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Thread: Will CD ever be acceptable?

  1. #26
    Silver Member Aunt Kelly's Avatar
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    Oh my... you must be new here.
    In fact, crossdressing has never had a better image. In the civilized world at least, TG people are enjoying unprecedented levels of acceptance. Things are far from perfect, but they are far better than they were even just a generation or two ago. Nobody is arrested for being a crossdresser anymore. Drag shows are a hit on prime time TV. But still, transgender women, particularly women of color, are still being murdered at an alarming rate. The haters are out there, but they are now the exception, by far.
    Candykowal is correct. We don't need "special" rights, but we damned sure deserve the same rights as everybody else. The gay community didn't get the status they now enjoy without decades of in-your-face activism and just as much time showing the world that they are still normal human beings. We, the TG community, don't enjoy that level of acceptance yet. That will change when the fearful and ignorant are shown that they have nothing to fear and that the law applies to all, equally. That's on us, the community.
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  2. #27
    Platinum Member Teresa's Avatar
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    Aunt Kelly,
    While in the UK we don't appear to have the fear , hate and violence in some parts of the US I do agree the only ones who are going to change the situation are members of the TG community .

    Angela,
    That is part of the problem , while some are comfortable hidden in the closet but still fear being seen by neighbours . That's why I made a point about telling all my neighbours as soon as I moved into my new home , if there's less of a secret there's less of a problem , OK acceptance didn't happen overnight .
    The real me , no going back.

  3. #28
    Aspiring Member Geena75's Avatar
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    As far as acceptance goes, I can tell you a story. This was about 20 years ago, before I realized that I am actually a cross dresser. I was at the time a department manager in a major retailer. I noticed a cross dressed man in one of the tool aisles -- very easy to tell the individual was CD. I sent an associate to the aisle to assist. My guy came back looking all embarrassed, and I approached him and told him, "Now tell me why that individual deserved any less service than anyone else in this store." My point was made. I wasn't out to promote any cause other than treating people right. Does that qualify as acceptance?

  4. #29
    Platinum Member Beverley Sims's Avatar
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    Yep! the year after they perfect cows delivering chocolate milk. :-)
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    and beauty will follow.

  5. #30
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    I think it will because I am an optimist.

    However I think its a long way off as I dont feel like everyone on here accepts it, and if on a crossdressing site we don't what hope is there for the rest of the world to do so any time soon.

  6. #31
    Reality Check Krisi's Avatar
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    Crossdressing has not been acceptable since the beginning of recorded history and it's unlikely that this will change.
    Krisi

  7. #32
    What a great life
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    In the past gays wasn't ether.

  8. #33
    Silver Member Aunt Kelly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Krisi View Post
    Crossdressing has not been acceptable since the beginning of recorded history and it's unlikely that this will change.
    So.. you don't believe that crossdressing is any more accepted today than it was even, let's say twenty years ago? Really?
    Also, "recorded history" covers a lot of time. If you take some time to research it, you will find that your assertion may be a bit hyperbolic.
    Last edited by Aunt Kelly; 03-04-2021 at 02:06 PM.

  9. #34
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    " Not in our lifetime" is accurate IMHO.

    Today's acceptance is not acceptance at all - it's a charade - the TG washroom is almost always segregated under the guise of tolerance - it is not the women's washroom.

    If this was done because of another physiological reason - it would be considered an outrage

    It's faux acceptance.

    Almost all men who would show up en femme to their workplace would shortly be unemployed IMHO because their choice of attire makes others " uncomfortable".

    Most of the sociological data shows few people are interested in true gender equality, for all our talk, gender roles have not changed much.

    When it is legal for a CD man to use the women's washroom and it is accepted as normal - we will be on our way...

    Men are still expected to be strong, protective and high wage earners.
    Last edited by kellyanne; 03-04-2021 at 11:12 AM.

  10. #35
    Aspiring Member DianeT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AngelaYVR View Post
    Expecting some sort of mass acceptance seems fruitless when you are up against the (largely factual) typical view that CDs are lurking at home for their own self pleasure.
    Angela, thanks for the "lurking" qualifier. As a home crossdresser who doesn't care about going out, I feel so accepted suddenly.

