%^&*$#@

[DanielMacBride]

Lex that really sucks - but it sounds like you have a handle on it. It's just another example of f***ing stupid red tape crap and a royal pain in the a***.



Daniel

[John]

Ah, that sucks, I'm sorry. I hope you manige to get it sorted out somehow. In the meantime:

[Tree GG]

Failure is just not an option - you have an unconfirmed, yet free-standing and non-cancellable reservation on a Caribbean Island with me sometime.

As a professional paper-pusher, I can attest to the frustrations of bureaucracy, but it can be done with persistance and documentation. Any good bureaucrat is taught to have a paper trail - supposedly for accuracy's sake, but in reality it's a CYA (Cover Your A$$) policy.

Once you get them documentation and 3rd, 4th, 5th & nth party verification of your gender presentation, they'll get tired of revisiting the same application and stamp you on thru.

Hope your passport bureaucrat has a short attention span!

Tree

[Emily Ann Brown]

So how the crap do sisters leave here a man and head to Thailand, become a woman, and get back in the country?????

Call you state rep in Congress dude.....bureaucrats hate calls from their superiors.


Emily Ann

[Kieron Andrew]

Call you state rep in Congress dude.....bureaucrats hate calls from their superiors.

that was gonna be my next suggestion if the proof of paper work didnt work

[Dasein9]

Best of luck, Lex! Everyone here has given good advice. Outlast them, wear them down. Call in the big guns. C'mon! You're in NYC! Call Hillary! (Remember what Bill did for me when I needed help pending surgery? I know I've told you that story!)

Sadly enough, in some states, they still can inquire into use of genitals. Sodomy is still illegal in places (meaning anything other than standard hetero relations). I remember at least one case of a woman being denied a state job in NC after mentioning that she was marrying her lesbian partner. The HR person said they couldn't hire her because she'd admitted to committing a crime.:mad:

She needs to sue the pants off them. In 2003, the Supreme Court ruled sodomy laws unconstitutional. So, while the laws are still on the books in some states, they are illegal laws.

[Lovely Rita]

Very sorry to hear about this Lex.

[Laurie909]

Or maybe I'll be like Elvis and never leave the country.

He was stationed in Germany when he was in the Army. He just never toured outside of the US. That was because of Col. Tom. He was the one that couldn't leave the country.

[CaptLex]

Thanks all for your kind words, support and suggestions.

He was stationed in Germany when he was in the Army. He just never toured outside of the US. That was because of Col. Tom. He was the one that couldn't leave the country.

Yeah I know, Laurie - it was a lame joke.

Failure is just not an option - you have an unconfirmed, yet free-standing and non-cancellable reservation on a Caribbean Island with me sometime.

Tree, I'll meet you in the Caribbean if I have to swim it!

Here in the UK, there seem to be specialist offices who do have the experience - and surgery is not a requirement (there are many transfolk who, for various reasons are unwilling or unable to have surgery)?

You're absolutely right, Nicki, and I'm trying to gather as much "evidence" or at least written proof as possible to submit, but it's been a slow process. The letter from my therapist was easy to get, and I think it's the most important one because he and I have discussed my transition at length and he took the time to explain that transition doesn't necessarily equate SRS.

My doctor has been on vacation for two weeks, and I did leave her a message asking if she could provide another letter, but I don't think she can add anything to what she said in the first one. They're really asking for a letter from a surgeon (who has either done or will do SRS on me). That's not what she is, she's the doc the prescribes my hormones, but she and I have never discussed just how far I intend to transition physically. My therapist is the one that knows all that.

I asked my job for a letter simply explaining that I have changed all my papers at work to male and that I've been living as male at work for over a year. Well, I asked my supervisor who had to submit the request to the main office in Chicago - and Chicago refused to do it. Their excuses are really lame - basically, that they can't provide personal information and that if they do it for me, they'll be "opening the door" for everyone to make that request. They also said they would not give me a letter unless it was a definite "requirement" from the passport office - a specific request.

So I asked my friend, Phil (who is also a partner at the firm) for advice and he said he would call the main person in Chicago personally (when he returns from his business trip tomorrow) and try to reason with them. He told me that's all BS because they can supply personal info if it's requested by the person (me, that is) and that this would not open the door for anyone anyway 'cause there's no one else here in my situation. He also pointed out to me that, as he sees it, the letter is a "requirement" because the cumulative effect of several documents would better present my case and reverse the outcome so far.

It's so stupid, I'm not asking them to lie and say I've had surgery . . . just to confirm that this is who I am in real life and this isn't a whim, a phase or something I'll change my mind about next week. Anyway, I'm glad he wants to help me.

