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Thread: I'm in need of some dating advice....

  1. #26
    AKA Lexi sometimes_miss's Avatar
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    Long.....

    it's gotta be full disclosure right up front in my opinion...in your profile, upon first meeting, wherever. Anything else is deceptive, and a big time waster for all involved - you might be surprised at the good result
    Disclaimer: This is all what I've learned over the years, they are mostly just my opinions. You are free to disagree, however I would like to invite suggestions as to how we can improve our odds in finding crossdresser accepting women, as so far, we have almost nothing to go on. Despite those who insist that those women exist, there is no current way to find them. And so......

    Trouble is, those 'surprising good results' are extremely rare, as rare as winning the lottery. I'm happy for those who have 'won', but expecting that good result as a way to plan out your life is going to be a huge disappointment for the vast majority of crossdressers. It's the same as the people who sell their house to buy lottery tickets; the chances are actually still very slim, and it's not likely to pay off in the end.
    But what option do we have?
    Well, as over the past 23 years having a profile online on dating sites, getting near zero responses with profiles I had that mention crossdressing (generally only men, and prostitutes, dominatrixes offering their services) I still date as a straight man, and carefully investigate how the woman feels about gender bending men. Little things like randomly adding 'Wong Fu' to our movie watching, or tuning in to RuPaul's show while channel surfing, to see her reaction to it.
    We do get numerous people here, suggesting that there are, indeed, some women who would welcome us into their lives; unfortunately, NONE of them can tell us how to find those women. After all, most women derive some of their social status from that of their male partner, and a crossdresser isn't exactly an admirable type that other women (her friends / co-workers / relatives) would see as a 'good catch', so it's essentially a secret that she can tell no one, and many women feel the need to discuss their conflicting feelings with her friends; holding it in, can feel suffocating to them. In contrast, she will likely be made fun of by those other women, so she's unlikely to want anyone to know that her SO is a crossdresser.
    So where does that leave us?
    Date as a straight man; after all, if you're looking for a woman, you're mostly straight anyway. Carefully, gradually find out how she feels about us. Remember, there are a whole lot of women who are willing to tolerate men who crossdress, as long as it's not THEIR SO. The 'not in my backyard' sentiment is very, very strong in this. I can't site the source, but back in the 1990's after my wife found out about me, and we were seeing a therapist and searching through as much information as we could find about crossdressing and gender bending, there was one interesting book I found, and it had the following information (though, that was over 20 years ago, but all signs show that those stats may still be very close to today's.
    About 6% of all women felt that it's okay for a man to crossdress. About 3% would be okay with having a crossdresser in their life, such as a brother, friend, uncle or such, but not as a mate. And a little under 1.5% would consider dating a crossdresser. When I brought this up to the therapist (who specialized in crossdressers, TS, among other things), she said that of all the couples that she had seen, about half of the women who initially thought that they could accept their SO as a crossdresser, eventually changed their mind and ended the relationship, having realized that she couldn't go on with it. That leaves about 0.75% of women who MIGHT be able to tolerate a relationship with a crossdresser, NOT at all saying that she'd be happy with it. So our chances are very slim indeed. The fascinating thing was, each category was about half the previous one.
    So, if you're going to go by random chance, you're going to have to date well over 100 women to even hope to find one that MIGHT be okay with your crossdressing. And then, of course, there's all the other compatibility problems, for while some here have found a crossdressing tolerating mate, sometimes she's so horrible even that isn't enough to make us want to stay with her. It works both ways. So far, I haven't met any women who could tolerate having a crossdresser as a mate. And that's in the oh, 50+ women that I've dated in the past 20 years. At this rate, I'll be 80 before I get to date 100 different women and gradually try to see if she's okay with a crossdresser, and that's likely too late for me. But at least, I will have some sort of social life.
    The best advice I've gotten, was to befriend gay women, and get them to let you tag along to gay bars perhaps slightly 'en femme', to see if there are any straight women there, who just might be curious about dating someone feminine, but not quite ready yet to date a woman. Perhaps if you pick up signs that she's curious about YOU, you can smile and see if she smiles back. Then go introduce yourself and see where it leads. DO NOT treat it like any other pick up attempt, be friendly and let her take the lead in the questions.
    How do you spot someone who's interested in you? Read Leil Lowndes, 'Undercover Sex Signals'. It goes into detail, WITH PICTURES, of how women behave when they see someone that they are interested in. And it's right on target, I've used that information to completely turn my social life around. Now, I can easily know if my advances are likely to be successful, rather than having spent all of my earlier life, 'barking up the wrong tree'. Us men virtually always go after ONLY the women we find the most attractive, forgetting that those 'most attractive' women are also most likely to already have a SO.... so we are almost always, barking up the wrong tree. Change the odds, and start interacting with women that are giving off lots of IOI's (Indicators Of Interest). It works.
    And last, let's remember that no one tells the other person everything about themselves to the other person. Sure, I didn't tell my ex wife before we got married; I really thought that I had either outgrown crossdressing, or 'beaten it'. After all, at that point I hadn't crossdressed in 10 years. I didn't learn that it was just buried in my subconscious, until it was brought to the conscious level, several years after we got married; then, I simply figured that all the good things about me would surely out weigh the one, little thing, that I crossdressed. Nope; I hadn't understood that when we fall in love, we fall in love not with that person, but what we KNOW about that person, and fall in love with the image we create about what we know about who they are. When that image drastically changes, such as her seeing us as traditionally masculine men, into the image of a feminine guy in a dress, the attraction can easily be destroyed; and then, the romantic love can be destroyed after that, essentially killiing off any romantic desire she had left for us. At least, that's what happened to us, and our marriage didn't survive.

