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Thread: Updat re not everybody is accepting

  1. #1
    Silver Member Bobbi46's Avatar
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    Updat re not everybody is accepting

    Another friend down the pan! when will this all end? am I going to have no expat friends near me now? I have no clue as to what to expect next. The latest Developement happened this last Saturday, every year we have an "End of year lunch" this is totally free and funded by our village hall it is only for those of retirement age, I have mentioned previously about the friends I have round me well one couple who have been good to me and I thought were totally on board with me now I am thinking a little differently. A while ago the nearest of my ex pat friends saw me dressed in town and I had coffee with him (Steve) he told me then he was abpout 99% Ok with things now whether he has spoken to another expat (Paul) I think possibly because this last Saturday at the end of year meal I happened to sit next to Paul who I greeted as I normally do but the conversation dwindled right away and he spoke to me no more! even when the meal had finished he did not say goodbye or anything but his wife gave me a kiss on the cheek plus these last three Saturdays I have not seen them at my brasserie.
    I feel I have lost another friend but hope not.
    It seems to me that it is the GG's that look to be accepting of us, all of the women I know are OK ether seeing me dressed or know I dress.
    I maybe reading this wrongly but I feel I am on a slippery slope here, but for me there is and never will be any turning back from where I am now with my dressing within my community here.
    I will have to wait and see.
    I started life a lost man now I am a found woman

  2. #2
    Platinum Member Teresa's Avatar
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    Bobbi,
    Maybe time to spread your wings a little and seek something new to find new friends . It's a bit of a double whammy , you have older expat friends who have known you in male mode and you have no TG social group to fall back on .

    I do find more GGs in my painting group are on board but that's not exclusive .

    I would suggest you don't back down on being Bobbi , your true friends will come through . I guess you could try and play host and throw a dinner party to celebrate Xmas or the New Year and see if that gesture wins them over . Don't forget you are still a valuable member of your community , your acceptance with the locals has been wonderful .

    I wonder if some people become expats because they don't like how "Old Blighty " is changing and they are clinging onto dated values .
    The real me ,no going back.

  3. #3
    Silver Member Helen_Highwater's Avatar
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    Bobbi,

    Is it a possibility that you could grab the bull by the horns so to speak and ask Steve if he knows why Paul was so off with you. It obviously needs a little tact as you don't want to make Steve feel he's done something wrong. He may be willing to impart an honest opinion as to what if anything is causing folks to shy away from you, okay other than the obvious that you CD and they're uncomfortable with it.

    Have some fallen into the trap of CD = Gay and therefore, certainly as far as blue blooded males go, you're not their cup of tea?
    Who dares wears Get in, get out without being noticed

  4. #4
    Senior Member Jean 103's Avatar
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    Ok I'll try again another way.

    You are a woman. Think how women and men interact with each other and why.

    This is your problem, you are now part of the other team. They have accepted you and that's where you belong. You are no longer one of the guys.

    How that relates to these friends is instead of being and addressing the men first , you should be with the women.

    If you want to remain part of this group you need to see that you are no longer the same in their eyes. The guys are the ones that will have the biggest problem dealing with you.

    I have a guy friend that I worked with years ago that I didn't want to loose when I came out. I friended his wife on FB. I came out to her and told her that I didn't want to loose her husband as a friend. I asked if she would help me. As it turned out I didn't have to do any of this, but by coming out the way I did , I became closer to his entire family. The down side is he still treats me the same, as guy. This is basically what I asked for by wanting to maintain this relationship. So I have accepted that this is just how this relationship is going to be. I'm actually going to be seeing him in a few hours. I will be in, well my guy mode. It's a bit girly , I wear my hair in a ponytail and no makeup. Im going to be helping him with a construction project, if I wear going to a party I would wear a dress. I have been to many parties at his house wearing a dress. It is kinda crazy, I can go there representing either way and they treat me the same.

    Now everyone and relationship is different. And I'm sorry that it's not going the way you want.

    One of the first people I came out to was a roommate I had at the time. I had been living there for six months. He was one of three, all guys. At first he was ok, I couple days later he came unglued, I had by than came out to the other two, they defended me.

  5. #5
    Silver Member Micki_Finn's Avatar
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    So was he actually a friend to start with?

  6. #6
    Member MonicaPVD's Avatar
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    It can be hard to reconcile the fact that there will always be people who are uncomfortable with gender identity, especially people of a certain age. Today, the media bombard us with constant messaging about non gender conforming people, dozens of alleged gender variations, non binary folx, etc etc etc. This can all be exhausting and overwhelming for people who trend conservative and are perfectly happy believing that the world population should be divided between manly men and feminine women. Not sure there's anything you can do beyond giving them space and hope they become somewhat enlightened.

