::raises hand::
I'm an Asian cross dresser!
There are pros and cons. The great part is that my body has always been very slim and petite. My face is feminine from a western sense so a wig and some make-up and its hard to tell I'm a guy. I got lucky in the height department though being 5'9". Not a lot of Asian guys get up to that height.
Some downsides though.. Short legs relative to torso length. The "double eyelid" thing which makes eyeliner disappear stinks too.
Amazing enough I have a large frame so my chest without forms is 44 inches. I have to say that I have a softer brow and my eyebrows aren't as bushy. Also my jaw isn't as angular. Things I didn't notice until I started trying make-up.
I think I feel more like Natalie than I do Kat. I think from this point I will go by Natalie.
Part of a recently ended relationship where a reason why it ended was my crossdressing.
I can't speak for Thailand, but coincidentally, I'm in Japan right now. Last week my SO and I went all over Tokyo. We didn't stop all week and we took the subway/train system everywhere. Tokyo is crowded (13 million people) so I had ample time to scrutinize and study people's faces, both men and women. In my opinion, there are just as many more delicately featured men compared to the overall male population as we have baby-faced men in the West. There are some macho looking Japanese men too, in fact I don't think that most of them could get away with passing as a Japanese woman, not when you compare them to the truly delicate features and small stature of Japanese women. Most of the men that I saw have beard shadow just like Western men. And they are much bigger than Japanese women.Originally Posted by Jana
As with anything, it is the most passable that put up their videos on youtube, that have web sites, that work in night clubs, etc, but you're still looking at a few thousand compared to the millions of men who would not be able to pass at all. Also, the beautiful lady-boys are young. Young Western men can get away with a lot more than a middle-aged Western man, just think Justin Bieber and picture him with a wig on.
So it's all relative.
Reine
Its because asian guys tend to be smaller and shorter, they have petite bodies and smaller hands, feet etc.... They also have less hair and have soft delicate features like women.
The average asian guy is about 5'3 -5'6 and weighs 110-145 so that is about the same height and build as the average american woman. Theres a reason why asian crossdressers can shop in the normal womens section and have no problem finding clothes and shoes.
I think there is a higher rate of crossdressers in Japan, also it's more mainstream, from musicians to TV, to prime time anime. Shopping for girl clothes here(US) you may get weird looks. In Akita, no one bats an eye. On the Oga to Akita line on weekends your pretty much guaranteed to see a group of TS, whether they are VK, or cross playing its hard to tell sometimes. I will say its more predominate among younger people.
I do agree with the height, size per region. So in the us that would be easier.
Renee, you should visit some of the TS/VK clubs then in Tokyo or hang out in Shunjuku Ni-Chome.
We went there. And I've no doubt there are some very feminine looking CDers in the clubs. Also, it's a gay neighborhood that also does not represent the average. I'm sure that gay Asian men look more effeminate compared to the balance of Asian men, just like gay Westerners do compared to the balance of Westerners. What I was saying, was that the vast majority of men that you see walking around on the streets would not be able to pass as women to the Japanese population (I would even be able to tell if the average guy that I've seen wore a wig and female clothes in comparison to Japanese women's features and how small they are) ... just like the vast majority of Western men cannot pass as women to the Western population, especially upon closer inspection.
Reine
I recently saw a video somewhere about the Thai ladyboys that indicated that they typically start taking t-blockers and estrogen around the age of 12, so they're going through through female puberty about the same as young females would without having to deal with a masculinized body, so they look completely female, except for genitalia, of course.
Here's a video about the 4 Thai TS's hired as flight attendants by Thai Airlines, and they certainly look female to me.
Carol
Last edited by Julogden; 02-18-2013 at 11:05 PM.
My name is Carol.
Ok I can agree with that, but also it is much more mainstream (among younger generations) and is not looked down upon as hard as in western countries. Although tell my grandparents that I Cd and I would be called a neko, gei, Okama, nothing as nice as josou. I would probably lose my first born rights to land as well. Tokyois very progressive in terms of cities so you won't see the bias as say in Kosaka. The elders though definately have issues outside of the norms... But I digress.
Back to OP.
Yes, Asians do have to work at it also, I can't plop a dress on and be construed as a girl in Japan or the US, from the neck down, in the US, probably, when I had long headbanger multicolored hair and clubbing, I got my butt grabbed on more than one occasion, and when they saw my face they were like, dude, sorry thought u were my girlfriends friend or something equally lame. In Japan, I would really have to work at doing a phenominal makeup job, which i cant do, since I would be considered tall by Japanese standards. 5'6" full Japanese.
Well its certainly on average, yes. Compared to others they don't have such "masculinized" features, they have smaller chins, narrower jaws and rounded / oval faces help a lot. As Jennialy mentioned its also a lot more mainstream, and given the bishonen aesthethic north-eastern Asian countries believe in, its far easier to crossdress, define your looks and get better results.
But this is just on average, as I'm sure you all have heard of Andrej Pejic, Bill Kaulitz and Stav Strashko. I can name more like Stas Fedyanin or this model from Spain Jesus Benitez Valvidieso http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a87kP0w8QE8
They are good examples of androgyny.
