I could not have said it any better!Originally Posted by GaleWarning
I could not have said it any better!
I like myself, regardless of the packaging that I may come in! It's what is on the inside of the package that counts!
Doc, you bring up a really good issue and many others present their own versions of what I see as the reality. Classifications are only as good as the definitions and in the gender variant world the definitions are generally quite poor. The technical definition of transgender is the only one that is half way useful - a person who self identifies, all the time or part of the time, as having an identity that is more consistent with the identity of a person of the opposite sex from what that person is. Or something similar to that. It is a blanket definition.
But people who are like that are just like everyone else - unique in their personal sense of self. The key words in the transgender definition are "self identifies." In other words there is no absolute state of being that is transgender. In the most modern gender theory, the gender mosaic, we are all composed of a blend of traits and characteristics that are usually associated with our natal sex mixed with traits and characteristics of the opposite sex plus a pile of traits and characteristics that are unrelated to sex or gender differences which everybody has and does. However, gender is related to sexual identity weakly. There are links where they overlap, but sexual identity is far more a part of our concepts of reproductive aspects while gender identity has to do with social interactions and roles for the most part. It is muddled because that is the nature of the beast. We are all different and when one looks closely at individuals, developing a concise classification is far too complex to grasp. On the other hand, we need to classify so we can identify in a conversation what we are referring to more precisely. But that identification is only for convenience and not representative of the total identity. It is only the tiny part we are currently talking about.
The problem comes when we take those general classifications that are statistical and try to apply them concisely to individuals. It all becomes confusing because our brain works with the totality and not the bits and pieces we communicate with. The solution is to simply accept a class of people that has extremely high variability in terms of identity. And that is what most that have responded to your post are saying in different ways.
With well over a hundred different gender traits and characteristics it is easy to see how it can become confusing. The only way out of it and create concise categories is to equate sex and gender which produces a binary gender concept that is completely unrepresentative of the reality of how gender is configured in different people and how it operates in our brains. We know the difference because we experience that variability intimately; most cisgender people do not experience that and so to them it may seem like a fantasy. The ultimate solution is to respect every individual's identity for what it is - an amalgamation of a large array of traits and characteristics that applies, in unique combinations, to everybody. That is, we are all different. Period.
Gretchen, as usual, makes many great points about gender identity and classification. I look at labels as simple shorthand for the composite of traits that make up each individuals identity and personality. If asked, a label provides a quick generalization of who we are. Hopefully, we all understand that there is a lot more to each of us than can be encompassed by a single term.
As regards a label, I don't really attach one to myself. Crossdresser I guess is the best label as I've no desire to change sex. Trans? I'm not sure and to be honest, while to would be nice to fully understand myself, I'm not going to worry too much about it.
Sue
Last edited by char GG; 07-24-2022 at 06:05 PM. Reason: I guess you got the website working
I am a cross dresser. I am not trans in any way. I have no desire to be a woman or live as a woman. I am simply a man that enjoys wearing women's clothing. That said, I wish society was such that I could wear women's clothing full time. However, I know very few of my friends would be accepting. My wife's family (I would be most concerned about her and her family) would never accept it. My family would be a mixed bag, I believe. Anyway, I'm enough of a realist to know I can never dress full time. Thus, I will continue dressing at home whenever I wish and I will dress in public on any occasions that present themselves. My two outings as Heather this past week and a half opened new doors for her.
It's never too late to enjoy a happy childhood.
Live each day as though it's your last 'cause one day you'll be right.
I'm finding the more feminine side of me...and I ❤️ this adventure.
Thanks for that detailed account, Gretchen.
But, it doesn't reply to my post question. Which is geared toward those that feel they know who they r. Not those that r confused or unsure!
U can't keep doing the same things over and over and expect to enjoy life to the max. When u try new things, even if they r out of your comfort zone, u may experience new excitement and growth that u never expected.
Challenge yourself and pursue your passions! When your life clock runs out, you'll have few or NO REGRETS!
Tuff question as to me, "looking into a mirror looking inward". I am first a biological man. I enjoy to this day all the manly perks. Exploration was key factor in shaping when I was young dressing and becoming a bisexual crossdresser who at times, wants the attributes of a woman and all it's perks. Home run Doc....
Escapism isn't necessarily bad, but is definitely unhealthy in the long term. While helpful in the short term, things will degrade over time. At some point, the escapee will have to face the issue. Things simply blowing over isn't really going to happen in many situations.
I stopped worrying about this some time ago. After years of society and upbringing trying to pop me in a box or onto a spectrum between two fixed gemders , I accepted that I am simply me. Still lots of restrictions on how I can express that. But crucially my head is free of all the hype.