  7. #7
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    I found during my lifetime that many people are fearful of anything different. They seem to want to just "follow the crowd." The want to be part of the herd. I've stated many times I get the impression wives may be accepting of their husband's cross dressing desires, but, only in the home. Since cross dressing is outside the normal activities of the vast majority of men there is fear others will say something akin to "What's wrong with her? Her husband is a cross dresser!" Then comes the cold shoulder and exclusion from day to day interactions. I know men who will not watch a television show because the host or actor is known to be gay or lesbian, whether or not the person is acting a gay or lesbian role. It almost seems their "manliness" is going to be tainted or lost because they interact with anyone different than the herd. I'm sure everyone on this site has encountered people who have negative feelings to varying degrees towards any sexual minority.

    You cannot change some people's minds. They just will not accept someone they dislike for any irrational reason. All I can recommend is to keep putting yourself out there. Ultimately, you'll find many people will see you for your inner self.

  8. #8
    Silver Member Aunt Kelly's Avatar
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    I believe that you've hit the nail on the head, Jean. Like it or not, right or wrong, our gender has no small effect on how others relate to us. Bobbi's women friends now relate to her not just differently, but in a way could not have when she was "on the other team". It is now safe ( for lack of a better term) to relate to her in ways that only those of the same gender can.
    The now estranged male friend has the opposite problem. Yes, homophobia may be at play there, but an old friend has fundamentally changed the dynamic. It is easy to believe that "I'm still me", but to him, she most definitely is not. For those who've had no experience dealing with "this thing of ours", that change is going to be disorienting, even frightening.

  9. #9
    Weirdest woman ever! docrobbysherry's Avatar
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    What Micki said. Plus, many men's masculinity can be easily threatened. That's why women r more T friendly.

    And, why so many vociferously anti gay men turn out to be gay. They HATE that they r that way!
    U can't keep doing the same things over and over and expect to enjoy life to the max. When u try new things, even if they r out of your comfort zone, u may experience new excitement and growth that u never expected.

    Challenge yourself and pursue your passions! When your life clock runs out, you'll have few or NO REGRETS!

  10. #10
    Silver Member Bobbi46's Avatar
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    Helen,
    You raise a good point re Steve, i have tread very carefully with this just in cas Steve has said nothing and the ball is entirely in Paul's side of the net.
    Micki,
    Paul has not been such a deep friend as Steve has (we share similar ex professions) also Steve helped me through my divorce as well, but right now it's looking as though another expat is withdrawing except his wife at the village dinner bade me goodbye very nicely.
    Monica,
    Very true previously all of my friends just knew me as the macho Bob and then all of a sudden they have to contend with Bobbi the woman the thing is nearly all of the women i know have no problems with me being as I amits been said before its the men that have the difficulty comprehending the why's and wherefore's.
    Stephanie,
    i am not going to let a little glitch like this spoil what I have got now, I have invested in so much not so much materialy but mentally in developing my lifestyle and dealing with how my life is now.
    Kim,
    very true pondering and wondering about which way something is going is in a way counterproductive and as you say "just keep being yourself" which is what i am doing.

    However one point i must make here is that being part of an expat community friends are not as prolific as grapes on a vine in effect in the end one ends up with (in my case) 4 local friends so possibly losing one is in one respect not a thing to ponder too much. life goes on, my life is going on and life moves on.

    Each Christmas Paul and Dianne and Steve and Gill give me a joint present for Christmas and in turn I give them presents so when I get to take Paul and Diannes present down how I get treated will exhibit whether I have lost or not.
    I started life a lost man now I am a found woman

  11. #11
    Member Kelli_cd's Avatar
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    I'm just curious. Is there a chance you could talk with Dianne and ask her? You know, have a woman to woman chat over coffee or something?

  12. #12
    Silver Member Bobbi46's Avatar
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    It's certainly a thought, but before Christmas there is our usual brasserie morning, every Saturday I go to the same brasserie for coffee and usualy Paul and Dianne go as well if they are there next Saturday i may well be able to find something out.
    I started life a lost man now I am a found woman

  13. #13
    Member rhonda's Avatar
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    Maybe the gg trying to get her husband to dress and he's resisting

  14. #14
    Silver Member Bobbi46's Avatar
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    Kim,
    For sure what you say is bang on, whilst Dianne is friendly towards me there is absolutely no reason to cast either of them adrift, I will endeavour to keep what there is between us safe, secretly I think Dianne can understand the whole aspect of our lives as a whole.
    rhonda,
    As far as I can tell I don't think that is on the agenda paul comes over as being too macho! but who knows I feel Dianne has a greater level of acceotance and understanding just like the rest of all of the other women i know.
    I started life a lost man now I am a found woman

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