Lynn Marie, I tend to agree with you on this one. I know it seems pessimistic. There will be more acceptance among a minority, i think, but the vast majority will still not accept men dressed as women. I see issues that will dwarf this, such as food and water shortages, war, and mere survival, of life on earth.
Isha needs to read the NYTIMES more often even though she lives in another country.Originally Posted by Isha
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/02/22/us...e-gays.html?hp
As the US gets to be MORE conservative, it will not likely happen. Sorry, but I think that there is simply too much pink fog rolling in . If one can dress and get out in one's community without getting beat up, be thankful, enjoy, and hope your little part of the world becomes more liberal. Generally, it "ain't " going to happen. After 7 decades on the pale blue dot, I've seen liberal California turn into something else that is not really a fun place to be--yeah, maybe S.F. or parts of L.A. but the rest of the state is getting to be like the South 50 years ago. Like 12-step programs, knowing what you can or cannot change is a great part of survival.
JUST a crossdresser
Well no one can know the future but I pray to God that we see more acceptance for CD's across the board. I do believe that science will make M2F extremely easy in the future, I just wish I was there. I would like to think that in 25 years we have matured enough to let people dress as they feel is right for them, not what other people feel is right for them.
Here's an interesting fact that does relate to crossdressing and the acceptance or non-acceptance by the public. My mother told me that when she was a teenager, girls started to wear pants! OMG. Her grandmother had fits, tried to get her mother to not allow that type of behavior, imagine, girls wearing articles of clothes that only men are allowed to wear. Her grandmother even went so far as to predict that if they continued to wear pants they would all turn out bad! Wow, sound family?
I have watched a lot of future science fiction movies and one of two things will happen. Men will dress like they do now and women will dress in teeny tiny dresses and heels even when fighting the evil Zorks. Or everyone will wear coveralls that look like everyone else.
The earth is the mother of all people and all people should have equal rights upon it.
Chief Joseph
Nez Perce
“Love isn't a state of perfect caring. It is an active noun like struggle. To love someone is to strive to accept that person exactly the way he or she is, right here and now.” - Fred Rogers,
Yes, busker - pretty sad to see what's happening in Arizona these days. Vladimir Putin and his ilk would feel right at home there with their homophobic politics.
But in the name of avoiding any possible hypocrisy here, one can only hope that this proposed legislation legitimizing the denial of the rights of others on the basis of individual religious views will also include a provision for legalizing polygamous marriages of the type favored by the Mormons. After all, what could be more Biblical than that? The Old Testament is full of instances of polygamy, including keeping concubines to provide offspring to family patriarchs whose wives proved to be "barren".
Of course, maybe the real reason for this "barrenness" was that these "macho" men's sperm counts were just too low, but we'll never know...
Well thank you kindly for the "reality check". Sorry don't read the NYTimes as it has too much of a conservative agenda for this Liberal Canadian gal. If you note by my comment I said "I believe it is getting more mainstream". I am not naïve enough to believe there are still challenges. But I stand corrected . . . duly noted from my little corner of Narnia.
Hugs
Isha
Last edited by Marcelle; 02-22-2014 at 01:45 PM.
Here's a question of my own if u crossdress in public won't people think u a trans? & if so what exactly is cding is it meant to be done secretly?
I'm going to have to disagree with a few of you gals.
In 25 years I believe people will be a lot more accepting. In 25 years most of the old school of conservatism will either have passed on or will be too old to wield any power. The younger generation of conservatives are a lot more apathetic towards the LGBT lifestyle. I've always had a diverse group of friends from the super liberal to the super conservative. As the years have passed there's been a fundamental shift in attitude in my right wing friends from "Hate those people!" to "I don't really care what they do as long as they stay away from me!" on to "Hey! Have you met my gay/lesbian friend(s)." The older crowd hasn't budged much at all.
As for that whole super-duper sex change machine? I believe it will be $19.95 plus $3.95 S&H on a late night infomercial.