  11. #36
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    😂
    I?m a lurker always have been

  12. #37
    Silver Member Aunt Kelly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kellyanne View Post
    Almost all men who would show up en femme to their workplace would shortly be unemployed IMHO because their choice of attire makes others " uncomfortable".
    Depending on how we define "almost all", that may be true. Nevertheless you are ignoring two important facts: 1) Many, many companies (especially the largest ones) now have inclusive policies that would prevent this kind of treatment. The federal government has once again (by executive order) made such discrimination illegal. That change has occurred largely in the last decade or two. Then there's this turn of events.
    2) In the civilized world, no one is arrested and imprisoned anymore for being TG. That is a huge change and took place in the last forty years (less than the average lifetime of most members here). Where I live, crossdressing ceased to be a crime only 40 years ago. Ten years ago, here in Houston, Mayor Anise Parker appointed the first openly transgender judge in our nation's history.

    Look, the examples of ignorance and hatred abound. Bathroom bills (so 2016) and the latest round of hate legislation that would make providing treatment to TG juveniles a crime, are ample evidence that we have a ways to go, but to say that we have not made progress is just not true.
    "Being honest may not get you a lot of friends, but it will always get you the right ones."
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  13. #38
    Platinum Member Teresa's Avatar
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    KellyAnne,
    You don't divulge much in your personal details so we can't judge how much you are in the closet or out in the RW but I don't think I've read so much rubbish in a long time .

    You have to consider how insulting and illinformed it is to call it a charade , I've found nothing is off limits if you present acceptably , washrooms /toilets in the UK really aren't a big deal .
    Even a woman can make others uncomfortable if she wears the wrong things .

    With far more single parent famillies women have proved they can take on the traditional male roles , far more men are accepting role reversal with the wife/partner being the main wage earner .
    The real me , no going back.

  14. #39
    maxi midi closets's Avatar
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    can't imagine cding will ever be accepted, and reine makes a good point. you'd think w increased trans awareness, there would be more cd/trans/etc. out, but it's just not the case. also, i found that people just assume i'm trans, and it's a mixed bag of reactions.

  15. #40
    GG ReineD's Avatar
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    There are too few of you for it to ever become mainstream. Media personalities who exhibit gender variance seem to get away with it because a lot of people don't take the gender variance seriously. Many people, if they think of it at all, see it as perhaps just another brand or stunt to garner publicity.

    We can all hope for increasing social acceptance for racial minorities and sexual/gender diversity in the mainstream, but we seem to be going backwards. Where I was once hopeful that any type of diversity would continue to gain ever more social acceptance, I'm afraid I've lost that hope, at least in the foreseeable future. Hate crimes have been on the rise, see the article I posted in the Media section here. So the best anyone can do, is to cultivate and live in bubbles: small groups of people from within which to be either accepted or tolerated ... just as long as those who tolerate keep their opinions to themselves.

    Of course this all depends on where a person lives. In North America there are most definitely regional areas where the population at large is more liberal than conservative (even though there are conservative pockets within generally liberal areas), and urban vs suburban and rural.

    It also helps if one can look neutral - not like a woman necessarily, but not obviously like a man who is trying to present as a woman.
    Reine

  16. #41
    Rural T Girl Teri Ray's Avatar
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    Might not be acceptable everywhere, but try this web site "www.crossdressers.com" I think its OK there.
    Teri Ray Rural Idaho Girl.

  17. #42
    Senior Member GretchenM's Avatar
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    I could not agree more Reine. For the foreseeable future and mostly in the United States, but also elsewhere, progress will be slow at best and may very well go backwards some. We are a small minority, actually much smaller than gay and lesbian. If racial equality is so difficult to achieve in this world where there is so much hate and everybody's personal opinion is viewed as the truth it is pretty hard for gender equality of the tiny group of the gender variant to gain much traction. Acceptance is sketchy right now and sometimes a bit of stretch except by only some people who accept variability without tight limits imposed. Tolerance has increased by leaps and bounds but real acceptance where nobody really cares and you are treated like everyone else is next to non-existent. Noticing you are "dressed in the wrong clothes" is very much a part of acceptance; but what isn't acceptance is making an issue of it. And in the last several years making issues of anything that does not fit the public norms is fair game.

