Your perceptions of what is female privilege

[Ally 2112]

i do think women have some privileges over men .Here is thing for the the most part women have had to fight for everthing they have achieved because they were looked at as second class people .Now living in a first world country or western scociety women have a lot of rights and of course invaded a lot of mens once private domains .Living in a third world country they really do not have many rights at all .This what make me grateful for what i do and can do with dressing up in womens clothes and not be arrested

[Ezekiel]

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C'est quoi ca? What the heck does this have to do with what I posted. Please read, I was on your side but it appears all you want to do is pick a fight with whomever posts in response to your opinion.

Isha

I see what you imply here, I misunderstood one part of the post, my apologies. But I wasn't picking a fight, since I thought you were saying that privilege is relative, I wanted to remark that while it is, the majority want equality.

Thats all, and I'm sorry if it sounded aggressive, but it is not my intention.

[ReineD]

Umm . . . that is not what I implied Reine.

No, I wasn't implying that you implied it. lol. My comment was a general observation. Also I think that a man's interest, however the expression shows up on his face, might be interpreted by a woman as either a leer or an admiring glance - it basically boils down to how the woman sees it ... but all of this is difficult to measure. For example I've been on beaches where we are "almost" naked (the closest approximation to being in a gym locker room), and I've received admiring glances from men. I did not view this as leering and it did not make me feel threatened. I imagine I'd feel the same way if I were in a nudist colony.

Wouldn't it be so much easier if we were all in one big room discussing this together? Not just this small exchange between you and me, but exchanges between other posters as well.

[Mark/Rebecca]

Please save me a seat next to you on that discussion, Reine.

[Leslie Langford]

I've been following this thread with increasing fascination - not only because of some of the very pertinent points raised on both sides of the argument - but also because it has tapped into a vein of perhaps previously-buried (suppressed?) angst, insecurity, a perception of "the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence", a re-hash of enduring (but now sometimes discredited) myths of gender inequality where this no longer exists, and dare I say it? - laced with perhaps a hint of resentment, jealousy and even misogyny by some of the members here, and directed at those very GG's whom we profess to revere and attempt to emulate.

A complex issue indeed, but sometimes we can't seem to see the forest for the trees. From a crossdresser's perspective, isn't the one aspect of GG privilege and sense of entitlement as we perceive it - and which really grates on us, especially those of us in DADT relationships - that "society" has given our wives and SO's permission to look down upon us as if we were pond-scum and the lowest form of life because - GASP! - we like to wear women's clothing??? Oh, the horror...the humanity!

We are made to feel like perverts because we may have a preference for panties over boxers or briefs, pantyhose over wool socks, skirts and dresses over pants, and heels over wing-tips or brogues. No "real" man would do such a thing. We become an embarrassment to our wives and SO's because of our effeminate clothing preferences, and God forbid that someone they (we) know might catch us in the act. We would then become a complete laughing-stock and we and our immediate families would quite rightly become fair game to be shamed mercilessly by all and sundry - not only in person, but likely also via the various popular social media which seem to delight in this type of on-line, "holier-than-thou" bullying. Best to move right across the country and go completely off the grid lest our pervy inclinations catch up with us again...

Get a grip, folks - we're talking clothing here. Clothing! Clothing choices that can trigger outrage, moralizing, and hand-wringing of a type best reserved in the cosmic scheme of things for actions like the callous assassination of Cecil the lion king, ISIS atrocities, or the plight of the world's poor, hungry, and disenfranchised.

And all the while, these same wives and SO's get to wear anything they d@mn well please with reckless abandon - "menswear" if they feel the urge to empower themselves by dressing like the boys, or alternatively, dressing like skanky ho's because, after all, their bodies are their own, they don't owe anyone any explanations as to what they do with them, and woe to any man who might entertain the thought of "sl*t-shaming" them by calling B.S. on this type of behavior.

Best of both worlds when it comes to GG clothing choices? You bet. Unequivocal example of female privilege? Absolutely!

