I didn't say I was "bi when dressed" maybe you should read the post again?Originally Posted by famousunknown
I didn't say I was "bi when dressed" maybe you should read the post again?
I read it. That's what I got out of it. Maybe you need to explain it better?
Hey, hey -- there's no need for hostility over someone's sexual exploration/fantasies. The human psyche, and the sexual inclinations which stem therefrom, is/are tremendously complex. I doubt anyone can express certainty over whether or not sexuality "works a certain way" and be credible unless they're perhaps a neuroscientist who has shown that sexual feelings and associations remain consistent where all other mental states are variable. Unless you can prove that, you must take the approach of cognitive psychology and take Allison's statements as to her thoughts and feelings at face value.
P.S. The fact that she's willing to explore this issue at all, let alone in a public forum where others will offer their opinions, serves as evidence that she would not be "ashamed of being gay". She merely wants clarification, as she needs to sort out whatever cognitive dissonance she may be experiencing.
Last edited by SarahMarie42; 02-06-2013 at 08:35 PM.
"None is more cruel and violent than the coward"
-Italian economist and sociologist Vilfredo Pareto-
Yeah there are conditions under which anyone could engage in acts with the same gender. Use your imagination.
"cognitive dissonance" huh? righttttt
"Cognitive dissonance" is a phenomenon where self-concepts don't line up.
http://www.apa.org/pi/aids/resources...issonance.aspx
Read about social psychology, it's fun. And it makes one's statements/arguments more relevant.
"None is more cruel and violent than the coward"
-Italian economist and sociologist Vilfredo Pareto-
LexiTV, I like your analysis. I do not know if it is 100% correct, but it does offer a lot of food for thought. My feeling about being Bi is that it is on two spectrum's, one based on the predominant gender attraction, and the other based on how one views their Bi-ness. So, in the first case at one end of the spectrum one could be primarily attracted to his or her hetero opposite gender and only likes to be with the same hetero gender occasionally when the mood and opportunity come together at the same moment. At the other end of that spectrum one is more attracted to the same gender. E.g. "I prefer to be with X gender more than the other".
In the second case, which may be more in your line of thinking, I believe that a person can reach a state of mind where the actual gender of their sexual attraction is totally unimportant. That is, if they are attracted to someone, whatever gender, then they follow their attraction regardless of gender. This other spectrum to me is one where someone thinks or acts only a "little" Bi, while at the other end of that spectrum the person has reached that special state of mind that I described just above, they are totally Bi. I consider that to be the pure or ideal Bi-ness. It is a point of self actualization similar to what we do when we totally accept who we are, actually embrace it, and do not let other's opinions or comments interfere with us being us. Something that I think that most of us are striving for. It is also similar to what we want and hope of others, not to just tolerate and accept parts of who we are, but rather, to totally accept us and really everyone else in this world as human beings however they present themselves, whatever culture or religion or ethnicity they are. In other words, people do not discriminate against others just because they are not the same as they are.
PS: SarahMarie, I like your thoughts too, and thanks for defending the OP. You did it much more eloquently than I ever could.
Last edited by AllieSF; 02-07-2013 at 12:54 AM.
I can't remember where I read this, but they say that being bi is often times a stepping stone to swinging preferences from one sex to another, usually from opposite-sex to same-sex. Eventually, a distinct preference for one sex or the other will be reached.
Allie I do think there are people who truly are pansexual (their lover's gender no matter what it is, does not matter nor does it register with them), but I should think this would be rather rare, just as rare as being asexual.
Last, there is also bi-ness as an experimentation stage. There has most definitely been a trend among young high school or college girls in recent memory to experiment with same-sex sex, although the opinion is that this does not last. One sociologist suggested the same-sex experimentation among young women might be a reaction to AIDS. And the reason the experimentation is not as prevalent among same-sex college guys is a stronger sense of homophobia among men. MY SO and I used to go to an alternative club (LGBT + Straight), and there were quite a few younger women there who made a big show out of being lipstick lesbian or bi (they got a lot of attention from the guys when they were bumping and grinding together on the dance floor). But honestly, I think it was just show. I knew one of them.