    PS. Leil Lowndes book is currently out of print; Amazon offers it on kindle, you can find the book in used book stores (if you are lucky), or check out the online book sharing sites like z lib that sometimes have it available to loan out.

    Edit 2: Okay, I found the ebook on the same public book sharing site that I saw it on a few years ago, so apparently there's not been any copyright complaints about it being there. https://book4you.org/book/3631585/cbe630

    Perhaps because the pictures aren't real clear, or, as Ms Lowndes stated, she really does want to spread the word about how men can better understand when a woman is interested in them. Either way, the book is worth a read, but if you do find it informative, please buy one of her other books, to help support her. The books she has written have been great information in helping male female communication.
    Good luck. You're going to need a lot of it.
    Last edited by sometimes_miss; 08-28-2021 at 07:10 PM. Reason: found a link to a public book site
    Some causes of crossdressing you've probably never even considered: My TG biography at:http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...=1#post1490560
    There's an addendum at post # 82 on that thread, too. It's about a ten minute read.
    Why don't we understand our desire to dress, behave and feel like a girl? Because from childhood, boys are told that the worst possible thing we can be, is a sissy. This feeling is so ingrained into our psyche, that we will suppress any thoughts that connect us to being or wanting to be feminine, even to the point of creating separate personalities to assign those female feelings into.

  2. #27
    Another fine dress AngelaYVR's Avatar
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    I have in fact mentioned how you find these unicorn women: meet them while dressed and look your very best. Be interesting. Be upbeat. No surprises going forward and you know she already likes it. Are there a lot of these women? Nope. But are there enough that if you are making the effort that you will meet a few? You bet. Apart from that, all the other rules apply: keep fit, look good in both modes (some guys seem to be proud of dressing like slobs). And if you are older, the women you will meet will have experienced their share of awful relationships and will appreciate openness all the more.

    I have zero advice if you are strictly a home dresser and go in for the frilly look!

  3. #28
    I NEVER go bare-legged! Kimberly A.'s Avatar
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    Thank you Sherry, that's good advice!

    [SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]

    Oh wow ladies, thank you ALL for all of the advice, I really do appreciate it!

