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Thread: Interesting Question...

  1. #26
    New Member Breeheels's Avatar
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    For me Its totally the feel. I am hypertactile due to being on the autism spectrum. The feel of feminine things, satin and leather is one thing that draws me in. In my current relationship and employment I am able to dress in full lingerie daily. Bra, panties, hosiery, suspender belts or girdles. My day just goes better when im dressed like this. Im pretty sure dressing is part of my stimming for my ASD. My partner is quite ok coming home from work and seeing me in a satin maids dress and full lingerie and heel cooking dinner for us.

  2. #27
    Silver Member Maria 60's Avatar
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    A mirror does complete the finale touch, but come to think of it when I was younger I had all my stuff ditched in a storage room. I would dress in that storage room and I would rarely leave that space but if I did I'm not going to lie I would go straight to the mirror at my first chance. I believe my answer would be yes I would still do it.

  3. #28
    Silver Member Kandi Robbins's Avatar
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    Without mirrors or cameras would one go to the gym? Comb their hair? Shave? Wear something other than sweats?

    Part of doing what we do is working at our craft, honing our look. Sure, there is some narcissism in there but we cannot evolve without evaluating what we did.
    Pictures and stories of every time out: https://www.flickr.com/photos/131254150@N06/.

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  4. #29
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    I visited another site with a crossdressing forum and read a thread with the title Crossdressing as a sexual release... A young person posted a comment that really resonated with me...

    My sexuality is all kinds of messed up and odd anyway, and there's definitely an autosexual narcissistic element for me which might be connected to that occasional arousal when dressing - that I desire my female self.
    There is a way in which what I create when I dress is a person I want to be sexual with... I desire this person... I guess it must be my feminine self as I imagine her. As I wrote earlier, we seldom get close to the ideal we carry in our minds, but it is still there. I've not attempted to pass and haven't spent time with other folks engaged in this particular kind of play, so I don't anything about the social that can happen... perhaps like I'd experience at a camera club, for example. But what we really want is appreciation for our feminine self... to know we're attractive... desirable? Yes, it does very much have the ring of narcissism... remembering that Narcissus loved seeing his reflection in the pond.
    Last edited by Visitor; 10-16-2020 at 09:07 PM.
    We shall not cease from exploration, and the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time...
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  5. #30
    There's that smile! CarlaWestin's Avatar
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    The early beginnings of my crossdressing experience was to take a short cut to physically being with my own secret dream girl. Then someone mentioned here, "We girls do love our pictures!"
    So every dress up session included a photoshoot. Then video. Then photos and video while out. Then photos and video while out dressed in near costume embellished outfits, pushing the personal
    challenge envelope. I want to see myself in a mirror and in print and video. It takes some ongoing creativity to keep the adventure exciting.
    Oh, and every photo session has the same shot of Carla and her favorite prop, the mirror.
    I've waited so long for this time. Makeup is so frustrating. Shaking hands and I look so old. This was a mistake.
    My new maid's outfit is cute. Sure fits tight.
    And then I step into the bedroom and in the mirror, I see a beautiful woman looking back at me.
    Smile, Honey! You look fabulous!

  6. #31
    Member Brandi Christine's Avatar
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    One thing I forgot to mention is that I have no other outlet for my crossdressing other then a hotel room, pictures & the mirror are it for now... When I was going out dressed (limited to the hotel halls & lobby, and a few outings slightly beyond that) the camera & mirrors were not there of course, and in her original question my wife did make allowances for a makeup mirror. If I were of a mind to actually move forward maybe that behavior would change, but where I am at now, it fits.

    I was curious about the AGP thing though, part of the theory is that you are creating your ideal partner, and that AGP is also a narcissistic paraphyllia. It seems I fit that definition, but AGP as it was defined by the DSM has fallen out of favor due to political pressure. Now everyone is just labeled as trans...
    ...Damsel in distress.
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  7. #32
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    Hi Brandi , I am sure that I would still dress as I just love the feeling of being dressed, >Orchid .oooo.
    Having my ears triple pierced is AWESOME, ~~......

    I can explain it to you, But I can't comprehend it for you !

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  8. #33
    Platinum Blonde member Ressie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brandi Christine View Post
    I was curious about the AGP thing though, part of the theory is that you are creating your ideal partner, and that AGP is also a narcissistic paraphyllia. It seems I fit that definition, but AGP as it was defined by the DSM has fallen out of favor due to political pressure. Now everyone is just labeled as trans...
    Good old fashioned transvestites still exist.

    If I'm not AGP, I at least have had AGP thoughts and moments throughout my life. There are many things that are sexually arousing to me yet CDing has become the focus and the ultimate turn on. I'm not creating my ideal partner, but she's pretty hot!

