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Thread: Female equivalent to CD?

  1. #1
    New Member JLove's Avatar
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    Female equivalent to CD?

    Apologies if I'm posting this in the wrong area of the forum (I'm new around here!), or if it's something that has been discussed previously! My CD BF and I were talking yesterday and trying to figure out if there is a female equivalent to CD. It seems to me like women wearing traditionally male clothes is generally accepted and not something a woman would feel she has to hide - for example, no one would look askance at a woman in a menswear suit (thank you, Madonna!). While men are able to don wigs, apply makeup, and dress in women's clothing, I can't think of any real equivalent for women (unless they're interested in adding extra facial/body hair!). What do you think? Am I missing something? Enquiring minds want to know.

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    I've been alive for more than seven decades. In that time I have not encountered a female cross dresser. Members of my family (wife, daughter and granddaughter) have worn clothing made for men. However, none wore clothes to try to emulate a man. My granddaughter found she likes men's flannel shirts as many of her girlfriends. They like the comfort. It seems to be some sort of style. They also like thrift stores for great bargains. My granddaughter also bought boy jeans because she is a skinny butt and young men's jeans fit her body. In no way does she alter her totally drop dead beautiful appearance. When my daughter was young she wore men's jeans because women's jeans did not have pockets. All three generations are their friends do not try to do any body modifications to emulate a man. Nor do they try to adopt male mannerisms. Of course there is always the Halloween "switch," but, that is not a dedicated cross dressing issue.

    Yes, society seems to give women a lot more freedom when it comes to wearing clothing. There is a female to male pre-operative transsexual in our extended family, but, that is a different issue. It is not an issue of cross dressing.

    As to people looking askance at women looking like a male. My wife when she was recovering from the effects of cancer chemotherapy overheard a woman commenting about her hair being short. She said something to the effect of "that look does not become a woman." Well, my wife got in her face and tore her a new asshole. "Maybe some women are growing their hair back after chemo!" I think that was the last time that women will make that mistake. So, there are "traditional" women who are prejudice against women who do not appear "feminine enough."

  3. #3
    Member VS Fan's Avatar
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    Yeah the female equivalent would at the very least involve binding the breasts and then possibly facial hair of some sort - short haircuts as well. Many like to claim that women wearing jeans etc is “cross dressing” which I suppose it would be if they were men’s jeans (vs women’s jeans) but the fact is that crossdressing for men usually involves fake boobs, a wig, makeup etc... so unless you are trying to “present” as the alternate sex, it’s not quite the same.... but yes FtM (female to male) crossdressers do exist! I would say not as common though but I have no stats to back that up other than the relative activity in the MtF section here versus the FtM section...

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    Quote Originally Posted by VS Fan View Post
    Many like to claim that women wearing jeans etc is “cross dressing”...
    Hi
    I’d think it’s more the equivalent of MIAD (WIMCs - women in men’s clothes?)

    Fran

  5. #5
    Gold Member Helen_Highwater's Avatar
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    There are such folks a CD'ing females. the problem is that they're often much harder to identify simply because as it's been pointed out, females dressing in male clothing is nothing new. Women can carry off short hair styles under the guise of being trendy. MTF CD is more obvious because the switch in clothing, the addition of makeup, presentation generally, is more pronounced. FTM would mean no makeup but many GG's don't anyway but it doesn't make them CD.

    There's a section in the forum for Transmasculine and given that within our community there's a spectrum of degree of dressing, it makes sense that such a spectrum exist for the female world. Like those here who move towards transition it's usually a stepped process. Why is it such a leap to think that it happens in a similar fashion for GG's?
    Who dares wears Get in, get out without being noticed

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    Most of the outfits women wear that look like mens clothes are actually made for women so that is not CDing.
    VS fan pretty much nailed it I think.

  7. #7
    New Member JLove's Avatar
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    Stephanie47, I appreciate your insights. Thank you. And good for your wife! What an ignorant thing for that woman to say. I hope your wife is well and healthy.

    Quote Originally Posted by VS Fan View Post
    I would say not as common though but I have no stats to back that up other than the relative activity in the MtF section here versus the FtM section...
    That's kind of what I was thinking. It doesn't seem to be as common or as obvious.

    Helen_Highwater, thank you for your insights - much appreciated! I guess I wasn't so much thinking of GGs who were in the process of transitioning, but GGs who were only interested in dressing as men.

    Thanks to all who have responded! I guess I need to learn more about the technicalities of using the forum, as every time I try to reply individually my post gets merged with my earlier one.

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    Well there are DRAG KINGS.

    Basically the GG version of a drag queen. Dressed in menswear, makeup that creates a beard shadow, and perform songs by male singers.

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    Aspiring Member abbiedrake's Avatar
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    Perhaps this will help. https://www.historyextra.com/period/...ross-dressers/

    Plus the recent BBC drama Gentleman Jim, about a lesbian who dressed as a man.

    And while it's admittedly a stereotype it's one that's a truism that some lesbians still use a close approximation of a male presentation.

    In fact were it not for the greater clothing freedom women now take for granted, it's probable that more women would crossdress in some similar fashion to those of us M2F CDs for whom it's no part of our sexual identity.

    However studies appear to be next to none existent. Hmm. Still a Google search of 'Female to Male Crossdressers' proves instructive. Literally.

  10. #10
    New Member JLove's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by abbiedrake View Post
    Perhaps this will help. https://www.historyextra.com/period/...ross-dressers/However studies appear to be next to none existent. Hmm. Still a Google search of 'Female to Male Crossdressers' proves instructive. Literally.
    Indeed it does! Who knew?! Thanks for your insights, abbiedrake.

