Telling your SO - another perspective

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Originally Posted by christinafrance

The only person I've ever told about who I really am is my current SO.
She has been and still is totally accepting so I'm a lucky girl .....ain't I?
What she has said which has made me think very deeply about many things related to my dressing, is that she finds my femme alter-ego, christina, a far nicer person to be with than my male everyday self.
I suspect this may have to do with the reality of having to hide my femme side from the world makes me a more frustrated and therefore angrier person to deal with.
Does telling alleviate the frustration, guilt and anger?...does dancing out of the closet trip the light fantastic in the brain and wave a magic wand to put all to rights?
I doubt it , but in my case, I love Jax more each and every day for accepting for who I truly am, for encouraging me to dress whenever I want,
( whether chilling in a sloppy Joe top and jeans or 5" heels, makeup, hair and heels tart)....did I do the right thing in telling her...?
"hell YES!"
But hey I'm not you and you ain't me....chacun a son gout.
One does what feels right....I just got lucky xx

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Welcome to the forum you VERY lucky girl!! La vie en rose!

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Originally Posted by Amy Fakley

I've witnessed (and been the recipient of) too may "tell tell tell" pile-ons on this forum. Telling is a double edged sword. It can be the best thing you ever did, or it can be the mistake that blows up your life for no good reason.

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It can be a double edged sword, but I have believed for many years, that it is the best overall solution...in the long term. Yes, it can cause blowing up...but it also can prevent future issues.

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To presume that some well meaning stranger on the internet can know enough about your life and circumstances to really tell you what the right thing to do is ... well ... it aint a good idea.

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I would disagree.... to a certain extent. The facets of this very topic have been discussed before, many many times, and for many many years. "This Thing of Ours of Varying Kinds" isn't something new that just popped out of nowhere. People have been writing about it for decades. In fact I read a book that discusses the various issues around "telling your SO" that was published in 1989. Note that was 27 years ago. Transfolk have been discussing "Our Thing" on the internet and the pre-internet computer networks like Compuserve, Quantumlink, The Sierra boards, Fidonet echoes, USENET, and whatnot since the mid 80's.

And there are "Patterns of Behavior" of "This Thing of Ours of Varying Kinds". In fact, you could define members here by various archetypes which have long existed on online forums (both pre and post internet) and in physical real world support groups.

As I have said on other occasions: There is very little here that hasn't been discussed before...telling the SO...telling the kids....finding support groups.....whatever. Its been done. And through these discussions we know what solutions have the highest probability of positive outcomes, and can recommend them.

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On balance the highs well outweigh the lows, and in a lot of ways it was the best thing I ever did. But on the other hand, it has complicated my life in ways that are pretty tough to deal with and sometimes it feels like a living hell ... still, living in the closet was also living in a different sort of hell.
By the time I told, I was darn sure that regardless of the outcome, this was the only decision I could live with.

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Which was to be expected, we have seen it all before, and it is why I do recommend telling sooner rather than later as the best overall long term solution with the highest probability of positive future outcomes even with the complications it can bring.

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Originally Posted by Leslie Langford

But there are also two other issues related to this subject that I haven't seen adequately addressed here yet, namely:

(1) The age bracket (demographics) of the couples involved and the cultural/historical context surrounding the initial reveal;

I and others in my age bracket can only envy the younger gurls here who - along with their spouses and/or SO's - came of age in more enlightened, internet-enabled, and LGBT-friendly times where rigid gender roles were becoming increasingly blurry. At least you have a fighting chance that your better halves will not be as totally grossed out by a crossdressing partner as the women of our generation tend to be, even if other aspects of a planned reveal are still fraught with a degree of uncertainty as to the ultimate outcome.

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I'm glad you brought that up. It's why I believe that many of the issues we "currently" see here will become less common in the future. There's just so much information out there now.

