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I know I have seen posts on this before, but I'd like to hear something new on it nonetheless. How has HRT affected your genitals (pre-op)? Are you able to get erections? If so, how much effort is needed and how stable is it? Do you know any reason that would affect your ability to have children?
I wouldn't call it my friend - more of an unwanted colleague who's is hitching a ride for now and who will get a huge shock in the next few months!
The ability for erection is really down to the testosterone level. Mine is very low, which means a little shrinkage, no sex drive and no errection. Because my drive is gone, I can't really be bothered to spend too much time to see if an errection is possible after a lot of effort.
- and yes being on an anti androgens for a while will mean that you end up sterile.
hugs
Suzy
[SIZE=2]I never referred to mine as my friend....mine was more like an unwanted house guest that just wouldn't leave....[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]After over 4 years on HRT, I'm happy to say it's dead....in other words, no erections...but I still do stimulate the nerves every so often so they don't go completely dead, because I need those to work for my clitoris...[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]But as they say, I'm now chemically castrated...so I couldn't produce any new pups even if I wanted to..., which I wouldn't want anyway..[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]I already had my children long before I started my transition..[/SIZE]
After six months of HRT I no longer get morning or spontaneous erections. And to be honest with you I have no interest in expending any effort in finding out if my STBX-friend is functional. I know that many still have "obligations", or just desires, with significant others, but to me that's like wanting to have your cake and eat it too.
Well, I have not had kids, want them, primarily attracted to women so the pieces fitting would be great. I just want the softer features and real breasts beyond the A cups I have naturally. Is there a way to get HRT without anti-androgens?
EDIT: Looking a bit at it, it appears that that part of it is reversable though the breast growth is not. Perhaps I'd just have to be non-working for a period of time?
If that is your only goal then stay away from drugs and get breat augmentation surgery. For the softer skin get laser and/or electrolysis and a good facial routine going.Quote:
I just want the softer features and real breasts beyond the A cups I have naturally.
I don't understand why so many people think HRT is a game to play just because they think they would like to have breasts? It's nothing to play with. The affects are permanent and carries the risks of side affects that can cause serious health problems, including death.
OH, and there is NO guarentee your breasts will grow very much anyway
I'd really, really prefer the natural breasts. I don't want the hard, fake ones. i do want the redistribution of fat without 50 scars all over my body and thousands of dollars.
I want all my options open. Why should HRT be off limits to me because I'm not interested in the legal sex change surgery? The more I know, the more informed of a decision I can make.
I'd really, really prefer the natural breasts. I don't want the hard, fake ones. i do want the redistribution of fat without 50 scars all over my body and thousands of dollars.
I want all my options open. Why should HRT be off limits to me because I'm not interested in the legal sex change surgery? The more I know, the more informed of a decision I can make.
Dear Veronica,
It's not that hormone therapy is off limits to you. It's just that you have an unrealistic view of what hormone therapy will do for you.
Look, we ALL want lovely soft real breasts. Getting them through hormone therapy is a real crap shoot. You have heard us say time and time again YMMV. This is real. There is NO way of telling how much breast growth you will get on hormone therapy without actually DOING it. You MIGHT get NONE. You will most likely get SOME. Those who get breast growth similar to a natal female are few and far between. Almost EVERY transwoman I know (and I know quite a few) has eventually gotten breast augmentation.
And the redistribution of fat? Just the same. YMMV. Actually your millage WILL vary. Unless we are fat to begin with, most of us get little to no fat redistribution. Ya gotta have fat to have fat redistribution. This is not a tragedy, there are plenty of women out there with small butts and small hips. I'm one of them.
And honey, hormone therapy WILL effect your ability (AND YOUR DESIRE) to get and maintain an erection. Eventually it will effect your body's ability to produce viable sperm. If you desire to have a satisfying sexual relationship with another woman, you are NOT gonna be able to have penetrating intercourse with YOUR penis be a part of that relationship.
This is OK, you know. Thousands and thousands of lesbian women have wonderfully satisfying sexual relationships without a penis. If you are so dependent of the proper functioning of your penis that you are unwilling to lose it, forget hormone therapy. It just ain't for you, hon.