    Don't worry about labels except how you label yourself
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  9. #34
    Resident Polymath MarinaTwelve200's Avatar
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    I never could quite get a "image" of my fem self by using a mirror. It is only by photographs can I see "Marina" properly and judge her appearance. I suspect that in a Mirror, one gets only 1 POV and I tend to focus on specific things rather than the image as a whole. I find with photos I can see the "complete image"----and I also can pose and arrange myself to minimize any disparaging masculine characteristics and see what I would REALLY look like as a woman.------I also get to try out different makeup and looks and have a record of them.

    Although I CD to entirely "relax" and "take a vacation" from my male self, I Have noticed that there is a hint of AGP in my psyche too.---(I am very big into psychology, even though I am a physical Scientist)--AGP is STILL Legit for people interested in pure Science and not sucking up politically. An occasional review of my pics can often save me the "bother" of having to dress up at times when it may be awkward or inconvenient to do so.
    Last edited by MarinaTwelve200; 10-18-2020 at 07:53 AM.

  10. #35
    Senior Member phili's Avatar
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    I enjoy all these ways the mirror and photos help me see myself as others might see me.

    I remember, though, as a kid I did not use mirrors- I just looked down at myself from chest down and thrilled to the sights. In a dress or skirt, I twirled and felt that, and then, realizing I was in a world of other people, I looked down and watched my hem flare, and then over my shoulder to see if it looked like what I thought it looked like. I was of course mimicking girls twirling and thrilling to it and checking to see if anyone else was looking- hoping they would be enthusiastically approving and perhaps fearing they weren't. That was the let down- that there was no one who I could check with.

    I have come to think the AGP style narcissism or self-infatuation as the way you feel when desperately lonely. Once I spent time dressed with others as a normal part of my week, I no longer felt 'in love' with myself as a woman, I just was happy that I was one. [Ok- GGs- only in the most superficial way- I accept that].

    The same transformation applied to the sexual thrill. I thought I was a fetishist, and certainly my behavior seemed that way. But after going out I realized that I am simply feminine in my sexuality, and in ordinary settings that recedes to just being the ordinary sexuality a woman has that is not being made explicit, but is implied in our dress and manner. And, of course, is not the true female sexuality in all its many deep ramifications, but is a male version which for many suitors is just fine..

    And, the funny thing is that my appearance is so off the charts wrong that I use the mirror to confirm that I am ok- in my eyes!!
    Last edited by phili; 10-18-2020 at 10:00 AM.
    We are all beautiful...!

  11. #36
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    I have to break down my response to two issues; mirror and camera.

    I'll take the camera first. The last time I took pictures of myself was over forty years ago. It was ancient times. I had to use a camera with film. You youngsters may have to "google" that. It comes along with using a telephone with a dial. It was a disk camera with a timer. The film was on a disk. Anyway, so much for history. I took the pictures because I wanted to see what I looked like without a mirror. I was terrified that the person developing the pictures would see I was a man wearing dresses. The pictures actually came out rather nice. I was in my early 30's. Of course, one could not see that I was six foot tall. I will ask a question for those who endlessly take pictures. How many pictures do you actually take in the same outfit with the same makeup and the same wig before you're actually satisfied with the picture? Doesn't it actually indicate to anyone else seeing you that you may be one of those deleted pictures?

    The mirror? I do not spend anytime after donning my clothes and wig in front a mirror. No excessive preening. No twirling. Just like being in male mode I do have to comb my hair or wig. I do forego makeup because it is time consuming and with an aged face with male structure makeup does not help at all. The GG's I know do not use a lot of makeup. To me it seems like a female ritual to attract a partner.

    I've made the comment many times that the eye sees what the mind wants to see. When I see pictures of myself in male mode sometimes I am horrified. "I actually look like that? Yikes!" IMHO, pictures are how others see me, not how I think I am seen. All those deleted pictures you take are actually how others would see you if you were to go out, not the image you see staring back at you in the hotel mirror or the mirror in the bedroom.

    The aging process is part of life. That image on yourself in your 20's and 30's is not going to be around in your 70's and 80's. GG's do not stop being women when they hit their 70's and 80's. I am more of a cross dresser in my 70's than I was in my 20's and 30's. A more confident person, accepting who I have become.

  12. #37
    Silver Member LilSissyStevie's Avatar
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    My relationship with the mirror is that I need it to apply makeup but once I'm done I don't want to see the result too clearly. The whole point of makeup for me is to obscure (annihilate) my natural features whereas GGs use it to enhance theirs. So I learn makeup techniques from Drag Queens since they are the experts in that area. But Drag style makeup looks best with a little distance. To be pleased with the result I have to remove my glasses and stand back from the mirror. For whatever reason, the look I strive for is reminiscent of the porcelain dolls my grandmother kept in a glass display case. Psychoanalyze THAT! lol!