For example I was born in 1967 and my dad (born in 1927) said to me when I was in my early 20's I think that he believed that gay and transgendered folk were born that way, it was just common sense. And that they shouldn't be mistreated. I wished he had told me that earlier when I was young...I might have come out to my family sooner. I didn't come out to my family as transgender till I was 26. (and that was more due to my own lack of self acceptance and not trusting my family's love) And when I did tell him, his response was a matter of fact: "So that's why you've been growing your hair."

So even compared to folks like you, my experiences were somewhat better. Heck by the time I was in my 20's, check out clerks became more "matter of fact" when I bought "girl stuff". And by the time I was in my 30's. things were even better...though still not perfect.

Like you, I have a lot of hope for the future.

Veronica

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Originally Posted by sometimes_miss

But again, it came down to telling all about it, or hoping for some semblence of a normal life. It's pretty clear that there are not a whole lot of women out there hoping to find a crossdresser for a husband.


The problem is that our gut can be just as stuck in the pink fog as the rest of us. I, too, was so sure that everything would work out fine, that the crossdressing was way overcome by all the good things that I was. But I couldn't have been more wrong. So much for a gut feeling.

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However, as a young person, you know nothing about how life or where it will go. Consider 50% of all marriages end in divorce. You, as a younger person, of course feel this is forever, and yet, it isn't. So in reality, you lose some of your life trying to save something that isn't salvageable. Being a crossdresser and hiding it, basically wastes your partner's life too as they think the marriage is something it isn't (really no different than having an affair, you hide something you KNOW your partner may not approve of and you in essence acre making a decision for them instead of letting them make their own. Manipulative and arrogant IMO). So now, after let's say 20 years, they find out. You have wasted that many years of their lives and that many years of yours when they could have been happier with the info in either case. You know you can't get those years back. Life is short too. No one knows when you will eave. So why be miserable? Why, when you suspect they wouldn't like it, would you risk making them miserable and angry when they find out? I know we are self centered. But the hurt of losing trust and faith is a lot worse and lasts a lot longer than having someone come out and tell you the truth early

"So now, after let's say 20 years, they find out. You have wasted that many years of their lives and that many years of yours when they could have been happier with the info in either case."

If those previous 20 years were happy and prosperous as a couple and family, they were definitely not wasted, unless the secret keeper may have been living an uncomfortable life with that secret. I agree about that 50% divorce number in the USA. 20 years can be considered a long term marriage now a days, so that, in general, it must have been good and livable for a large part of that time.

If the truth came out after marriage and the other half could not tolerate it and the marriage failed, would that now free unhappy partner necessarily go right out and find a better partner and be really able to live a better and happier life during those remaining years up to the 20 years in the original case? I think this "set them free" concept is OK, but being free does not necessarily mean better off and happier. It could turn out worse, much worse. Some SO's have stated here that they would have preferred not to know and to go on with that workable good life they had before knowing. How does that figure in here?

Your opinion is that it is manipulative and arrogant. You leave out caring and trying to make the best decision based on what that person knew before and during keeping the secret. Yes, in today's world with so much more news on the trans people, it is improving and getting easier to tell with maybe better chances of staying together after the big reveal. But before, it was definitely different and less successful. I agree that it is better to tell. But based on the OP, the decision is up to the individual, who truly does understand their own situation better than third party others. And, even if we think that we as an individual are pretty knowledgeable about what we see, hear and feel about our own relationship, we never truly know for sure, as can be seen in many of the threads here about the ballistic reactions when the SO found out. Ballistic reactions that here on this site seemed to be accepted and justified by many, which they should not be. If the secret keeper has to tell, then the offended recipient has to act as a mature adult and listen, question, seek out more information, and get third party support if necessary before making the decision to separate.

If there are issues in the relationship caused by the trans side being kept a secret, then I also agree that there is a very strong need to come out to avoid the unnecessary suffering on the secret keeper and those loved ones around them.

So, the recommendations are to tell before entering a long term relationship and to try to tell during one. But that decision can only be made by that person keeping that secret, and prior to that decision they should seriously consider and weigh the true possibility of a worst case scenario after they tell as it may affect them personally, their family, friends and income producing work.