    Robertacd, my BF mentioned drag kings when we were chatting. I think I must have lived a very sheltered life, as I'm not sure I'd ever heard of them! Always glad to be educated.

  11. #11
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    This place is the best place to get your education on this stuff.
    Keep in mind what you think you may have known about CD ing is more than likely completely wrong.
    So much to learn here.

  12. #12
    Isn't Life Grand? AllieSF's Avatar
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    Going into San Francisco for fun and enjoyment over the years has brought ma into contact with a few women/younger girls who told me that they crossdressed as a guy, as I was at that time crossdressing as a woman. I do agree that they are not that common to encounter and even harder to identify when the androgynous/almost male look is also used by some lesbians to distinguish themselves from the more feminine lesbians and straight females.

  13. #13
    Carole carhill2mn's Avatar
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    No, you are not "missing something". Since about the '60's women have been able to wear men's clothing without being shamed. In fact, women's clothing were advertised as
    "men's wear' styling for a few years.
    Hugs, Carole

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    There is, indeed, such thing as a ftm cd, as there are drag Kings and trans-men. And there are the Halloween or party equivalents too. And there are very masculine women, straight, bi and gay.

    I can't recall every meeting a habitual ftm cd, but have met plenty of all the other varieties, especially trans men, and Butch girls.

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    JLove, I never heard of a drag king either until I started going to drag shows regularly.

    But since "drag" is really an acronym for dressed as a girl. Shouldn't " Drag Kings" really be called "DRAB Kings"?

    Anyway the Transmen section of this forum used to be called "Female to Male Crossdressers" but the members of that forum lobbied to change the name to "Transmen" because they didn't like being called crossdressers.
    Last edited by Robertacd; 07-30-2019 at 06:55 PM.

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    Super Moderator char GG's Avatar
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    Hi JLove,
    I don't know any FtM crossdressers but I know a FtM transman. He is, of course, on hormones, has a "real beard", and had breast removal surgery. He started to transition in his early 20's and is now in his early 30's.

    I have known this guy since he was a baby so the progression was interesting. He had a rough patch for a while (mainly due to lack of a girlfriend) but seems happy now.

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    I have seen some very masculine looking bull-dykes. Short hair in a man's hairstyle, men's clothing, trying to present as a man. Wouldn't this be considered crossdressing?

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    Nvlady those would be butch lesbians in most cases.
    Technically dressing like a man but not presenting as a man and presenting as a lesbian.
    Last edited by Tracii G; 07-30-2019 at 04:58 PM.

  19. #19
    Aspiring Member abbiedrake's Avatar
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    Don't go overboard with the politic correctness there, nvlady! Lol

  20. #20
    Another fine dress AngelaYVR's Avatar
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    Whatever the reasons a woman has to wear men’s clothing (actual men’s, not women’s clothes cut in a masculine style), it is still technically cross dressing. I’m not too sure why the women are being given a pass on this from some members.

    Saying that without a fake beard (or some such extra thing) a women is not a CD means that the members here who only wear women’s undies or dresses but no makeup or padding are also NOT cross dressing!

  21. #21
    Resident Polymath MarinaTwelve200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robertacd View Post
    JLove, I never heard of a drag king either until I started going to drag shows regularly.

    But since "drag" is really an acronym for dress as a girl. Shouldn't ",Drag Kings" really be called "DRAB Kings"

    Anyway the Transmen section of this forum used to be called "Female to Male Crossdressers" but the members of that forum lobbied to change the name to "Transmen" because they didn't like being called crossdressers.

    DRAG being an acronym is only a fairly recent thing.---When first used it was an old theatre term for costume type and not crossdressing. "Medieval drag", "Cowboy Drag", for instance like the ERA or type of costuming ---and not for simply dressing like a woman. In early to mid 20th century the word "Drag" used alone usually DID begin refer to it's present day meaning, and eventually used so much so as to mean its present day definition. It became an acronym when it was discovered it COULD stand for Dressed like a girl---and thought to be so "clever" that it stuck.

    But again to determine if there are indeed F 2 M crossdressers we have to look at the REASONS FOR crossdressing that may vary. Many Straight Crossdressers take issue with "Gay Crossdressers" or "Transsexuals" who identify with the opposite sex. As much crossdressing is done for other reasons, fetish, escape, S&M, etc. -----I suppose the same would apply to Females as well as Males----Just that there are much FEWER Bio-Females who are into CD.

  22. #22
    Girl about Town Jodie_Lynn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Fran-K View Post
    Hi
    I’d think it’s more the equivalent of MIAD (WIMCs - women in men’s clothes?)

    Fran
    Shouldn't that be WIMP's? "Women In Men's Pants?"
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    Hi Jodie Lynn

    I’m usually pretty good at coming up with acronyms but today, fuhgeddaboudit ...
    So I bow to your superior acronymity ;-)

    Fran

  24. #24
    Gold Member Alice Torn's Avatar
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    More and more, i have to do double takes, to decide whether many women, are women or me, due to so many women with very short haircuts, like mens, and wearing clothing very much like men's. Especially my baby boomer generation women over 50/

  25. #25
    Nylons lover GeorgeA's Avatar
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    AngelaYVR wrote:
    Saying that without a fake beard (or some such extra thing) a women is not a CD means that the members here who only wear women’s undies or dresses but no makeup or padding are also NOT cross dressing!
    Yes, we MIADs consider ourselves crossdressers and discussion here is whether there is a female equivalent to MIAD, eg. wearing the clothes but not presenting as the opposite sex. Many women do fall into this category.
    GeorgeA
    formerly Salerba

    "a miad" Man-in-a-Dress

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