My "opinion" has been reflected by most, a functioning penis and natural boobs are mutually exclusive. One or the other, not both. The option of going on hormones long enough to produce boobs and then getting off them to get the sperm generating again is probably not doable either. Seems to me, if one wants viable sperm at any point in the future then I wouldn't recommend hormones at all. To much a chance for permanent bad side-effects on the sperm from the hormones. Seems it'd be a really big crap shoot. And, I'd be way too concerned not just on the quantity of sperm but also the quality. I don't remember reading anything anywhere about how long term hormone use affects the quality of the sperm, but I wouldn't want to risk my kids life on possibly deficient sperm. Know what I mean.
Good luck to you hun.
btw, my penis shrank to about a third it's pre-hormone size and it doesn't get erect at all anymore. My testees shrank some, but it's hard to discern how much. At first, when I stopped producing sperm, my orgasms were very anti-climatical. But, as time has progressed the quality has definitely improved. My libido suffered greatly in the beginning but is rebounding. For men, testosterone provides libido. It's all simple. In female, libido comes from numerous, sometimes complicated places. I find my libido much more womanly these days, it's there, it comes from differnt places in different ways and as I'm growing accustomed to it, I like it this way very much, It is so nice not to truely be able to not have sex on the brain all the time. But, I can definitely be a sex kitty!
Well, I appreciate your concern. There is an overwhelming opinion that there is no saving the sterility. I looked into implants and the safe, saline ones are hard and will make wrinkling of the breasts when I add that much with so little breast mass, and silicone are still dangerous, despite feeling more like breast tissue. I don't know if there are different kinds than that.
finding a balance is always harder than going one way or the other.
Some of us still have function, of our little friend.
Find a good DR that will help you with gender desire, remember the symbol is a rainbow for a reason. your options vary as you move from your birth gender, you need to read, and consult as you need. All ways remember to think it out, with input from you selected DR.
There is room in the middle, options may vary!:)
Lindia Z
Thank you Linda, that is much more of the attitude I was hoping to see. If you have any suggestions for what to look at, I'd be all ears.
I think most that are concerned with saving their fertility while on hormones will put some of their swimmers on ice. This is my plan and should be starting my HRT real soon if everything goes right with my psychiatrist this week.
Like the last post mentioned I know of a few trans working girls that tweak their hormones to be able to maintain an erection. Personally I think this is a horrible idea, HRT is hard enough on the body when properly administered and supervised.
Anyway my 2 cents,
jenna
One of the reasons that questions like this tend to get stern answers is because along with the possible good outcomes of HRT, there are significant risks - and many of the changes are not reversable. Hence we are actually trying to save folks from possibly making a mistake they will regret.
As for HRT without anti-androgens, the fact is that estrogen, all by itself - with no other drugs, will cause all the affects people are talking about. The reasons we take a group of drugs is to get the maximum possible results - and to a small degree, to hurry things along. HRT isn't and Ala' cart menu; you get what you get, no choices. It cannot be tailored to result in breasts and not <fill in blank>. There are a few things that you can be sure of, regardless of what drugs you take.
One: you will be made sterile after a while. When ? No one knows, so if you want kids later, bank some sperm prior to starting therapy.
Two: you will lose some or all of your ability to have erections. How much ? Won't know till you get there. I've been on a seriously strong regime for 9 months and I can still get an erection with the right stimulation. I do that on purpose, weekly. As others have said, need those nerves working for later !!
Three: your body will stop producing much Testosterone and after a point, even if you stop the hormones, your body will not start testosterone production at a normal level again in your life. Hence you'd have to go on Testosterone shots or the like if you wanted off the HRT. Fact is you need to have one of the two hormones systems up and running for healthy living.
Four: breast development, regardless of all things, is a crap shoot. Most likely you'll get some, most likely not much. Even if you have some now ... You cannot not trust what people say they have, or pictures you see. Many exaggerate their results. Sure, there are some folks who get great natural results. As mentioned in other posts ... it is rare. Ask any GG about breast development and they will tell you that ya just don't know till it is done. The only way to increase breast size, for sure, is to get pregnant.