That is an interesting point to make, and perhaps in the eye of the beholder, you may be in more danger that "just" being a cd. I was going to make a separate thread but here is another question to add to yours? For guys with gynecomastia, it would seem logical to wear a bra (if we hadn't fethishized it to death) as a support garment, but doing so in public could put the wearer in harm's way for being seen as a TS, who for many people are neither fish nor fowl. Talk about homophobia. at last reckoning on the gynecomastia web site about 14 thousand + men have had double mastectomies, all in the name of society. So, if guys with a true medical problem can't do what they should be able to do, can one really envision cd's casually strolling about amid a society that forces people to undergo a surgery that is both expensive and dangerous? And, to top it off, it may NOT do the trick. nature can be obstinate sometimes, and re-grow what we cut off (some exceptions to that ).
In the USA, about 50% of the people alive are over 50, and it seems to hold through history, that as people age, they get more conservative about many things. I am pretty liberal but I have noticed it even in my own thinking and I'm reasonably well educated, and should be able to see issues better, but..... Younger people are more liberal generally, but soon many will have jobs (don't ask when) and families and their concerns will switch to ensure that they survive in a largely hostile world. It is still survival of the fittest in many senses, so conservatism will engage when necessary. I hate to seem like a party pooper but one must be realistic. I try to do my thing without "accidentally" getting run down crossing the street in my own neighborhood.
Isha, didn't mean to tramp on you with a jackboot, but the reality is that politicians here represent a certain, and large segment of the population to whom we are anathema. (that's a pretty strong word, but I think it is what it called for).
JUST a crossdresser
It seems like years ago when I read about how PCBs were reducing male sperm counts, how estrogens levels in male Florida panthers were higher than female panthers and male alligator penises were 25% smaller. The article suggested that Congress might be concerned because objectively they were half the men they thought they were. My brother countered that Congress would be happy that they were half the pricks they thought they were!
O wad some Pow'r the giftie gie us
To see oursels as ithers see us!
Things have changed greatly and will continue to change.
I worked in aerospace 35 years ago and if one of my colleagues would have come out as gay his security clearance would have been revoked and he would have been fired. Being TG was so far beyond the pale that it wasn't even considered in discussions but there is no doubt that it would have resulted in similar treatment.
I currently have a friend who is TS and works in a similar job to the one I had. Her employer (a major player in the industry) is paying for her surgery.
That's how far we have come. While we may not have the JoeBubbaBobs in the deep south accepting us, we are becoming very mainstream in most of the country.
I was out last night with four CD friends and our spouses at a live performance. With four CDers, Persephone's Law just about guarantees that we will be made. Still, everything was fine with the other patrons and one of the GGs even complimented me on my dress and asked where I bought it. After the show, the producer came out to meet us and told us how glad she was that we were there.
I will disagree with Busker about older people becoming more conservative. While they may do so in some ways, their broad range of experiences often make them more tolerant of others. The people we should be concerned about are the young and middle-age redneck types who often act before engaging their brains. Those are the ones that commit violence against TG people.
Eryn
"These girls have the most beautiful dresses. And so do I! How about that!" [Kaylee, in Firefly] [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
"What do you care what other people think?" [Arlene Feynman, to her husband Richard]
"She's taller than all the women in my family, combined!" [Howard, in The Big Bang Theory]
"Tall, tall girl. The woman could hunt geese with a rake!" [Mary Cooper, in The Big Bang Theory]
Actually, I agree with Eryn that things are better and based on my life experience will continue to improve for CDrs and transgendered people.
O wad some Pow'r the giftie gie us
To see oursels as ithers see us!
I think when the ones who altered our DNA to make us evolve into homo sapiens return all questions will be answered, and we will be considered the elite. Oh wait crossdressing right?I think styles may change but not mind sets. The old boys with the money rule the world and I see no change in sight, sorry. The cup is half empty on this one. Well anyway...
Bye-Bye Lisa
"you are a strange species and there are many out there;shall I tell you what I find beautiful about you ,you are at your best when things are at their worst" ...[ Starman]
It may of course be a bit disturbing to sense that one is really not so firmly anchored to the gender one was born into.