More on experimentation ... we see this here all the time. CDers have fantasies of being with men while dressed, and some will experiment (I think that most won't). If they're straight they'll get turned off, and if they don't get turned off then they're gay, or possibly on their way to determining that they are gay, or they're AGP and the fantasy of being a woman is more powerful than anything else.
Edit - ... one more ... and then there are people who have tremendously strong libidos or who are into fetish (BDSM) in a big way. I should think that sexual attraction would be rather flexible for these people with threesomes, group sex, etc, where it is more about pure sex than a romantic or emotional attachment to anyone.
Last edited by ReineD; 02-07-2013 at 03:31 PM.
Reine
Back to the original poster:
Exploring ones sexuality is only a huge issue to yourself as an individual. No one else really cares. If you have bi-sexual feelings when dressed en fem there is no cause for fear, concern, or panic your just being honest with yourself about your feelings. If you think about it you are presenting and very much thinking like a woman. If you want to explore, find the right person that will respect your limits and see what happens. You may end up saying, well that was that a)not for me b)some things were OK c)It was fun and on and on. It is not a stepping stone to being gay. You cannot be turned into gay nor can a gay be turned into straight, that is proven and documented. Doc Rob gave such a great analogy, how do you know if you like zucchini if you've never tasted it? So to net it out, don't worry and keep an open mind - about everything in life.
I never new how masculine I was until I tried to be a woman
I. Don't. Care.
I find nothing at all about men attractive except their weiners.
Thank you for your informed and civil contributions to this conversation, Sarah.
Ah...the old "sexual orientation" dichotomy of gay/straight. It is all BS. A way to segregate. I will address your conondrum, AllisonTheGoddess, but not directly. I am going to share a vastly different perspective with you, and you can draw from it what you will.
There are ONLY TWO Sexual "Orientations": Sexual, and NOT Sexual (a.k.a. 'Celibate', if you're Catholic).
ALL other labels "Gay", "Straight", "Bi" (really dislike that one), or "Bi-Curious" (dislike that one even more)...are nothing more than COMFORT ZONES within a larger body of varied tastes in pleasure.
It's like any other comfort zone. You know what you like, and you indulge in it from time to time. You see similar parallels all over: Omnivores VS The Vegans is an example. Guess what: They make pizza pies for both sides of that fence.
I've eaten both kinds and both are awesome.
Sexuality is no different. I've had both. Both are awesome. My comfort zone is huge, and thusly; there is more fun in it to be had.
Never once in my enire life have I ever heard a man or woman say: "I'm bi-celibate" I guess it would mean NO sex, but masturbation is OK...?
If you want the scoop on the Celibate Orientation, I'd say go ask a Priest. They seem to have all of those loopholes figured out.
Me? My sexual orientation is SEXUAL. And that's it, and everything that goes with it. Life is awesome, so be awesome in life. Never limit yourself to the expectations of another or group of others, if you can surpass those expectations of yourself. The choice is yours, and always has been. You can stay in your comfort zone, or venture out and establish new borders. You crossdress, so you know already of that.
My advice, for it may or may not be worth: Go with what you like, and leave others to theirs. What do YOU want to remember tomorrow?
;D
Much love, respect, and admiration to you as a WHOLE being.
---Nikki50/50
P.S.> I've nothing against Catholics. Or Pizza.
Last edited by Nikki50/50; 02-08-2013 at 02:58 AM. Reason: Post Script: on non sequitur humour
Nikki, what is it that you dislike so much about Bi or Bi-Curious? They are descriptive terms that help others to understand the sexuality or sexual desires/preferences/orientation of others. If you don't like labels, are you a pizza lover?? So, you are a "sexual" person, is that a label? I am just trying to understand what you wrote.
Straights and homosexuals (gays and lesbians), would disagree with you. lol
I personally think there are very few, long-term bis (or pansexual if you prefer). I think they are as rare as asexuals. Eventually many bisexuals gravitate towards same-sex attraction.