I do not mean to sound harsh or condescending ... it is just that HRT is serious medicine and is something that a person should consider carefully.
[SIZE=2]If this is more about just wanting breast & keeping your man part functioning....then why not do what the she-males do.......get on a small dose of estrogen, then get breast implants,...thats how they keep their thing working well...Guarantied...if that's what floats your boat...[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]If you want softer facial features on low dose HRT, then get some Botox injections too...just another trick of the trade..[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]But if the millions of GG's that have had breast implants are their fine with it...why is that not good enough for you?? [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]I'm even thinking of a BA myself later on because I want to move into the larger D or DD cup range...since I have reached my peak growth at a C cup..[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]If you want to take a chances playing around with HRT & hope for the best with your reproductivity down the road, then so be it...but the advice you were given is solid real world experience....not wishful thinking...[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]So do as you will...[/SIZE]
I never had those, a few times, maybe 10-20 my entire life. So lucky, since those are uncomfortable.Quote:
Originally Posted by luvSophia
What are the long term affects? I'm fine with making my life 20 years shorter, if those 0-30 years left is of higher quality.Quote:
Originally Posted by pamela_a
Exactly. But science isn't absolute either.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
I'd settle for small boobs any day if the rest could fix itself.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephenie S
Tragedy / non tragedy...I can't have any fat is it is, that would be a disaster....Quote:
And the redistribution of fat? Just the same. YMMV. Actually your millage WILL vary. Unless we are fat to begin with, most of us get little to no fat redistribution. Ya gotta have fat to have fat redistribution. This is not a tragedy, there are plenty of women out there with small butts and small hips. I'm one of them.
I only care about the orgasm, and if I look at the media, I'm not the only one, woman or man. Especially women are focused on in this regard. It's an important aspect for satisfaction. I tend to do it to get the stuff out of my body(the few drops that comes slowly out of it, how this is supposed to impregnate I dunno, hope the are good swimmers, would for sure have to lay on top so it could drop down). Uuh..these things confuses my my little head...Quote:
And honey, hormone therapy WILL effect your ability (AND YOUR DESIRE) to get and maintain an erection. Eventually it will effect your body's ability to produce viable sperm. If you desire to have a satisfying sexual relationship with another woman, you are NOT gonna be able to have penetrating intercourse with YOUR penis be a part of that relationship.
When you say sex on the brain, do you mean physically? Or sending out sexual signals, with body language, create attraction. I've never quite understood this notion.Quote:
Originally Posted by TerryTerri
In my country you dont get hormones unless you are approved for SRS. No in the middle.Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda Z
Seems like an excellent solution. But who knows, maybe the sperm isn't even potent as it is. Now that would truly be ironic/hilarious/tragic.Quote:
Originally Posted by CharleneT
I guess it's more like getting the stuff out of the system. It goes out instead of in, or something like that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Karen564
as i think the others have been good at iterating, there is always some effect on genitalia. just what effects, and how much, is impossible to predict, as it changes person to person. take me, for instance (i could make a joke but i won't). i've been on HRT for six months, and, as far as i can tell (as i haven't been having sex anyway), there has been very little effect. contrasts quite a bit with the others here, eh?
also, HRT is, again, VERY SERIOUS MEDICINE. treating it as anything less will only contribute to the stereotypes out there against us........oh, and possibly risk yourself.
and as a side note, i always thought of mah danglies as an enemy rather than a friend.
You know, whenever I read one of these threads I tend to think the same thing: If you don't consider erectile disfunction a POSITIVE outcome of HRT, HRT is probably not for you.
my little friend has been anything but a friend. it's more of a nuisance to me and if i could be rid of it tomorrow i would.
