Speech Patterns

[Alan]

So, ElitheBarrowBoy and I were chatting about speaking like guys.

Now, when I'm presented with a problem, I go off and do research.

So, in typical "me" style, I went and googled this. And because it's something that might pertain to all of us, I thought I'd share the links I've found.

Maybe even start a discussion.

http://logos.uoregon.edu/explore/socioling/gender2.html
http://osdir.com/ml/org.linuxchix.is.../msg00074.html -- I liked this one.
http://www.learntowritefiction.com/g...s-male-speech/ -- this is specifically speech patterns
http://www.learntowritefiction.com/c...how-to-series/ -- All sorts of gender differences.

[Cai]

I didn't read you links (time limits right now) but I've seen that idea come up before.

One of the things that I've noticed in public speaking is that the best speakers (the ones that win and the ones people want to listen to), male or female, use masculine speaking patterns. They tend to have tenor-range, resonant, appealing voices; they drop the pitch of their voice when coming to the end of a thought; they use fewer, more controlled hand motions; they avoid extraneous and somewhat meaningless adjectives.

[sabo10]

Linguistics is one of my favourite topics. The key thing about some of the first links is that it's trying to teach you how to write men rather than recognise male speech patterns. Really, writing is about maintaining an illusion of reality rather than reflecting reality. We "all know" that women talk about shoe shopping and weight loss while men talk about football and sex, but if we listen carefully we find out it's not always case. Writing is about selling those gender (and race/class/etc) stereotypes so that when we introduce the dragon on page two it's perfectly normal.

So. The rest of the links then. I'm a bit dubious about the one that presented the gendered Japanese because (as far as I know), it wasn't true. There are gendered words in Japanese, but those weren't examples of them unless they were speaking historically. Some of them had slightly differing levels of politeness -- we could say men are more likely to be casual, but these words are about as gender-neutral as they come in Japanese, although I can't say the same for 'ohiya' -- I've never heard anyone actually say that, male or female. In any case, many people consciously ignore gendered language these days too. I know middle-aged women who use 'boku' (I -- young, masc.) as their personal pronoun of choice, for example. Every textbook/dictionary will tell you this Just Doesn't Happen. Of course, there is code-switching in Japanese as well as English. I use 'boku' casually, 'watashi' (I -- gender neutral, polite) at work and 'ore' (I -- alpha male) when drunk. :P

(No one should ever mention Japanese and linguistics within earshot of me. Seriously. I will talk at you for hours.)

The link you picked out as being interesting was probably the best. Personally, I do tend to apologise for things a lot, but this has a lot to do with being British in combination with speaking Japanese all day, plus a few other factors. This topic is probably summed up as being more about power and status rather than gender.

This is an interesting topic, but we need MOAR NUMBERS (sorry...). There have been studies that counted the number of times certain features of speech popped up in conversation. It's said that women's speech has more examples of overlapping speech, whereas men are more likely to interrupt. Think about that last one. XD

--KP.

[valenstein]

(No one should ever mention Japanese and linguistics within earshot of me. Seriously. I will talk at you for hours.)

Sabo, I'm a glutton for punishment. I had a male friend who moved to Japan and learned the language from a few girls he met. He told me once he had learned the language, the guys there used to tease him because he talked like a girl.

More recommended research, I found this book fascinating, and it wasn't dry at all. Note: there is a book with a similar title, so make sure it's this one:

Eve's Rib: Searching for the Biological Roots of Sex Differences by Robert Pool

Review:

Why are the sexes different? Is it because men and women are taught by society to think and behave in sex-typical ways? Or are the sexes different by nature? For a quarter of a century, the dominant view has been that if males and females were treated the same from the time they were born, most sex differences would disappear

In Eve's Rib, Robert Pool describes a new understanding of the sexes that has been emerging over the past decade. When little boys play with trucks and little girls with dolls, or when females talk of feelings and males of facts and rules, the reasons are deeper than the sexes being taught to behave differently by society. The roots of these differences lie in the womb

Scientists know that a person's physical sex is determined in the womb by sex hormones. But unlike the Biblical story of creation, in which God created Eve from Adam's rib, the female body plan is actually the "standard" human plan, a fetus will automatically become female unless it is exposed to male hormones. And, as Eve's Rib describes, bodies are not the only things shaped by these hormones in the womb. From before birth, the brains of males and females are different in distinct, predictable ways, and these differences underlie much of the mental, emotional and psychological variation between the sexes

Eve's Rib explores its subject by talking to the scientists doing the research, many of whom are women who find themselves facing a dilemma: They themselves have had to overcome many of the stereotypes about women, and they believe strongly in equality between the sexes, yet their research indicates that in some ways the sexes will never be the same. Their resolutions of this quandary itemonstrate how sex differences can be accepted without accepting sexual inequality

The research described in Eve's Rib ranges from rats confused about their sex to humans taking tests of math and verbal ability, and from women exposed to high levels of testosterone in the womb to men who looked like girls until they reached puberty. What emerges from these disparate images is an unfinished but recognizable portrait of the real differences between men and women, a portrait that may ultimately reveal the true nature of our humanity

[Alan]

I love linguistics, so I actually found what you wrote very interesting. I don't agree with everything I found -- there have been quite a few studies showing that men use fewer words per day than women -- but I thought I'd just generally share everything I found and let people come to their own conclusions.

I included the writing links, because writing tends to reflect life, as it were. Not always, naturally, but at times.

[Joy Carter]

From personal experience, I can tell you that your speech alone can make a difference, in how others perceive your intentions. I have feminized some of my speech patterns, and I find customers are much more receptive.

[deja true]

Alan, these links are brilliant, especially the last two,that catalog gender differences for writers.

Sure, they're a little on the general side, but they are exactly the kind of primer that so many are looking for at the beginning of their cross-gender paths.

I've tagged them with one phrase, but if any can think of more so we can find them later when new ones ask, that'd be great!

Great googling, buddy!