[Krististeph]

I sit here making about 1/4 of what i could... waiting for a full time position. My wife is behind me- making close to 6 figures in nursing, and going to school on top of that...

What do i do?

I keep the house clean. Wash and fold clothes. Buy groceries, and food for the animals. I keep the house maintained, be it plumbing, electrical, mechanical, architectural. Maintain the cars, her motorcycle, and other items. Kill spiders. Relocate most everything else because snow white does not want to see things killed. Build additions for the house. Accompany/sag her on her runs. Clean the animals. Wash the linens. Care and spend extra time with the animals.

Then, when she gets home, I cook. I print out her school stuff. I format her papers and references. Do research. Write position papers she can work off of. Outline her assignments. Proofread. Align to APA style. We collaborate on her school work-- she has done enough to be teaching the stuff she has to slog through- and actually often does.

And i get yelled at if the wash is not done, or the house is a mess. But we ultimately function as a true team- snarky and snotty sometimes, but together for 25+ years- beating the odds and and the rest of the world.

I really am a housewife. I kind of like it, but I hate that she has the burden of earning now. We've swapped this several times- there is no score keeping.

But yes- guys are excluded from the 'home-maker' role by default. And ostracized. My neighbor who retired early is in a similar position (not TG), we bitch about it regularly as we take care of the 97 year old lady's house who lives between us.

Yep- we get the shaft, just like women do/did. But we (the neighbor and i ) both agree we have the advantage being male, regardless of household position. It is unequal, but in it's own strange way- reasonably equatable. At least in our locale and micro-society...

But no matter what- you still protect your family first- regardless of gender or position.

And I get to dress how i want at home. So I'm not complainin' about nothin' no how... this will only last a limited time, then it's 'put on the daddy pants...' (albeit with satin panties) for however long need be. I only wish everyone else could be so lucky... And the hilarious part is that i don't really think she accepts me as TG: she plays along, supports me, but she really is not at all 'into' it- not even for the engagement of someone she cares for. It's an odd dynamic. But we deal with it. There are a few things i am not crazy about her either, but quid quo pro.

[ReineD]

Krististeph, how wonderful that you and your wife have found a balance that is good for you!! Before kids, when I was working hard often evenings and weekends, I wished I had someone at home to take care of all the stuff too! It worked well though because my ex was very good about sharing the responsibilities at home with me, so it would have been nice for both of us to have someone else take care of it all. lol.

I think that increasingly, couples are sharing the load. I have 3 sons in their 20s and I KNOW they do not see a gender gap as much as prior generations. I can totally see my oldest son, after having had kids (they don't have farm animals to take care of), either staying home while his wife becomes the major income earner, or both having flex jobs so as to not leave the kids in child care. My SO has many grad students from all over the world (most are married) and about half of the students are women. The female student's husbands are in supportive roles (PhD programs are demanding) and these couples come from Sri Lanka, Saudi Arabia, India, Bhutan, Nepal, some of the African countries (and other countries that I cannot remember right now). So the world is definitely changing, not just in Europe, Australia, and North America. One woman from Saudi Arabia came here with her 5 children and husband (she had a 6th child while in the program), and her husband's sole role was to take care of the house and kids so she could complete her degree. Her own religious beliefs still compelled her to adhere strictly to wearing the burka, she still went out in public with her husband (and kids) present (although she did give herself permission to meet with her advisor, my SO, alone and she went to all her classes alone) but she by no means felt limited in terms of attaining a higher degree and having her husband here to take care of the kids so she could do so.

I know this is not part of your statements, but there is no way that I consider the narrowing of gender roles as an indication that women are becoming more masculine, and the men are becoming more feminine. Men and women are just as firmly ensconced in their genders and gender-identities as they always were. It's just that now the definitions of the "roles" are changing. For example it is no longer "masculine" to mow the lawn, remodel the bathroom, work full time, or get a PhD. It is no longer "feminine" to cook, do the laundry, and take care of the kids. And everyone changes the diapers. :p

Please save me a seat next to you on that discussion, Reine.