    However, I am optimistic about the distant future simply because the truth always wins in the end. And the truth is that variability is the norm. We, like nearly all living things, are diverse on many scales and gender variance is one of those scales. It exists because it is a part of the processes that creates diversity. In my opinion, gender variant people have made great progress since before about 1960, but the road ahead is a long and potentially hazardous one so long humans in general hate to embrace the vast degrees of diversity present in our species.

  18. #43
    Administrator Di's Avatar
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    Will crossdressers ever be accepted?

    I would like to hope so
    BUT
    Reading here it seems like many still are closeted, hidden
    And that’s ok
    But
    People not exposed to it do not even give it any thought / understanding
    And
    Many from reading here struggle accepting themselves. So guess it has to start there .
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  19. #44
    AKA Lexi sometimes_miss's Avatar
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    It will become more widely accepted, but it won't likely become any more sexually attractive to women. There are innate behaviors that we find sexually attractive, which determine whether the opposite sex will want to mate up with us. And women just aren't usually attracted to feminine men. A few are, sure, but in general, there simply aren't enough of them for all of us to have our own. And, there's no way to find them. There are no 'straight girl crossdresser' websites or bars, no matchmaking services for us to meet them. The only 'date a crossdresser' website, is inhabited virtually only by men and male crossdressers (who put on their profile FEMALE, so there's no way to search for actual females there). They also require a membership fee, so if you want to try to contact anyone there, you have to pay for it. And, they have shills, fake profiles of females who contact you and get you to pay for membership to write back to them, and when you try to do so, they either say that they never contacted you, aren't interested, or never respond at all.

    Bottom line, we'll be relegated to the same classification as other types of men that women don't want to date. We'll be tolerated in public, but unwanted in private.
    Some causes of crossdressing you've probably never even considered: My TG biography at:http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...=1#post1490560
    There's an addendum at post # 82 on that thread, too. It's about a ten minute read.
    Why don't we understand our desire to dress, behave and feel like a girl? Because from childhood, boys are told that the worst possible thing we can be, is a sissy. This feeling is so ingrained into our psyche, that we will suppress any thoughts that connect us to being or wanting to be feminine, even to the point of creating separate personalities to assign those female feelings into.

  20. #45
    leggings junkie ellbee's Avatar
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    Definitely some good points/lines from various people here!


    I'll approach this from a slightly different angle...

    First & foremost, one has to *define* CD'ing!


    Example #1...

    Guy gets completely dolled-up, head to toe, the whole kit-&-caboodle. GG looks at him, and thinks to herself: "Okay, that's a really cute top, and he has some great legs. But... WHY?!? "


    Example #2: Guy throws on a women's athleisure outfit consisting of some nice leggings & a comfy hoodie. Everything else about him is male. The response of every GG who enjoys wearing something similar: "Yeah, I totally get that! "


    Okay, obviously I'm over-generalizing & making assumptions, here.

    But if one considers both to be CD'ing, then why such a difference between the GG's internal reactions?


    Anyway, way too many variables, when it comes to acceptance -- or lack thereof.

  21. #46
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    This is an interesting question, and some interesting answers. My personal take is this: there has already been some progress with this issue. But, sadly and as Reine pointed out, we seem to be going backwards the last few years. I have wondered why. I suspect it was because the change has happened slower than the people who need it want and faster than some of the general population can handle. So there is pushback. It's similar to globalisation. There are pockets of the population (same as the ones who strongly object to LGBT and women's equality, strangely) who don't understand or accept that the word works differently these days and if you don't adjust, you will be left behind. So they try hard to hold everyone behind instead. I hope that we'll go back to going forward and this will be just a bump on the road, but not holding much hope for the speed of recovery.