LOL Eryn . . . JoeBubbaBobs . . . haven't heard that one before . . . love it, made me laugh.
Within the Canadian military up until the 80s being TG was sure way to discharge. Now being TG is supported by policy and SRS is covered. So I still think that while there is and always will be that part of society which believes we are weird, sick and perverted I don't believe they speak for the majority.
Hugs
Isha
More accepted, but never fully accepted. Maybe to some degree, but it will take at least 20 years.
The border will be smaller, but never erased. It's happening in Asia, but the border is still there.
Scientific progress may enable things like virtual reality for gaming purposes. Anything can happen, maybe they'll find something to erase our crossdressing urges.
Nothing is science fiction. Anything that seems like science fiction to us today is science reality tomorrow. I'm pretty sure that in 1914 if you told someone that you could use a device in the palm of your hand to talk to someone half way across the world, or to gain information about any subject under the sun, they would've called science fiction on you. Yet, today the internet and smart phones are reality.
Now there may be political agendas or ethical issues with body swapping, and it may take a long time to get to perfecting it, but I would never rule out any such possibility. Yeah, it probably won't happen in our lifetimes, but the future generations may see it. Maybe such a technology is 1000 years away.
"parts of L.A" - so are you implying that if parts of L.A. are accepting that other parts of L.A. are like the deep south was 50 years ago? Please tell me which parts, so I can avoid them.
If California is turning into the deep south the way it was 50 years ago, then will the deep south revert back to the way it was in 1814?
I can see some parts of the US getting more conservative. But I think in large cities, it's getting more progressive and more accepting of CDing and TSes. Also, the big cities are most likely where you will go to for high paying jobs, and as the future progresses more of the younger generation is moving into big cities and out of the rural and suburban areas.
I also think that money drives everything. A lot of what is accepted and not accepted will depend on how much money is involved. A lot of what does occur in technological development will depend on how much money it makes.
Working from home, that's a major if. I think more jobs will eventually allow flexibility in hours, and working part of the job from home and part of it from the office. Our survival instincts may prevent us from working from home completely. Hint: if a big disaster occurs and pushes us back 5000 years in technology, no one is working from home. It's our survival instincts keep us in the office, as well as some old generation people who run businesses that are stuck in old ways of doing things.
Yes the younger rednecks have more testosterone and are more driven towards acts of violence than some old redneck. The old redneck may still reject their transgender child, but unlikely to commit murder. It is the older generation that is driving most of the anti-gay, anti-trans, legislation in this country. In 20 years they'll all be dead so there will be few people to push such legislation. Most of the younger generation wants to see progress for gays and transgender people.
That's because most women want a man 100% of the time. The women who will accept their CDing husbands (or TS ones too) are generally tomboys or more masculine women. Some masculine women may want a CD so they can swap roles sometimes.
Last edited by Michelle789; 02-22-2014 at 06:34 PM.
I've finally mastered the art of making salads. My favorite is a delicious Mediterranean salad.
I love this topic. I expect that within 25 years gender will become more a matter of fashion than identity with cosmetic surgery and perhaps genetic manipulation being relatively trivial. One of the driving forces of the economy over the last 50 years has been the creation of ever smaller niches in consumer patterns, avidly sought by producers. Selling to the transgender community is the new bright and shiny object in advertisers eyes which is why we are seeing so much more transgender news and, by the way, why Facebook has just allowed 52 types of gender identification in fb profiles. High fashion which is the forerunner to mainstream acceptance is already quite androgynous. This will only become more evident over the years. The pattern of social justice and social acceptance tends to follow the law which is certainly in the Western World becoming more and more conscious of the importance of human rights issues, including discrimination against transgender folk. This doesn't, of course, mean that gender variance will be universally accepted. There are plenty of men who dislike women working and how long have women been doing that? The answer is in large numbers since WWII, but despite that a sizable minority of American men would rather their wives stay at home. Needless to say this number includes a majority who simply cannot afford that. So I expect within 25 years pretty much full acceptance that gender roles are very varied but a continuation of seething resentment against this by a minority. Of course this all assumes that catastrophic climate change does not occur within this time period. If it does I would expect something quite different, including a probable reversion to hyper conservative gender trends among the victims of it not to mention a rise in religiosity with an associated repression of progressive goals and a reduction in societal acceptance of diversity.