    So, this reply post is going to be to all, because it would just take too much time and too many posts to reply to each of you individually..... Anyway, I'll start with answering Geena's questions. Honestly, I want to be very open about my CD'ing with the woman who shows interest in dating me. I am a very honest person, I do not like to lie or be deceitful to anyone. Imho, that is a recipe for disaster, especially if you've been dating the person for a while, (let's say a few months) and things get really serious, even up to marriage serious, yet you've kept your secret of CD'ing from that person that entire time. No, I do NOT want to do that, I want to be up-front with her from the get-go and not hide anything. Also Geena, putting it in my profile really wouldn't "out" me to anyone, because I don't know anyone else who is on Plenty of Fish and no one that is currently on that site knows where I live.... Well, I do have the town that I live in on my profile, but of course, not my address. LOL

    Now, to reply to JenniferR..... Thank you as well for your advice. However, I absolutely, positively will NOT lie about the amount of money I have, the car that I drive, or where I live, or lie and tell her that I'm expecting a big inheritance. If a woman can't like me for me, regardless of how much money or stuff that I own, then she is clearly not for me.... Women like that, imho are gold diggers! LOL And as the Beatles sang, "Money can't buy me love!" LOL

    Now replying to all of the rest of you..... Like I said, it was all very good advice but of course, I got mixed advice from all of you. Some of you say "Yes, go ahead and put into your POF profile that you're a CD, be upfront and honest about it". while the rest of you say "No, wait until you're dating a woman for a bit, then come out to her as a CD". Honestly, I have mixed feelings about that myself. While yes, I DO want to be honest and up-front about my crossdressing from the get-go so she doesn't find out about it later on down the road, then it disgusts her and she breaks up with me, I'd rather tell her right off before things begin to get serious..... Does that make sense to y'all? It does to me. LOL

    Although I know that the decision to include my CD'ing on my POF profile is ultimately up to me, I did come here to ask for advice and I'll take every bit of it to heart.

    Somtimes_miss, WOW, what a long post! LOL However, I did read every word of it and I appreciate your advice as well, which of course is not bad advice at all..... I do like the idea of maybe finding lesbian women to hang out with, go to a gay bar with and MAYBE finding a straight, or even bi woman who would show interest in me. Problem with that is though, I don't know any lesbian women who live close to me, or any lesbian women at all, for that matter..... Well, except for my land lady she's gay, but she's kinda getting up in the years and she's just not someone whom I'd wanna hang out with. LOL Also sometimes_miss, back when you read that book in the 1990s, women (or men, for that matter), were not as accepting of gender-fluid people as people are now. And tbh, I'm not sure if I identify as being gender-fluid, because 99.9% of my time is spent in my normal, "male mode". I've also said that I do not identify as being part of the LGBTQ community at all. Some of you might disagree with that, that's fine, but I think that's a personal choice, regardless of what society wants to label me as. Anyway sometimes_miss, I do believe you are 100% correct when you say that finding a woman who would accept her man as a CD'er is few-and-far-between, I do also think that more women are more accepting of it than they were back in the 1990s. I also thank you for the "good luck" wishes, I AM gonna need it, you're not wrong about that! LOL

    I also like the idea of gradually easing her into the fact that I'm a CD, rather than just pretty much shoving it in her face and be like, "Btw, I'm a CD, so now what do you wanna do?" LOL But on the other hand, like I said, I believe in being up-front about it from the get-go, or maybe asking her how she feels about crossdressers before I tell her that I am one.

    Now, more about women around here in my neck of the woods being accepting of a feminine man..... Another thing that I've said on the forums here before is, I've ALWAYS shaved my legs and worn pantyhose, even before I became a crossdresser. I dated women whom I told that to and at first, they said that they were OK with it, they didn't mind at all but then later, it was like they did a complete 180 and said they couldn't take it, so they broke up with me. And that's what I'm saying, down here in the southern US, it IS hard to find a woman who will accept a straight man who does anything even remotely feminine, such as just doing something as simple as shaving his legs.

    I also wanna add one last thing..... For me, looks or weight on a woman means very little to me. But don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a woman who is gorgeous and sexy in the eyes of the majority of society, but I'm one who honestly doesn't have very high standards as far as that goes. No, I'm looking for a woman who will, above ALL, be honest, loyal, will NOT cheat on me or lie to me. Those are the qualities that I look for in a woman.