    Elbee, I have a thought about your question. In your first example, you are talking about someone attempting to look like a woman. And straight women are not interested in other women sexually so they do wonder why would you try that, if you are straight yourself. The simplest explanation is that you are gay so you don't present a dating prospect for them. Otherwise, why would you want to present yourself in an inherently off-putting way, the same way as why would you go out in public in filthy clothes and completely disheveled. In your second example, you are wearing clothes. What are women's athleisure clothes by the way? Leggings and a hoodie are unisex, worn by both. I think that makes a huge difference, at least for me.
    Hope everyone is doing well!

  22. #47
    Junior Member Janet Devon's Avatar
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    I live in the midwest USA, I have known only one out TG and she says she gets very little negative attention. So, I do feel that there is some level of acceptance but should I expect equil treatment in every part of life -no. Getting hired while dressed as a woman is highly unlikely. Going to the store, no big deal. Finding a new mate at a bar may be possible but what kind of relationship are they really looking for?

    I am happily married, my wonderful wife accepts what I do with reluctance. If the person who loves you the most can be turned off, what does that say for people who don't care or who don't like you as you were born?

    I don't see society accepting us CDers as cool ever. I see them accepting us as odd but not dangerous - someday. But, I only think that is true if we don't cram it down their throats. I see to many LGBT people trying to make others do things to suit them, like you must make my cake or lose your business. That will drive a deep division.

    Just my opinion but I hope it answers the question.

  23. #48
    Curmudgeon Member donnalee's Avatar
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    Not until crossdressers stop caring whether others like it or not and are prepared to defend themselves if necessary.
    Sorry, but that's what it'll take.
    ALWAYS plan for the worst, then you can be pleasantly surprised if something else happens!

    "The important thing about the bear is not how well she dances, but that she dances at all." - Old Russian Proverb (with a gender change)

  24. #49
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    IHBME that policy and practice are two different things. In my 25 + years in Blue Chip ,corporations, we had the fine and tolerant policies described, but when a man decided he was a woman- he was - laid off promptly and paid the required severance.

    His departure was " unrelated" to his sex change according to management but employees thought otherwise.

    At 60 , I know of no men who present as women in the work place and most women I know would be uncomfortable, for good or ill, in the presence of a such a man dressed as a woman and they would never accept him using their washroom.

    Recently, we had yet another retail incident where a TG man was refused service at a bridal boutique. Why? Socially unacceptable to other women.

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saska...0was%20refused.

    IHBME that companies are progressive on being gay but not on transgenderism.

    Rousseau has an excellent examination of the gender relations and rigidity in C.5 of Emile.

    [SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]

    I am not from the UK and I do not dispute your experience.

    Here in Canada , I know of no widespread acceptance as described.

    This is typical:

    https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saska...0was%20refused.

    Here at our city university, the heart of tolerance, every single TG Washroom is a segregated single person facility despite passage of a law that says otherwise- it's not my wish but as the many married men in this forum indicate vis a vis their SO's no acceptance of their cross dressing, it seems few women are genuinely ready to accept a TG man as a woman.

  25. #50
    leggings junkie ellbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by confused_cathreen View Post
    Leggings and a hoodie are unisex, worn by both.
    Wherever you are, I want to live there!


    Because at least in my part of the country? In the past 20 years, I can count on one hand the number of times I've seen a guy wearing leggings "out in the wild."

    A few as stand-alone pants? They were exercising outdoors (running or biking).

    And a couple *not* exercising? Wearing those 3/4-length ones -- underneath long baggy shorts.


    All were either plain black or a plain dark gray. *snooze*


    And never have I heard/overheard any guy saying something like, "Yeah, I just bought an awesome pair of leggings yesterday!" during the course of an everyday conversation.



    Fact is, the hoodie-&-leggings look is reserved for the GG's where I am.

    Keep in mind, I live in a pretty "progressive" state, too.



    Anyway, *how* the CD'ing is done, and to what level, is definitely at least part of the key to general acceptance.

    Here's the kicker, though: We'll never get there, IMO.

    Accept that natural reality, and simply go from there.

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