So that's pretty much how things stand so far. Still gathering stuff to send back to the passport office. Will keep you posted on the final verdict.

[ZenFrost]

I can't believe how annoying they're being! It's not like it's going to ruin the U.S. economy for you to change one little thing.

[Kieron Andrew]

So that's pretty much how things stand so far. Still gathering stuff to send back to the passport office. Will keep you posted on the final verdict.

i tell ya, once they finally get their finger out their butts and sort this, after all you've gone through, i'll start a bleeding whip round for you to get to england as celebratory thing lol....cos it seems to me they are quite willing to give the damn passport they just want paperwork to clog up their filing systems....idiots i tell ya

you are a non op Ts what the heck is so hard to grasp!

[CaptLex]

you are a non op Ts what the heck is so hard to grasp!

They're very uneducated. I think what's going on is that they don't see too many of these from FtMs and that the MtFs they've seen request a change in their passport have had, or will have, surgery. Our government needs to be educated about us - all of us - but mainly about transmen.

[Nicki B]

They're very uneducated. I think what's going on is that they don't see too many of these from FtMs and that the MtFs they've seen request a change in their passport have had, or will have, surgery. Our government needs to be educated about us - all of us - but mainly about transmen.

It feels like you need to get further up the tree - or nothing's gonna change?

But, also, you can't be the first person to do this... Has anyone any suggestions for groups who would lobby in this area (an M2F group might also be able to help)? I could tell you about the UK, but not the States..

Tree, I'll meet you in the Caribbean if I have to swim it!

I don't think they're very used to transpeople, but I can recommend it...

[CaptLex]

I don't think they're very used to transpeople, but I can recommend it...

Great pics, Nicki. We'll have to "commandeer" a ship and sail out there with our whole crew.

[SirTrey]

Beautiful pics, Nicki....but I already knew you were a beauty.

[Kieron Andrew]

Great pics, Nicki. We'll have to "commandeer" a ship and sail out there with our whole crew.

hey can we go Attachment 55940 with the offices that are dealing with your case lol (PS this smiley so needs to be added)

[ZenFrost]

hey can we go Attachment 55940 with the offices that are dealing with your case lol

Yeah!

[Nicki B]

And just where did you nick that idea from, then? :hmmm:

[Kieron Andrew]

And just where did you nick that idea from, then? :hmmm:

from you!!! hey im giving you ALL the credit and glory for thinking of it

[Felix]

Hi Lex just wondered how ya getting on with all of this hun?? xx Felix

[CaptLex]

Hi Lex just wondered how ya getting on with all of this hun?? xx Felix

Very, very slowly - like swimming in mud, man.

Due to some help and interference from my partner friend, the firm has agreed to give me a letter - which I should get Monday. Still working on other documentation.

My therapist did a little research and found out that not only is a surgeon's letter required, but sometimes medical records and surgical notes are also requested in order to change the passport, so my chances are looking very slim. He was also told that what I would probably get is a temporary passport that's valid for 3 months so that I can take ONE trip. That's it!

He did cheer me up a bit when we discussed this because he told me about his discussion with another gender therapist who writes these kinds of letters for her MtF TS patients and they got into an argument about how difficult (and futile sometimes) SRS is for transmen (she disagreed) and he stood up for us. I had to laugh when he rolled his eyes and said, "therapists!"

[Kieron Andrew]

He was also told that what I would probably get is a temporary passport that's valid for 3 months so that I can take ONE trip. That's it!

presumably for the purpose of surgery

[Syr_SwitchyGQ]

I'm so sorry Lex... This whole situation is so messed up... I don't understand why it's such a big deal to get your paperwork changed. Honestly! Why all the red tape? What are they afraid of?

This is such I'm sorry you have to sort through all this.

[ZenFrost]

I'm so sorry Lex... This whole situation is so messed up... I don't understand why it's such a big deal to get your paperwork changed. Honestly! Why all the red tape? What are they afraid of?

This is such I'm sorry you have to sort through all this.

[Anthony Jake]

you know what i think i think it is all BULLS*IT really.. if everything else is legit then why the hell the problem with a passport? Some people and some people perceptions of stuff really affect so many other people and they dont give a f*ck how we all feel.
Lex, i really hope that you can find a way to sort it, and that some good people can come forward to help you.
I mean, we fight so damn hard to be who we are and to be happy but there is always some bast**rd on the other side of the fence waiting to knock us down.
Its not fair and it totally sucks.