    AGP theory really helped me understand myself but one part that didn't ring true for me was the bit about Erotic Target Location Error. That theory says that AGP is the result of an inverted sexual attraction. In other words, AGPs are attracted to the girl within (or in the mirror) rather than other people. I don't think that's true in my case. My objective in dressing up is to obliterate any sign of masculinity. The reason that it is sexually arousing is that I now feel free to be sexual. In my masculine state I'm so full of past emasculating traumas, hangups, anxiety, dysfunction, and PTSD that I have trouble having any sexual feelings. In my emasculated state the sexual floodgates can open. It helps having an understanding and compassionate mate who is more than a little twisted herself.

  13. #38
    Platinum Member Teresa's Avatar
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    Brandi,
    AGP is a far more reaching issue than it's suggested title ( Autogynephilia roughly translates as to love oneself as a woman ) . I had to look into it away from the forum because it's not accepted or possibly understood here . I felt is rang bells inside me but it wasn't until I asked from an eminent professional about the association with TGs rather than TSs I got a much clearer picture , that's when I really felt I'd found some answers to unanswered questions . Phili's comments do not give the full picture .

    Another description of AGP is to be seen and accepted as a woman which can manifest itself in many ways , the need has proved so strong in some people that they have fully transitioned to satisfy it , it's not totally about sexual or fetish needs .
    The real me , no going back.

  14. #39
    Silver Member Barbara Jo's Avatar
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    FWIW...
    it has been often said the males dress for females. and females dress to impresses other females.
    Mirrors have nothing to do with this other than to assess how well one addresses these issues .

    i suspect that CDs dress to impress females also .
    Last edited by Barbara Jo; 10-18-2020 at 03:49 PM.
    Happiness is not a future condition. It is a Present state of mind.

    "....And it's only the giving that makes you what you are" - Ian Anderson

    "It's all right now, I learned my lesson well..... You see, you can't please everyone, so you got to please yourself." - Ricky Nelson

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  15. #40
    Member DianeT's Avatar
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    My own personal theory about AGP, and it may only concern me: when I go the full nine yards and look at the mirror, I still see myself looking back. But a more elegant and attractive version of me (in my heterosexual eyes). Am I attracted to that person? No. But I can be temporarily attracted to the female cues sent by some parts of my body and figure: the silhouette of the wig, sections of the legs clad in nylon, for example. It's not a lasting thing though, more like flashes of suspension of disbelief when the brains forgets for a split second who is wearing these. I gave some thought to this, trying to understand how, if I didn't want to make love with myself (I don't know that I do, even with my female presentation), I could experience such impulses. The only explanation I could come with is some level of female body objectification. The same that is at work when looking at a nice pair of legs pictured on a billboard and being attracted to that vision even if the entirety of the person they belong to isn't visible (however you may be imagining her). A pair of male legs in nylon isn't distinct enough from its female version to not remind of the latter, especially if you are focusing on the legs and ignoring other parts of the body which scream more "male, maaaale".

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Breeheels View Post
    For me Its totally the feel. I am hypertactile due to being on the autism spectrum. The feel of feminine things, satin and leather is one thing that draws me in. In my current relationship and employment I am able to dress in full lingerie daily. Bra, panties, hosiery, suspender belts or girdles. My day just goes better when im dressed like this. Im pretty sure dressing is part of my stimming for my ASD. My partner is quite ok coming home from work and seeing me in a satin maids dress and full lingerie and heel cooking dinner for us.
    I am with bree on this one. I wouldn't give my dressed side a second look. No wonder it doesn't do anything for the wife. I was wearing a camisole, chest hairs sticking out and facial hair and she made a comment like I looked like a female hobbit or dwarf. We laughed and she kept doing to me what she was doing so all was good. Even with body hair shaved, at 250 mostly muscular lbs, it's not a good look. She does play with me every day no matter what I wear so all is good, but we both know i dont have a good look. I'll send her a pic every now and then, but it's more of a joke than something sexy. Eh, I dont need mirrors or cameras. The tactile and other senses and feedback is good enough.

  17. #42
    New Member KellyTerry1819's Avatar
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    While I do look in the mirror I normally don't like what I see and would be just fine with having just the feeling of what I wear.
    I guess being deep in the closet makes mirrors less useful since it's not like I'm going to show off anything to anyone.
    /kt

  18. #43
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    I absolutely would. I don't do selfies or swish myself in front of the mirror admiring myself. I do use a mirror, but only to check that my outfit looks OK. Once satisfied, I'm off into the world, confident that I'm presentable enough for it. My clothes are about making my inner self happy, not putting on some sort of display.