Awww

that "society" has given our wives and SO's permission to look down upon us as if we were pond-scum and the lowest form of life because - GASP! - we like to wear women's clothing???

I'm only a drop in the bucket, but I don't look upon CDers as pond-scum. I don't think the other GGs here do as well. And most people my SO and I run into while out, I don't believe look at us as pond-scum either, even though they might be scratching their heads in puzzlement. A few people do have strong negative opinions, but that's their issue. My brother does not approve. But, he doesn't think that my SO is a horrible human being, he rather likes him.

[Leslie Langford]

I'm only a drop in the bucket, but I don't look upon CDers as pond-scum. I don't think the other GGs here do as well. And most people my SO and I run into while out, I don't believe look at us as pond-scum either, even though they might be scratching their heads in puzzlement. A few people do have strong negative opinions, but that's their issue. My brother does not approve. But, he doesn't think that my SO is a horrible human being, he rather likes him.

Fair enough, Reine, but I was specifically referring to the DADT wives and SO's, and that clearly doesn't apply to you and most of the other GG partners here. Let's face it, if they were really hard core DADT proponents, they sure as heck wouldn't be spending any of their precious free time on a CD forum trying to learn what makes their spouses tick or else getting advice on how to come to terms with their CDing. In their world, CDing is vile and in defiance of the proper order of things, and in no way deserves to be accepted, let alone tolerated.

Wives and SO's are far more likely to adopt a NIMBY ("Not in my back yard") stance compared with other (even "vanilla") GG's that a CDer is likely to encounter among friends, relatives, or even strangers. This issue has been discussed ad nauseum here, and we all know that it comes back to the matter of sex and intimacy that is at the core of a couples relationship, and where CDing throws a monkey wrench into the works because it is so hard for these GG partners to get their heads around this.

[Krististeph]

Krististeph, how wonderful that you and your wife have found a balance that is good for you!! Before kids, when I was working hard often evenings and weekends, I wished I had someone at home to take care of all the stuff too! It worked well though because my ex was very good about sharing the responsibilities at home with me, so it would have been nice for both of us to have someone else take care of it all. lol.

I think that increasingly, couples are sharing the load. I have 3 sons in their 20s and I KNOW they do not see a gender gap as much as prior generations.

Thanks Reine. It helps to hear that others do the same thing. It's definitely gender-role related, I still feel i should be the one doing the most 'supporting'- in terms of money and house stuff... It's a but of a ego reduction not earning as much as she is. At the same time, I'm both proud of her and wish she did not have to work so hard. At the moment, she is sick with some nasty strain of flu, but i have a few weeks before classes begin in earnest.

I think some of the housework drive goes back to the army, squaring away all the details- getting the troops ready for the next foray. Uniforms would be easier, of course. But I do like taking care of the little things so that she can get out to work with minimum fuss, get back and relax with nothing in the way, eat, nap, play, study, etc. Which I think is funny (odd) because this attention to detail and planning was one of the things i got a lot of shit for in the army- by my own squad. Anything not redneck was seen as 'gay' and derided. It was just a bad combination of timing and people I think. But just as the army marches on it's stomach (requires a supply chain), so does the household- and I'm happy to do the work. She makes the majority of the money, decides when to pay the bills, etc. We even split ownership of things to maximize our credit rating leverage. I know lots of people would freak at this- but we decided early on not to 'keep score' on things- we each have our own certain things, shared stuff, and we are very happy with the arrangement.

But I still feel a bit guilty when she comes home from working, and I've been dressed up all day playing 'housewife'. The house gets cleaned and food or snacks are waiting, research is ready and templates are formatted. Yet I still feel like I'm not doing all I can, because I'm paying attention to what i want to do as well. I guess I need to find a balance. Granted, I don't talk to her as much about this as perhaps I should, but I don't want to overwhelm her with any more issues or things to think about than she already has. I can see that this is a bad habit to get into for me... and I'm thinking 'it will work itself out', but we have only two more months of her crazy school schedule to go- and then she can relax. After a few months of getting her head back together, maybe I'll try talking about it then- until then- I'll stay lower key around her.