I agree with you about bi-curious though (sorry Allie). It doesn't make sense to me. If someone is curious about the opposite sex, why don't they just try it so they will know? "Bi-curious" is really just another word for "same-sex fantasy", and a fantasy does not indicate an actual sexual preference. So maybe the people who say they are bi-curious would rather remain in the fantasy stage rather than find out they are turned off when they enact their fantasies?
Reine
Not bi/bi-curious as the state of being, so much as the labels and what they imply.
They blend the two superlatives of sexuality, and perpetuate the label idealogy. 'Bi-curious' is just a self-security label saying "I'm completely "Bi", but don't want to admit it, so I'll say I enjoy the idea of dual gender sexuality without being 'bi' ".
I'm sorry if I offend. That is not my intent. But I've always had a problem with labels, especially the wrongfully applied sort. My opinion is that "Bi-Curious" is a really bad label.
As I stated in my perspective...all these are comfort zones. There are better words we could use to describe them. We just have to appy the right touch of imagination.
Perhaps they could...but i can reiterate that gay/lesbian can function as a label if those who are either need them. But what I was stating as my opinion (that's all I can righteously claim it to be, after all lol) is that those are only applicable as Comfort Zones, not true defining Sexual Orientations.
Last edited by Lorileah; 02-08-2013 at 11:50 AM. Reason: consecutive post. please use edit button when multiposting at the same time frame
I'm sure you are going to get a ton of comments on this one. Finding the right guy to let Gina fulfill the fantasy came early for me, and I really enjoyed the experience. I have thoroughly enjoyed being the girl in a relationship whether it is to go out or other things. I hope if you take that step, you find someone who will treat you right. I have been lucky to find a great guy and gal who know of the other, and agree to let me chose who I want to be on any given day, with no conflict. Good luck!
ditto---I'm with you all the way---being naked with another naked guy has no appeal to me. Being fully dressed in a sexy outfit with makeup, purfume, wig etc with another CD done up the same way is really excitingI'm hetero-bi-gay I guess. I'm married to a very supportive woman and she knows i have a CD lover and she approves. To her that's not cheating. IF I were to have relations with another woman, that would b...in her eyes. But I don't have that desire. When I'm with her it's normal to BE with her, and when I'm with him, it's normal to be with him. I switch gears I suppose and ramp up from hetero to bi-gay...It's difficult to explain..and I always dress up with my CD lover, and he does the same. Just two naked guys...doesn't turn me on. The clothing, the heels, the makeup, lipstick, the whole 9 is my desire, and I'm very fortunate that my lover feels the same way.
My wife doesn't engage in sex with us, but she has watched and taken pix and vids and she finds it curious...she's had relations with other women before we met, but it didn't really turn her on...and I had a CD lover years ago before I was married and it was wonderful. So if there's a way to differentiate between Hetero and bi it would be what I've just explained. I think Gay would not be the appropriate term to explain my relationship with my CD partner. Bi will suffice, because we're both married to women, but crave each other when dressed, so there' that.
To me gay is just that. Wanting to be with your same sex 24/7. Hetero is also described in the same manner. Bi is being able to switch gears and enjoy both equally. Yes, I'm with a man, but not really...sexually yes, but it goes so far beyond that...dressing, going out shopping, having fun..just as easily as I do the same thing with my wife. HIS wife doesn't know, and that's really none of my business. That's on him. I do know we have a lot of fun and my wife approves so maybe I'm just super fortunate, I don't know. Of course I told my wife WAY before we were married that I was a CD, and 12 years now, it hasn't harmed our relationship, matter of fact she loves me more for it. My CD relationship is a little over 8 months and running strong and it seems to be working out pretty well, so, in a nutshell, I would consider myself 65% Hetero, and 35% Bi-Gay...if that makes any sense, dear hearts....