That makes sense, but you make it sound so simple..Frankly I'm more concerned about the rest of the body. The penis, how much is that? like 1% of the surface area. And in my case, really tiny as well. My height, hands, skin, face, shoulders, hips, feet, voice, inverse body hair growth. Those are the things that really make me hate myself. I've never understood this obsession about something as tiny as the penis. Is something one use for urination, and occasional orgasm-and supposedly can produce children. But having children, and status as mother, that however may be a big deal, depending on how strong the mother instinct is. The sexual aspect I presume is taken care of with a good surgeon and a good man.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hope
So for me a erectile penis means two possibilities with time. Orgasms(should be preserved, as it is sexy, and stress reliever-the difference I would think is that you can live it, and not be in a fantasy anymore, like really be there), and motherhood(only option is the sperm) (for some this may be the reason to live).
Veronica..
what is your goal with the HRT?...
whatever you decide..you need a clear goal in mind or you will be taking a meaningful health risk and be disappointed...
physical results are not satisfactory without testosterone blocking..you may completely lose function of your penis, you may not...you will definitely go sterile and you can't control how fast..
if your goal is specific and related to how your body looks (breasts/fat distribution), they you have to know that what happens happens...you may gain significant weight with marginal breast growth..thats part of the reason why the transitioners here jump on folks that say they want to start HRT to get breasts....it doesnt work that way all the time...you may want subtle changes, and changes may be quite noticable..
if your goal is mental health, or to test the waters and get the feeling of having the right hormones, then i actually say go for it...but if you are worried about your little friend, then that's not the reason or you are tricking yourself...
get your sperm frozen so if you proceed at least you'll have that...
all the best,
Kate
BTW
Silicone breast implants are not dangerous..its not even clear they ever were unless you just inject the silicon...
i'm getting breast augmentation and i'm using silicon ..
http://www.justbreastimplants.com/br...s/silicone.htm
I have seen Estriol identified as a therapy for MS, as relapses seem to be absent in pregnancy, However, Estroil is a form of estrogen so I wonder if it could enlarge breasts:), but cause ED:sad:, if taken in sufficient doses to mimic pregnancy.
It would be:Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele
1) breast growth (for that natural feeling)
2) softening of the facial features
3) reduction of body hair growth
4) redistribution of fat, especially away from the gut area which is where all my fat goes.
5) ideally, removing the adam's apple (which stays far to the top of my throat I hide it without problem) to feminize my voice, though I understand that's not an actual effect :(
all that stuff may or may not happen
in the 20 months of HRT (and i take massive t blockers)
I've seen modest breast growth..just enough that i could not go topless..but nothing that shows under a shirt
Modest changes to face
no change to hips (i already had a curvy fat butt though)
i've been very disappointed at the impact on my hair (i still have LOTS of hair on my chest arms and belly) , even with the T blockers
i was able to keep the weight off, but i have friends that have gained alot of weight and have massive cravings for sweets after starting HRT
i really find myself wishing for more changes,
i'm very satisfied though with the "feeling" of being authentic and having the "right hormones" in my body...i felt the placebo effect from the moment i started taking HRT...LOL
are you transitioning?
i'm not against HRT for non transitioners, however, i would say that one should be very careful to manage expectations if you are not doing it with an eye towards transition..especially without T blockers..
I'm sick of this feeling (of dysphoria, not your feeling)... now THAT'S what I'm talking about :) Gimme! (sorry for the flippancy but this is what I'm looking for right now).Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele
Do T-blockers make you swear less in- or ex-ternally at all? I've been having a lot of Debra Morgan moments (re: Dexter on the telly) in the voice in my head and I'd like them to go away, please.
Anyway, Veronica, I think you mis-spelled "fiend". All mine wants to do is pee (but never in public), erect itself at the worst times, and attract my wife to it far more than me at any point. It did bring my son into the world so I can't go hating too much I guess. :)
well, I'm curious about everything now. There seems to be more options. I don't want to transition all the way for external reasons. I would like to be authentic, though even then there are things I want to consider. But I want to know all the options.