    Anyway ladies, thank you all again for your advice, I really appreciate it!
    Last edited by Kimberly A.; 08-28-2021 at 09:38 PM. Reason: Adding to my post.
    I may be crazy, but I'm BURIED in your memory!

  4. #29
    Aspiring Member SaraLin's Avatar
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    Kimberly A,

    For what it's worth, here's a thought that I haven't noticed yet.

    Why not add a line to your POF profile that reads something like "Not hung up on traditional male/female roles"?

    It both hints at what you're trying to say without "dropping the bomb" - AND it adds an element of mystery to your persona.
    It would seem that the uptight and unaccepting types would shy away, but the more adventurous or open ones might - just might - think to themselves "Hmmm, I wonder..." and respond.
    You could then start getting to know each other a bit - perhaps even holding the reveal until 2-3 dates in. That way you'll both know if there's any interest in taking things a bit further.
    But please - PLEASE, do it before the "L" word starts getting used!

  5. #30
    Member Gi Gondin's Avatar
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    Thank you for bringing this subject Kimberly. This discussion is one that really matters for all of us that are interested in beginning a honest and probably happy relationship.

    Let’s not forget that CD is just one aspect of our lives, a permanent one, but there are many others. I’m stating this to emphasize that RESPECT and TOLERANCE are basic traits that lead to CD acceptance. They do not guarantee but are necessary conditions and they should not be average in this person, they must flourish. If I ever need again (hope not) to find a partner, thats what I will look for in the beginning.

  6. #31
    Super Moderator char GG's Avatar
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    above ALL, be honest, loyal, will NOT cheat on me or lie to me
    I think you've found your answer to looking for a woman in your post, Kimberly. The above is what many women are looking for also.

    You have previously said that you are not a full time crossdresser. So I guess you would have to weigh how important crossdressing is to you vs finding a partner. Or do you just want to find someone to hang out with and not necessarily a partner. The criteria is up to you.

    As a woman who was looking for someone on a dating website, many are just looking for once in a while companionship. In that case, who cares if you are a part time crossdresser, you don't necessarily have to crossdress with her. However, if you are looking for a permanent relationship, - your answer is in the above quote from your post.

  7. #32
    Platinum Blonde member Ressie's Avatar
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    I've ALWAYS shaved my legs and worn pantyhose, even before I became a crossdresser. I dated women whom I told that to and at first, they said that they were OK with it, they didn't mind at all but then later, it was like they did a complete 180
    My experiences have been similar. The relationship may last for years but the CDing is always one strike against. Two more strikes and you're out!

    The only GF I ever had that was actually into CDing was bisexual. But what she wanted was on open relationship which included bisexual activity with other men and women. I wasn't into that idea at the time, yet we broke up for other reasons.

    I've never used online dating services so my only advice is to just be yourself.
    "You're the only one to see the changes you take yourself through", Stevie Wonder

  8. #33
    AKA Lexi sometimes_miss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SaraLin View Post
    Why not add a line to your POF profile that reads something like "Not hung up on traditional male/female roles"?
    See, the first thing I thought of when I read that, was that she'd think, 'Well, great, he'll be more likely to do his share of chores around the house', not, 'He'd most likely want to share my wardrobe!' And I kind of think that's how it would probably be taken, by most women. When they hear hoofbeats, they think of horses, not unicorns.
    FWIW, someone at work DID spot my ad that mentioned CD'ing on plentyoffish about 15 years ago. Luckily there wasn't quite enough to definitely 'mark' me as the person in the ad, as the pic in the ad was VERY low resolution as to be quite fuzzy, but she and a couple of other women made some snarky comments about whether I liked parading around my house after work. Over the next few weeks, they kept pushing the comments, and not in a nice way. I kept having to treat it as an absurd idea, and gradually they stopped bringing it up.
    So be careful; it doesn't take much in a profile to hint at location, and then height, age, work, hobby preferences, etc., which can all add up to outing you to the folks that you definitely don't want to be out, to.
    Some causes of crossdressing you've probably never even considered: My TG biography at:http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...=1#post1490560
    There's an addendum at post # 82 on that thread, too. It's about a ten minute read.
    Why don't we understand our desire to dress, behave and feel like a girl? Because from childhood, boys are told that the worst possible thing we can be, is a sissy. This feeling is so ingrained into our psyche, that we will suppress any thoughts that connect us to being or wanting to be feminine, even to the point of creating separate personalities to assign those female feelings into.