[SIZE="4"][/SIZE]
As written in a post on this thread that, somehow, got lost I will again back Jennifer 100%. Sisters are free to create all the theories they want but it doesn't change the truth. In that last post islands and prisons were mentioned as deal breakers. I recalled Jonny Cash's song
"A Boy Named Sue" after performing his show at many prisons and getting to know the inmates. His point was that (he didn't cover this
small percentage of inmates already gay that became BI) after suffering rape and sodomy for years as sex slaves the majority were encouraged in his song to revert to their previous inclinations and that they are not branded for life as gay or bi. Also dreaming or fantasies when dressed does not change your orientation but the act does. I am swayed with second thoughts on those, usually in a school environment, who "experiment". Then the question must be posed: experiment for how long before you are bi? Then one has to go back to the AMA's definition of homosexuality to find in recent years that it is not a personal decision --- you are born that way. In which case then how can one become BI if not already gay? In my mind then the logical progression for CDs must be that they had to already be gay before finding the male body appealing. Rest my case.
Julie
I feel just like u.
I know what u mean.
I have gotten even a little envious with my last gf when we were intimate ... I kind of wished I was her.
This can be so confusing. LOL
My God, Purple! I clicked on the last post link on this thread (from my Subscriptions list), so it took me straight to your post.
The picture scared me to death, it was so unexpected.
Reine
AllisontheGoddess, If you truly have the feeling, you will want to give up everything for it.
I have had this fantasy on occasions, but it got put into reality once by my three girlfriends.
They took me to a drive-in movie and I sat in the back seat with this guy who knew who I was.
The other two had boyfriends and it was a bit cramped in the car.
I eventually sat on his lap and had my arm around him.
The others kissed and cuddled so we did a bit too.
His searching hands did get under my blouse and I responded in kind.
We giggled and joked about it as we were aware of what the others might be doing and they had set both of us up.
It was not unpleasant and we enjoyed the moment.
We thought if they want us to play girlfriend/boyfriend, why not!
Work on your elegance,
and beauty will follow.
Personally i always go for the simpler explaination. Fantasies are just that... fantasies. They seem to be upsetting you or making you rethink some things, but is that because ur freaked out about having them? or because you actually want to go and do this. Mental fantasies and practicality are two totally different things. Sure sometimes i love the idea of entertaining in my head that i would have some guy that would pay for everything and i could just be woman all the time and not work and etc. But is that practical? for me no, and do i actually want that? NOT AT ALL but i love entertaining the idea as a fantasy haha. So maybe its not so complicated. Just try and think through it calmly.
Being dressed up is much better if you have someone else to admire and enjoy it with you.
------------------------------------------------------
If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary-wise; what it is it wouldn't be, and what it wouldn't be, it would. You see?
- Alice Kingsley
It has been done, a fair number of times. First was 50 years ago, by Kinsey et. al., the so-called Kinsey Reports. Wikipedia's summary of the stats is:
Approximately 6000 females were surveyed.The reports also state that nearly 46% of the male subjects had "reacted" sexually to persons of both sexes in the course of their adult lives, and 37% had at least one homosexual experience. 11.6% of white males (ages 20–35) were given a rating of 3 (about equal heterosexual and homosexual experience/response) throughout their adult lives. The study also reported that 10% of American males surveyed were "more or less exclusively homosexual for at least three years between the ages of 16 and 55" (in the 5 to 6 range).
7% of single females (ages 20–35) and 4% of previously married females (ages 20–35) were given a rating of 3 (about equal heterosexual and homosexual experience/response) on Kinsey Heterosexual-Homosexual Rating Scale for this period of their lives. 2 to 6% of females, aged 20–35, were more or less exclusively homosexual in experience/response, and 1 to 3% of unmarried females aged 20–35 were exclusively homosexual in experience/response.
Criticisms have been made of Kinsey's scale. One of the alternative studies included "Laumann et al. (1994) found that of the 8.6% of women reporting some same gender sexuality, 88% reported same gender sexual attraction, 41% reported some same gender sexual behaviour and 16% reported a lesbian or gay identity."
Thus, there is serious reason to suspect that Jennifer's opinion that "the bisexuals are a very small niche" is not in accordance with what studies have found.