Well 5 6 is about the height of the average girl in america so you would blend in perfectly
Yes, this too. People think there is a huge difference between how the CDing is viewed, in Japan or other places and North America. But there is not much difference. Here too, the younger or more urban people are more open to it than the older generations or people who live in smaller towns. And even though there may be tolerance among younger people who are not part of the lifestyle, all this changes when it comes to choosing someone to marry or to hire for a job. It's easier to accept a lifestyle that is unlike your own as long as it is arm's length.
I also agree about your height. You would blend in the US, but you still have to work at it to blend in Japan since the women by comparison are so much smaller.
Another consideration that my SO pointed out to me: it is more difficult for any person of a given ethnicity to tell the very subtle gendered differences - the tell-tale signs such as the jaw or brow shape, subtle differences in profiles, etc - in any ethnicity that is not their own. For example, a Japanese person might not be able to tell as easily whether a Western man in a wig and makeup who blends fairly well is not a woman as easily as Western people, and vice versa. This is natural since we all have much more intimate knowledge about the facial features of the people that we have all around us and that we grew up with.
Reine
I agree with you there ReineD. It does seem that here in America when we see all of the Asian lady boys as they call them there, are very young. A lot of them look like 15 to 18 year old girls. Not grown women, but young girls. To me though, most of them look under legal age, for the U.S. I'd like to see some examples of Asians in the 50 plus range. When I was 20 years old, I was mistaken for a girl many times and people guessed my age to be around 15.
You have to wonder if Asians think that us Westerners pull off "femme" easier?
It takes a true Erin to be a pain in the assatar.
Asian people usually more hate cding.
Are you sure about this? I've seen through the web many shows that have or revolve about crossdressing, more youngsters sport androgynous looks and clothes, specially in the music industry. The Japanese have visual kei fashion and some bands take it to the extreme, and I'm aware that anime is full of crossdressing too. I know you are Korean I see the location in your profile, probably you are talking from experience, but what makes you think eastern asians (because I imagine you refer to them since you are in that area) hate crossdressing more compared to Americans or Europeans?
well i disagree, i am an asian and not all asians who cross dress are beautiful, like that there are some who always look like girls
Well you are Indian, which means you are talking about south asians? and I imagine you are caucasian from an anthropological standpoint like most Indians, so there it would be pretty much like in Europe regarding the issue of passing / being androgynous. I think the thread revolves arround eastern asians, and to an extent south-eastern asians (Thai, Malay, Filipinos). Am I correct?
this ^^^^^^^^^^^asian guys may "get away" with things easier because of their small frames and fine features but they still have to work at it like the rest of us. They cannot just slide into a dress, wig and makeup and automatically become a woman. We all know there is way more to it than that.
I see a lot of Asian people, male and female, everyday because I live in a city that's 30% Asian and my wife and many of my friends and coworkers are Asian. I don't think Asian men appear more feminine in general but I think they have less facial hair, that's pretty much it. The height difference isn't really that dramatic, I'm 5'7" and most of the Asian guys I know are around my height or slightly taller.
Personally, I have always found Asian women to be attractive and feminine, but that's always in the eye of the beholder, because I've had this discussion with my friend and he adamantly disagreed with me and said Asian women are less feminine than Caucasians cause they're not typically as curvy. But I have always liked small thin women with long dark hair so Asians tend to fit that mold.
That said, I do think Asian crossdressers often present better than whites but it might just be my own biases for what I think constitutes a feminine appearance. I also think that Westerners tend to fetishize Eastern appearance and behaviors, I guess you could call it exoticism, so that could play a role.
[QUOTE=Ciara09;3122026]I see a lot of Asian people, male and female, everyday because I live in a city that's 30% Asian and my wife and many of my friends and coworkers are Asian. I don't think Asian men appear more feminine in general but I think they have less facial hair, that's pretty much it./QUOTE]
We have very little hair, in fact I have never seen a pure with chest hair.
Well said. Asian men have less secondary male characteristics so they pass more easily. There is also less sexual dimorphism between the sexes in asian people.
[QUOTE=Jennialy;3122032]lol You probably look amazing! Asian guys always look so pretty
Same, I've never seen a Chinese with chest hair. The contrary to mediterranean caucasians in this sense. Arabs, Iberians, Berbers and Indians usually have lots of chest hair. In this case I'm fortunate as I have no chest hair myself, but my legs on the other hand can look like a forest...
I have to disagree. Having been through the army. I've seen my share of naked hairy Asian males, chest hair and all. And as others have posted. Size is all relative. If we have small guys, then the girls are even smaller! Especially when it comes to shoes, all the Main Street shops go up to a max of a size 8 or 9 only ;(
When I was in Japan, I picked up a couple "girly" magazines out of a vending machine. One was normal Japanese girls, the other (we couldn't read either) just had a different feel to it. After much study and sharing them, one guy said......these are Philipean Lady Boys............as said above, the finer features and smaller statures do make stunning CDs, but I have seen some incredible girls from all countries. Youth helps pass as beautiful girls, but the older CDs if dressing age apropriate, can be almost impossible to tell.