According to my own years of study You are Trans if you identify with or actually want to be a woman, you are Homosexual or Bi if you are sexually attracted to other men but are only a "Crossdresser"(noun) if you like women's clothing and are otherwise straight. the former might all cross-dress (verb) but they already have a "label" while a "Crossdresser" has no atypical gender/sexuality issues. Personally, as a Scientist, I feel that "labels" and names for things, ARE important as we THINK with words. f we don't have a name or term for something we cannot THINK about it and come to any meaningful conclusions. But further complicating things is that there are different KINDS of Crossdressers, eg. Escapists, fetishists, S/M Humiliation, etc. within the context of being otherwise "straight".
Personally, I am an "escapist" Cross Dresser I CD to become "not me" to take a vacation from both "maleness" and myself.---To drop my worries and responsibilities to unwind and relax.
Last edited by MarinaTwelve200; 07-25-2022 at 04:15 PM.
I am gender fluid, which is under the transgender umbrella. To me the clothing and shaving help with my gender dysphoria. I like feeling feminine sometimes and masculine sometimes. If everyone would accept me it would be feminine most times.
Good question, Doc, and lots of good responses. To focus on the question of ?how did I learn whether I?m trans or CD? I have to remark that it has been a process. Like so many I started off with a little highly charged secret CD, then evolved one step at a time to a steady state of enjoying CD. Along the way I have found myself wondering where it was going and what was I really. By being allowed to ask myself if was trans or CD, I?ve been able to feel confident knowing I?m CD and trans. And this forum has given me license to entertain these thoughts.
Apologies to all the subtlety I have glossed over, and in particular always appreciate Gretchen?s analysis.
I am a happy human, Doc. No need to label me more than that!
Let?s do less labels not more.
For most of my life, I identified as CD. A few years ago, a combination of symptoms led me to therapy, and withing a few months, I realized and accepted that I have gender dysphoria.I don't believe that I could have gotten there without that help.
Calling bigotry an "opinion" is like calling arsenic a "flavor".
i came here as a crossdresser....kind of went in a circle....but now feel comfortable with two spirits....both....ive lived a male life and tried to deny who i was in reality
after coming here and accepting that their were too many of us for this to be a one definition destination....so many here define themselves X,Y,Z and later swing to Q after they acquaint themselves with knowledge by conversing and reading information available in all forms of media....even the experts are constantly updating information as time goes by.
this just felt like they were talking directly to me....
the 1994 movie STARGATE which also was made into a TV series had a main charactor called RAH which was a very feminine looking male king....and pursian....
Last edited by mykell; 07-25-2022 at 03:27 PM. Reason: added info
....Mykell
i dressed like a girl and i liked it!crossdressing...theirs an app for that
I am happy! But the most accurate term I have heard for me is; gender nonconforming. I am sure that am not conforming to any gender norm when I leave my house dressed as a woman and my gender identity is male. I think I got that right. If not someone will let me know.
I see a lot of people saying if we have a desire to wear women's clothes we are on the spectrum.
Well it must be the thinnest slice of the spectrum as I am a straight man married with grandchildren. I have no desire for a man or for a man to desire me. Now where that gets difficult for everyone is why do we put so much effort to look female.
I am not trans I am just a cross dresser.
I'm definitly a cross dresser. Granted that I've had many close to me feel that I could easily go into the trans spectrum, especially with how happy it makes me whenever I do dress up. I just enjoy the idea of dressing up and passing as a female and don't feel the need to go all the way. Although, I do have some days that I wish I was born in a more female like body.
Julia, u and many others seem to have concluded my post is about labels. However, nothing could be further from what I intended. I could care less what u or others call u.
I was reaching out to those here who KNOW who/what they r and how they figured that out!
U can't keep doing the same things over and over and expect to enjoy life to the max. When u try new things, even if they r out of your comfort zone, u may experience new excitement and growth that u never expected.
Challenge yourself and pursue your passions! When your life clock runs out, you'll have few or NO REGRETS!
One of the many thiings that led me to my 'journey' on the way to deciding to transition was joining the online community and reading stories of underdressing or being happy as a man who just wears the clothes. I realized that that wasn't me, it was something else. For some stupid reason, I thought we'd all have similar stories.
Never really happy being a guy, realizing that there are people who are happy being a guy and just wearing the clothes meant I wasn't really a crossdresser, it was just a mode of dealing with what I really was.
At this point in my live, i guess CD would best describe me. I wish i could live as a woman every day, in my heart i am one and alway have been. I guess by todays labels I'd be trans, if that happened.