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Originally Posted by Lorileah

So in reality, you lose some of your life trying to save something that isn't salvageable. Being a crossdresser and hiding it, basically wastes your partner's life too as they think the marriage is something it isn't (really no different than having an affair, you hide something you KNOW your partner may not approve of and you in essence acre making a decision for them instead of letting them make their own. Manipulative and arrogant IMO). So now, after let's say 20 years, they find out. You have wasted that many years of their lives and that many years of yours when they could have been happier with the info in either case. You know you can't get those years back. Life is short too. No one knows when you will eave. So why be miserable? Why, when you suspect they wouldn't like it, would you risk making them miserable and angry when they find out? I know we are self centered. But the hurt of losing trust and faith is a lot worse and lasts a lot longer than having someone come out and tell you the truth early

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I am not arguing against telling, nor arguing any of your post here. I am basically a believer in telling, now. I was a secret holder of this as is or was many on this site. For me, holding the secret was not done due to arrogance and manipulation. It was done because I was fighting myself to be normal. Why tell someone something they are likely not going to like, if you think you have a chance to beat it, and be normal. I did try to beat it. It was a secret I was planning on taking to my grave. I was planning on continuing to not act on my feelings and desires, for the most part. Yes, I had dressed on about a total of 10-12 occasions prior to telling my wife. And half of those were in the last couple of years before telling, before accepting myself. It was when I realized this really is who I am, and the desires and feelings could not be beaten, purged, cured what have you. I felt more and more a sense of guilt, and that an eventuality it would be discovered. I was also getting tired of the enormous restrictions faced by the secret. I have now come to realize that I am more than just a thrill seeking type of dresser, for sexual reasons or just some escape. I am transgender. A real part of me is gender variant.

For many, where they are on the spectrum is not always so much of their inner core. It is something they could live without. Frustrating at times perhaps, but it is a minor part of their lives. So, for these people, the auto tell answer is not one I would give. Although I never think telling is a wrong choice. If a marriage has been solid and life overall is good, the gender variance is minor.... Is telling really something that would be of benefit? I am not convinced that for every single person it would be. Even Helen Boyd thinks in some cases, it might be better for some wives to not know. Of course, it is for those who are not feeling the need to make any real alterations to their lives.

I do agree though, that in many ways, there is an arrogance and manipulation to our secret keeping. I rarely have long talks about gender with my wife these days, but we have definitely had some. And she too like most wives, feel cheated from making a choice based on full knowledge of the person she was choosing to marry. That emotion for my wife is as strong if not stronger than the discomfort of my gender variance. And, most likely, had our relationship grown with that knowledge, the discomfort would be less than what it is now. Maybe not completely gone, but I am convinced it would be less than what it is because that is who she chose. In reality, for most who are in the situations that end up in the big elephant in the room, the DADT arrangements, those would have been mostly avoided by an early disclosure, not one that was made years if not decades after commitment. There are of course marriages that withstand the later reveal, and some that even end up ok through transition. Others too that start off ok with the knowledge, but later on it goes south for whatever reasons.

When we hear from people like Sometimes Miss, we need to remember that there are many out there who have not had lady luck shine down on them in the way of acceptance. There are still more people who do not agree with gender variant anything. More women than not who will say thanks but no thanks. Some are even quite vile about it all. Overall, acceptance of gender variance is improving, but the needle is still quite a bit into the non accepting zone still. My marriage has survived up to this point, but it has been somewhat strained. The area in which I live, is a hole in the earth when it comes to acceptance of gender variance and sexual orientation. The north east may be overall a more liberal accepting area, but there are little black holes where it all disappears into some other wherever area. I have traveled enough in my life to see that not all areas are as accepting or non accepting as other areas. Living within an area that is high on the non accepting does make the decision to tell harder. It should still be done yes, but sooo many people we who live in these areas know who are quite typically proud of their lack of accepting and variance of any kind.