  9. #34
    I NEVER go bare-legged! Kimberly A.'s Avatar
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    Thank you, ladies for more great advice!

    I think I've come to this conclusion, though..... I think it's best to wait and see if a woman shows interest in me on POF before I tell her that I'm a CD, rather than putting it on my profile. However, I do think that I should tell her via messaging on POF before we even go on a date and see how she reacts to it. I can think of ways to kind of hint it to her, without saying, "Btw, I'm a crossdresser"..... Like, asking her maybe how she feels about feminine guys?

    And yeah definitely, SaraLin, I will FOR SURE do it before the "L" word is dropped! LOL
    I may be crazy, but I'm BURIED in your memory!

  10. #35
    I NEVER go bare-legged! Kimberly A.'s Avatar
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    Vickie, you gave good advice as well and I'll take it to heart too..... However, I have to disagree with you when you say that a pre-nup is a good idea. Imho, anyone who wants to have pre-nups drawn up is planning to get divorced in the first place. And IF I ever get married again, it's going to be for the rest of my life, so there wouldn't be any need for a pre-nup.
    I may be crazy, but I'm BURIED in your memory!

  11. #36
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    Just a few notes from someone who has been single and around the block a few times. Pre-nups. If you have kids and assets you need a prenup a bigger factor and the the biggest for me is I still do quite a few deals every year and my pre-nup specifically states that wife has no part and nothing to do with my businesses and we file are taxes married and separate. This is all to protect her from a deal gone wrong or the IRS She did consult her own attorney and was told this is the way to protect herself. As far as dating goes you do not put that your a cd in profile go out on dates find someone you like spending time with and I always started the conversation by asking if they have any kinks or fetishes and go from there. Own it make no excuses and be prepared for some rejection but there are plenty of ladies out there. I should mention I am a fetish lingerie dresser especially in the bedroom!!

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Di View Post
    What I-wrote above in my comments ( earlier in your post) is exactly how I would want to know . If would see that in a profile I would think how intriguing.
    Just remember the telling her after you get to know each other will be necessary but stressful.Is there a way you can made a Kimberly profile without broadcasting to the world?

    If you do not feel comfortable doing that then I like Liz advice above .
    DI Thanks for the offer, but I'm a natural born male. I grew up around a lot of girls and heard their likes and dislikes. As well as their clothes. Over the years I've come out to many*women many accepted me as a friend.
    Last edited by lingerieLiz; 09-03-2021 at 09:33 PM.

  13. #38
    I NEVER go bare-legged! Kimberly A.'s Avatar
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    Well Di, I don't believe there is any way for me to make a profile on a dating site without just putting on there that I'm a CD and broadcasting it to whomever sees the profile..... I did, however, add on my POF profile that I'm open-minded and I'm looking for an open-minded woman, so I figured that would leave some room for intrigue in a woman's mind. I still haven't had any good hits though, (I hear Plenty of Fish is pretty much a piece of crap site and I'm beginning to get that LOL).

    [SIZE=1]- - - Updated - - -[/SIZE]

    Chrissyone, thank you for your advice as well..... However, if I ever do get married again, I will NOT have a pre-nup done up, nor will I sign one. Why? Well to me, that means that either one or both spouses actually do not plan to be married for the rest of their lives, it tells me that at least one of them will plan to divorce in the future. And IF I get married again, it will be for the rest of my life and I'm gonna make DARN sure that she feels the same way, even before I propose to her.
    I may be crazy, but I'm BURIED in your memory!

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