Julianna Frances
Labels can be constricting and annoying, but since that's not what Doc was asking about, I'll try to answer the original question.
I'm a guy. I've always been a guy. Just an ordinary average guy. With cuter clothes than most guys.
I've never been attracted to guys and really don't understand how anyone, even gals, can be. Ick.
I've never wished I was a woman, I've never been confused that I might be a woman. Because I'm just not. This is like confusion over whether or not I'm Caucasian. I didn't pick it, I just am.
I've known all this since I was old enough to know I was a boy and not a girl, even before I knew about the different parts.
So I'm not trans, I'm just a CD. At least until mainstream society allows guys the same freedom to wear anything we want that women already enjoy.
I don’t think there is any one answer as to how a trans person or crossdresser knows whether they are or not trans or cis. And I’ll add that it isn’t necessarily fixed for everyone as well. A continued questioning and exploration can last well after someone first concluded they were trans or cis. I certainly agree with others that given the opportunity to explore gender expression (crossdress) without shame is an important component to figuring out one’s gender identity.
Because of that, soon after finding this site I began to understand I wasn’t quite like other crossdressers here. My reason for crossdressing wasn’t for the purpose of sexual stimulation, relaxation, escapism or the tactile feeling of the fabric. For me, it was more of a tool or mechanism that allowed me express a more feminine nature without the incongruence of a male/man’s figure. After a couple of years of questioning, research, experimenting and work with a couple of therapists, I admitted I am indeed transgender… a transfemme enby to be exact.
I feel compelled to hone Marina’s definition of transgender because what she’s saying dismisses the existence of enbies.
So more accurately, a trans person is someone who does not identify with the gender assigned to them at birth which was given by virtue of the genitals the doctor observed.
There is a difference between anatomy and gender and we as humans have for millennia intertwined the two. It is important to make the distinction. I was born with male anatomy and as such was socialized as a boy who continued with that socialization as a man. However, although I am transgender (MtF), I DO NOT identify as a woman. I am a non-binary, an enby, a third-gender.
Last edited by IamWren; 07-26-2022 at 10:55 AM.
I am not a woman nor am I a man... I am an enby. Hi, I am Wren.
ENBY? that's a new term for me. how do you define it? Yes, I might have simplified things as to trans types they are almost as complex as CD types, but I only summarized the basic Trans Definition. As A CD I have concentrated most on Crossdressers and those variants within THAT category.
As far as Trans folk go, I find Autogynophyles especially interesting (straight MALES who admire women so much that want to BE women themselves) if the subject matter was not complex enough.
Enby (pronounced: ehn-bee) the soundnof the letters N-B for nonbinary.
I define enby as a person who does not identify as a man or a woman. Some also include people who identify as both a man and a woman. I find doing that unnecessary however.
And that’s not what autogynephilia is. That is a debunked hypothesis where a straight MAN becomes sexually aroused at the site of himself as a woman.
Transwomen are not straight men who want to be women because they admire them so much or because they are sexually aroused at the idea of being a woman.
I think you might need to do more research.
I am not a woman nor am I a man... I am an enby. Hi, I am Wren.
CD with TG feelings, despite not actually being TG. I don't feel any of the traditionally female thought processes, see the world the way women do, communicate the way they do, don't have any nesting behaviors, no interest in babies or children, or any focus on relationships. Descriptions of these things can be found in books by Allan and Barbara Pease, and more information can be found by looking up the works listed in their references in the backs of their books. You can start with "Why Men Don't Listen and Women Can't Read Maps: How We're Different and What to Do About It" to start learning the differences in how our minds generally work.
One easy example, is how we deal with our friendships. If a woman's friend doesn't return phone calls or emails for even a week or so, she will feel that something is wrong.
A man, OTOH, can go for years being out of touch with a friend, and when they get back together, pick up right where they left off. We see this in guys who served in the military, are apart for decades, meet again, and are still friends. Men whose friend doesn't stay in touch, just assume that he's busy with work or something else; he usually doesn't assume that he's done something wrong to make his friend mad. Another? Women also use 'the silent treatment' to punish men. But men love silence, and think that means everything is okay.
So much more to learn.
Some causes of crossdressing you've probably never even considered: My TG biography at:http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...=1#post1490560
There's an addendum at post # 82 on that thread, too. It's about a ten minute read.
Why don't we understand our desire to dress, behave and feel like a girl? Because from childhood, boys are told that the worst possible thing we can be, is a sissy. This feeling is so ingrained into our psyche, that we will suppress any thoughts that connect us to being or wanting to be feminine, even to the point of creating separate personalities to assign those female feelings into.
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