I have related my experience here several times but it's been awhile.

I was in a relationship for 15 years. Great woman, we got along better than most people I know. She died suddenly. (she knew about my dressing, she loved it, I let her know before the first date...OK so my dressing or being TG wasn't an issue). Sounds awesome huh? A woman who likes doing whayt you do, who accepts you as you are, who is your best friend. Then you lose that.

Here's the kicker: She kept HUGE secrets from me for 15 years. Things that I thought we had discussed. I asked early why she had never been married (she claimed she never had). She said the right person never came along. When she died I found out she had been married TWICE. My bad assumption was she never had children...My bad but if she wasn't married...:thinking: Guess what she had TWO children. Now to make things even worse she gave up the first child when the second husband told her he would not have another man's child in the house. There is a lot more to that story which involved abuse and control). This was not the woman I knew.

How does this relate. She didn't think it was important for me to know this stuff. That it would somehow ruin what we had together. That I would treat her differently. That I would not want to see her again. I can say, in my heart none of that was true. But she didn't give me a chance to show that. Yes it still hurts. It violated TRUST. Of course the knowledge would have changed some dynamics (like not having her sneak around to talk to her daughter. Like not seeing her daughter and grandchild because she didn't want me to find out...I can't imagine how much this hurt HER). So let's relate this to marriage. OK, you don't think it's important to tell when you get married. You think it will go away. You're ashamed of dressing, you're ashamed of the feelings you get from it. I get that. And if you can put it away for 20 years and your kids grow and you have a nice life, yay!. Until that day you get it out again. Then you start sneaking and you lie and go places where you shouldn't (experience speaking, trust me). Now your wife finds out....not from you but from a piece of clothing...or a video....or your browser...or that neighbor who hangs at the Drag Bar. She finds out. Now she wonders what else you didn't tell her. Are you having unsafe sex with someone? And you had sex with her last week...OMG maybe she has "something" now. Or she wonders, what else you keep from her. Drinking? Smoking? Illicit drugs? Two wives in another state who have children who will come to your door and ask for their fair share? She confronts you, you deny (most here will). She now has taht in her mind and you say "Honey, I have a business trip in May" She thinks "Does he?" She can't sleep, she gets angry with you, she withholds "affection" (read 10% of the threads here). So you start blaming her....and the cycle starts. Trust is GONE. It's easy to build trust in the beginning. It is REAL hard to get it back when you destroy it. Yeah, you were happy for thoise years (it was based on incomplete information). And it is REAL hard to get a new relationship like you had when you are 50.

And here's MY feelings and point. She didn't TRUST me enough to be honest. She assumed (as you all do) that I was too immature, stupid, naive, macho (choose one or all) and that she would lose me. But she didn't GIVE me the chance to decide. She made up my mind for me. You really want a woman to not like you? Treat her like she can't think and reason on her own. Even if you do stay together, she will never trust you again. It hurts. It hurts worse than losing someone to natural death because with that you can vent your anger at the universe. 5 years later, it still hurts. It hurts because she didn't let me into her life and let me show how much I loved her. Luckily I am in contact with her daughter now. At least I have that.

So now, go ahead and say that "gee it was fun as long as she didn't know" but you'll never know how much and how deep you hurt her by not letting her make up her own mind. I would hold a grudge against most people here too if you treated me like my opinion as your spouse didn't matter in our marriage

I am hesitant to say how I feel but I want to be part of this community!
My wife knew I dressed up in my teens with friends and thought nothing of it. A few friends told her I liked to dress up and she just laughed.

Well I get married and have kids and between work and taking care of the kids there's no time to cross-dress and children are so much fun, who thinks about cross-dressing?

Then twenty years later the children have grown, moved out or off to school.

Well now I have some alone time I remember how much fun cross-dressing is.

So I start again, I try to tell the wife but, she freaks out so I back off.

If she was curious or asked any questions I would have answered them, she said "don't tell anybody about the dressing up"

Since I don't have a desire to go out dressed and I'm content with a few hours now and then, then why should I push the issue?