I don't like the idea of anyone deciding for me, I just want the facts. I appreciate those who have done just that.
i hate my penis, i ****in hate it. im almost appaled at you calling it your little "friend" but you sent me some stuff on yahoo for voice traing so realy i cant say much more then thank you...
anyways i was "Blessed" with a fiarly sizable one according to my jelous army buddies, even one of them getting pissed when he found out i was a transrabbit*whos siggy says that?*, and that i was just going to "waste" it.
oh well more depth for me and my male partners when i undergo SRS :daydreaming:. i hate it, its noticeable in tight jeans... i was THRILLED i could fit into size 3 jeans and they made my ass Look AWSOME but my damn "friend" totaly ruined the looks. i cant wait till the stupid thing is a vaginal canal/clitoris instead.
anyways story over, im wondering what the deal is with sex drive, and how it works after all that.
Let me explain something.... I used "little friend" as a euphamism because this forum is very puritanical in that sense.
i understand thatQuote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
but MEN call it there "little friend" and from the looks of it your not one anymore or would at this time not be one, i dunno maybe my perception is a little whacked from the :drink: ive been doing lately.
personally i dont care wtf HRT does to it as long as when i go into SRS, i come out with a fully functional vagina/clit, andd that finally feeling that im absolutely no longer male whatsoever.
excuse my hatered for men, but last time i checked it was fairly warrented, God only knows why the hell i wanna loose my virginity to one...
It's sounding like implants would cost me around $5k. That brings a serious question of whether I want to finally visit Egypt or get implants in the next year.
[SIZE=2]Answer = Thialand.......then you can do both...[/SIZE]
Seeing that it would be for a large part a religious pilgrimage, I doubt that would work. There's no Great Pyramid or Temple of Luxor in Thailand, and I can't time travel to ancient Egypt where they'd be accepting with modern technology to get the operation...... So it's a dillema.
I'm at a lose of how to describe it. If you've never been 'off' testosterone I don't think you can understand it and if you have I think you do. Any other girls here know how to descrie it any better than my 'lame' non-explanation?Quote:
Originally Posted by Byanca
What do you want more? It's merely a matter of priortizing. If the trip is more important to you then you take the trip.Quote:
It's sounding like implants would cost me around $5k. That brings a serious question of whether I want to finally visit Egypt or get implants in the next year.
That's one of the difficult things about life...having to make choices.
[SIZE=2]Like Pam mentioned, it boils down to what you want more....[/SIZE]Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
[SIZE=2]I mentioned Thailand because it's a little cheaper over there than here so you could possibly swing both now if you had the time & money..[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Over there it would cost approx. $3500. (for an reputable surgeon) plus airfare & accomidations...you'd have to stay there for approx. 4-6 days for post-op recovery..BTW, the resort hotels are very inexepensive....but RT air fare will run approx 1K+..[/SIZE]
When I went to Thailand in 09 airfare was $1100 hotel ran $29.00 a day and the implants $2500. Over here my doctor wanted just over $3500:2c:
I paid 5,000.00 in Thailand, but I got the super deluxe boobs, and along with them the envy of all of my g/f's , gg's and cder's.:rofl:
:o[SIZE=2] Yup, I can confirm that it's very True...They really are awesome....:tongueout[/SIZE]Quote:
Originally Posted by kellycan27
Try not to be caughtup in the hate this or that stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
Yes, authentic, is nice, I like my self and all my parts, with 3 kids, and a real A cups. BA is nice, you get what you want, right now, but not for me, Life is a balance, plan well, have some luck, you may get to where you want to be. I like the real softness of E also and i still take care of my wife. no T blocker here.
You seem to be doing your research well, keep going, research everything!
then go research the Doctors, some are one or the other sex only, watch out.
You may need more than one doctor.
find your place, be happy!
Linda Z
Veronica,
Almost 2 years, Es but no Spiro, on and off Pro. I had to stop the Pro because it enhances breast development too much and I'm nowhere near transitioning. Testicles have shrunk dramatically. Fewer spontaneous erections, but still get hard sometimes. Sex drive diminished but not gone. I still have a pretty gay mindset and like sex with guys.