I think for any "25 years from now" guess, you have to look back at how much changed from 25 years ago to now. How much has really changed? Computers are faster I guess, displays are much higher resolution... but really, how different is it from 1989?
What has changed a lot is maybe not acceptance, but at least more tolerance of gays (considering they can now marry, which was completely out of the question 25 years ago). Hopefully the "T" part of LGBT will continue to progress as much as LGB has.
Busker asks: if u crossdress in public won't people think u a trans?
My understanding is that transgender is the umbrella term which includes m2f cross dressers, f2m cross dressers, and all the flavors of gender variety that aren't cisgender male or cisgender female. I have no interest in either transitioning to female biologically or even passing as a woman but I certainly wear women's clothes and am proud to think of myself as trans and quite happy to be seen that way. Cross dressing is an presentation of gender variance. Whether you pass as your gender of choice or not is not quite the same thing as identifying as a gender other than your assigned gender at birth. That gender does not have to be either male or female. It can be both, either, neither, or change depending only on how you feel. It also does not matter if you cross dress only by yourself or for the whole world to see. You do what you do because that is who you are. The only rule is to be true to yourself and that is an exploration not a goal.
Who knows? Lots of different things were thought to be impossible until society shifted in favor of them. Maybe crossdressing needs more awareness. Today all people really know about are drag queens and transsexuals. Mention crossdressing and they'll just figure it's a word associated with one of the forementioned.
Putting on my future goggles:
One thing definitely happens, and that is that people who are comfortable in clothing that once was associated with one gender will wear those clothes and a growing number of people will accept (or at least not care about) the difference. Prediction: Guys who where skirts will catch a second look only if they have nice legs/nice skirt or if the viewer is stuck in the 1950s. Consider how far we have progressed in the past 10 years with gay marriage and things like gay portrayals on TV and in movies. i know, we aren't in nirvana yet, but look at the progress.
Second prediction: Someone who wins $400 million in the lottery (I didn't this week), will fund research into what I'll call "memory sharing". It's not about cross dressing but about the ability to see the world through someone else's mind. Suppose you could save the memories (at least minutes worth) of another gender or someone like a star athlete or dancer or rock star. I think I would pay those millions to catch 10 minutes of how a woman views/feels. Suppose you could implant a memory chip into a woman for a day and save her memory of what her day/night felt like -- mentally and physically -- and make those memories availble for download. Or, capture the memories of the two Superbowl quarterbacks for later download?
Imagine the perspectives this would give us all. So, no body swapping but greater acceptance but maybe some memory swapping.
If earth is still here, we all will be living in our bug out shelters defending our ever lower levels of food supplies. So you need to buy all the pretty fem stuff you can now because the hordes will have ransacked all the stores. Just joking, but there are a lot of people who spend a lot of money being prepared for it.
I do think that we will see more acceptance of gender differences. Having been a CD for over 50 years, when I started if you were caught out of your home you would be arrested. I didn't know it until several years after I was going out and about. Fifty years ago most people had no idea that people did such things. Twenty five years ago it was more known. Today most people know.
Realistically, this question is kind of moot for myself. In 25 years I will be 91. If, indeed, I am still here at all. That being the case it matters little to myself, so I will enjoy now.
Second star to the right and straight on till morning
Hi,
And poor old worm will still be there with not a word to say, and the Eagle will look down and wonder they the mad lot down there still dont get it , just use the fig leaf worked before so it'll work again, two for the men and 4 for the women, spos they'll say do we have to hold them on ...... yet again...... oh no,
...noeleena...
What I hope is lust like everyone else that society one day will accept us for who we are
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