Why do women get so freaked out? It's just for FUN! Right?

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Originally Posted by ReineD

All types of issues, problems, and differences of opinion crop up during the course of any marriage and it seems to me that each partner deserves to be respected enough to be heard if the issue is important to the partner. This doesn’t mean that the other partner will automatically agree or be involved in something against their will, but if a dissenting partner knows that something is troubling or important to the other partner, to just say "I don’t want to hear about it or talk about it" seems rather one-sided.

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Yes it does seem unfair Reine but my wife doesn't want to hear about it or talk about it, and add "nor see any sign of it". For the first 6 months after my initial reveal and her threat of suicide, it did hurt and it did feel that my wife didn't love me unconditionally.

Now 4 years on, I realise that it was the best outcome that I could have achieved from someone who grew up in the Mad Men era (I liked that reference). It is how she copes with a TG husband. Sure my life is complex and compartmentalised but we have a great DADT solution. I have a terrific femme life based out of a storage facility. Sometimes I yearn to change in the comfort of my own home (it is winter now) and I wish my best friend from my male life was a part of my femme life. But I don't have to choose between my wife and dressing. It may seem unfair to those outside the relationship, but we do what we need to cope.

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Originally Posted by ReineD

Still, would you be happy dressing fully to go out when circumstances permit without having told her, wondering how she would react should she find out by mistake ....

Also, how would you feel if your need to crossdress was more advanced than it is now and you actually needed to dress a few times or more per week. Would you be able to not tell. Would you be happy with telling your wife you were working (several times per week … not once in a blue moon), if you were instead sneaking out to go shopping, dine in restaurants, seeing shows, spending time with your CD friends, going to clubs or support groups, etc. Would you be able to construct fake business trips in order to attend TG conventions. How would you hide shaved legs, trimmed eyebrows, a growing wardrobe, makeup, jewelry, etc. How would you hide all these purchases from your shared finances.

The people who do end up telling their wives, do so because it bothers them to keep this a complete secret and because it becomes necessary to tell.

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Our arrangement is DADT therefore I don't tell her that I'm out femme 4 or 5 days a week. In fact Michelle is now a part time working girl. The signs are pretty obvious though (eyebrows, legs, wardrobe ...) but she chooses not to notice. The fact that she knows that I dress but doesn't want to know the specifics, makes me very comfortable in our arrangement and unconditionally in love.

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Originally Posted by Judy-Somthing

Why do women get so freaked out? It's just for FUN! Right?

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Is it? Put yourself in her position. You know the questions she will ask. If it were reversed, would you think "it's just for fun?" Or would you worry you are losing your best friend maybe to another person or physically.

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Originally Posted by Michelle (Oz)

Our arrangement is DADT therefore I don't tell her that I'm out femme 4 or 5 days a week. In fact Michelle is now a part time working girl. The signs are pretty obvious though (eyebrows, legs, wardrobe ...) but she chooses not to notice.

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But, she does know, even if it isn't talked about. This is vastly different than if you actually lied and said you were out teaching a class, or volunteering, or working, or whatever. So should something ever happen and you found yourself in an emergency room, your wife would not feel as if she was in the Twilight Zone.

I believe it's like a roll of a dice, it could go either way. Women change with a flick of an eye, what's good today isn't good tomorrow. I told my wife early in our marriage because I wasn't going to spent the rest of my life as a fugitive. That was thirty years ago and my wife tells me now that when I told her she did try to keep an opened mind and wanted to see to see where I was going with it. When she seen it was pretty harmless and there were worse things in life I could be doing she was ok with it. I guess my wife gave it a chance and some women don't even want to know about it. Before joining here I just thought that every women would be OK with it, and it was so surprising when I started reading about people divorcing and fights over it. Don't get me wrong it wasn't always roses, but if a relationship has good communication and both parties care about the other persons needs it could be a win win situation. Hope it all works out and keep us updated