Diane

[Rochal Tukque]

Maybe its a occupational hazard! Having fun here, for those serious ones. The group I'm in 63ish really active members 11 of us are pilots. There is only about 700k in the whole US. So that is a pretty high ratio for a small group.

[Celee]

I haven’t told anyone about my cd although I’m sure my wife suspects as all wife’s do. She found my daughters dress and heels in my son’s closet recently but I just acted like it was no big deal although it did make me wonder about my dad though.