  19. #44
    Member Brandi Christine's Avatar
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    First off I love the responses, they all make me think, some a lot, about why I do what I do, about who I am...

    Like many of you I understand, and very much like the tactile feeling that women's clothing gives me, I am underdressed this morning, as I usually am, and it gives me a sense of well being, and a touch of femininity. I have underdressed for work occationally, and a few other times and it makes me feel great, just not nearly as great as being fully made up and dressed.

    I also really like This:

    Originally Posted by phili

    Quote Originally Posted by phili View Post
    I have come to think the AGP style narcissism or self-infatuation as the way you feel when desperately lonely. Once I spent time dressed with others as a normal part of my week, I no longer felt 'in love' with myself as a woman, I just was happy that I was one. [Ok- GGs- only in the most superficial way- I accept that].

    As a "girl" I am desperately lonely, there is and has only been me & my hotel room (and for now that is all there can be) so I fill that void with the mirror & pictures. Maybe in the future, but my wife would have to be OK with it, there can't be any going behind her back with this, and it is a very difficult lifestyle for her to understand. I would truly love the opportunity to get out with a few "girls" for a GNO, but it is out of the question for now if not for ever, she is very much concerned that it would be a slippery slope.

    Another part of the AGP that applies to me is fixating & fantasizing about me being the woman in a relationship (or more precisely a sex act). My sexual fantasies have been me as the girl since high school, my romantic fantasies had me as the guy, and the sex (with the girl) takes place behind curtains as is a classic novel. I have always been attracted to and dated women (and have been married for 17 years), never liked or been infatuated with men, but that is who I fantasized about, my ELTE is me and I'm having sex with men in those fantasies. This has caused huge issues in my marriage, sexual issues we are addressing since I came out to her as a crossdresser, and yes it was my wife who brought AGP up to me. I was convinced that because of these fantasies and a few other things I was a trans candidate, that is where my therapist took me, from me questioning my crossdressing and wanting to know why, to a quickly offered ticket on the trans train. My wife has given me at least a piece of the puzzle as to why I think the way I do, and a good reason not to "chop my giblets off" as some put it... For now we are working things out, with difficulty, but she has been far more accepting then I ever thought she could be.

    There is a writer names Rod Fleming, he has some good information regarding AGP as well as other trans issues at a site called the medium, I recommend checking his writings out. He has some very interesting takes on crossdressing, transgenderism & homosexuality.
    ...Damsel in distress.
    Not exactly natural, Stunning none the less...

    (As Girls Go by Suzanne Vega)

  20. #45
    Senior Member phili's Avatar
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    This is so fascinating! such a rich trove of reflective persooal imagery about mirrors and our interplay with them, and the 'lenses' through which our cameras see us!

    I love the mirrors I just installed in my remodeled master bath- a 3 door medicine cabinet on one side and full mirror closet doors on the other, in a big white box. It is like the perfect photo studio- luminous and spacious and yet there I am from all sides! And when I try to take a pic in there it is all about angles and distortion and stray things appearing out of the top of my head. I much prefer my patio garden setting where I can enjoy an image of me framed by ceramic art and nature's beauty.

    Since I sew/alter so many of my own clothes, and have lots of choices for -say blouse and skirt options, I need the mirror to see what the color and line balance is- as a designer what length of skirt or how much overlap of my blouse, or which color shoes makes the scene visually satisfying with my proportions, skin and hair color.
    We are all beautiful...!

  21. #46
    Reality Check Krisi's Avatar
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    I can see my boobs and hips and hair without a mirror. And I can feel them as well. I would still dress.
    Krisi

  22. #47
    Silver Member Barbara Jo's Avatar
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    In reality, the same question could be asked of females,.... . if they need a mirror to dress feel, and act feminine.

    Fact is, all through the ages, females have liked clothes that make them feel and look feminine
    That is no different than males who strive to look and feel masculine
    Happiness is not a future condition. It is a Present state of mind.

    "....And it's only the giving that makes you what you are" - Ian Anderson

    "It's all right now, I learned my lesson well..... You see, you can't please everyone, so you got to please yourself." - Ricky Nelson

    "It is hard to imagine a more stupid or more dangerous way of making decisions than by putting those decisions in the hands of people who pay no price for being wrong." -Thomas Sowell

  23. #48
    Oh to be an English Rose Jane G's Avatar
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    It's a lovely feeling to see myself in the mirror dressed. But it is just reinforcing what is there anyway So I don't think it would change a thing if there were no mirrors in my life.

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