But in the long run Es will ruin your penis, and girls like hard penises, so it would ruin your chances of marriage and a family. What if you did it for a year just to feminize your body? I think you would get too used to it to stop. I love my new breasts, but the emotional change has been the most marked. Even though most pop gender lit is way off the mark, hormones DO affect the brain. Quantifying that effect is of course problematic, but one thing I can say for sure is that I'm tearier easier than I was 2 years ago.
OH! And I finally told my doctor! Thank God, she hardly blinked, and asked me all the right questions and ordered all the right tests. I'm so glad that I did it.
Morgan Pure
yep...i know that story...:heehee:Quote:
Originally Posted by sue avalon
Hi Veronica,
If I may offer my none HRT and transsexual point of view....
If keeping your member intact and be able to have children in that capacity is a concern you have, then having side effects from HRT may do more non-physical things to you. I have been a Type 1 Diabetic for 16 years now and along with it, I have experienced sexual dysfunction at periods of time due to my diabetes. It doesn't help the fact that my testosterone levels seem to jump all over the map either but never into what is considered a range where I needed testosterone replacement. this is also more then likely a side effect of being diabetic which causes a lot of circulation problems. Why I mention this is because being someone who enjoys being a man, having issues down there has done much harm to my mind and confidence. At times it has been very difficult for me, wondering if I will have a full erection or if I can sustain a good one right before I am about to have sex. This usually compounds the issue making it more likely that I will have a problem, not to mention cause me to not enjoy myself because I am to worried if I am going to be able to perform at all. Sure things like Viagra work but for some, that can lead to bouts of depression as well since with some, they start to question their 'manhood' so to speak. Just something to think about if you truly still want to function as a man in that capacity as HRT will no doubt cause erectile dysfunction.
As far as breasts implants, speaking from the man side, my ex-wife had them done a few years back. What was important for her was the right Dr. She shopped around not for price, but rather quality and the Dr, she picked, told her that he would not give her anything that was 'too big'. He told her his personal policy was to create a natural looking breast package and thus hers look real. Nobody she knows or meets never suspects they are fake. Hers are also filled with a saleen solution I think and again being from the man side, they felt and moved close to real. She loves them.
Just a few things to think about :)
XO
Soriya
How about this.. You can have your cake and eat it too! :heehee:Attachment 110309
I thought it kinda cute. It's amazing what we can do with computers.
I think that may be a Halloween costume, not a photoshop work.
Here is how I see it from my perspective. If your sex drive goes down, along with your ability to get it up, it is like saying, how can you miss what you no longer want. I believe that at the same time you start to loose it, you will want it less. To some extent it might equal out. Now if you have those obligations someone mentioned, then someone else might miss it.
Gen
That's kind of the rub for those who are involved with another person.Quote:
Originally Posted by Genifer Teal
I have been on HRT for close to three years now, and though I no longer have erections, my sex drive is pretty high. I can achieve very satisfying sex, only now it is more of an emotional rather than physical thing. What makes it easier for me is that I don't have to perform the male part. I hope this isn't TMI for some of you, if so.. my apologies in advance.
Veronica,
See a doctor (Physiologist). Best would be one with trans gender experience. Then see another doctor (Endocrinologist). Tell them what you want to do. These days, the first will authorize the second to do something if they agree with you that your not out to do harm to yourself. As far as things working post HRT, its all been said before...it probably wont. I got lucky in that I started on the T blocker (kidney medication) before I started male puberty (I was a late bloomer thankfully) so I "grew up" but never really developed.
There is nothing wrong with wanting natural breasts and with fat distribution (if either happens) and your adams apple shaved, you will be able to present as a woman and for the most part will be what some consider a "non-Op" transsexual. Its your life. But for OUR sake as friends, see professionals to guide you to and through your decisions.
Jenn
I'm already in therapy, and the therapist will be replacing me with her supervisor when she leaves at the end of this month, so at that point it would be an actual doctor. My therapist does have some TG experience and is giving me to her supervisor because she would be the best suited for it. I have not, however, seen an endocrinologist. I don't know if I'm at that point yet.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
you might also see a doctor that is a specialist in sexual medicine, and then have he/she lead the others to support the direction you two decide to go.
:2c:
Linda