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I go out and try to present as a reasonably attired GG would appear and hope no one makes it a problem. I agree that few can truly "Pass". I am to blend but looking back on how i presented myself several years ago, I could have been that cd. Tolerance for all should be our goal. Not just tolerance to those it is easy to be tolerant of. Still a goal of mine I haven't fully reached!
Simple for me really. Yes, if you want to go out because this is what you prefer wearing for whatever reason, then there is no reason why you should not go out in what you feel most comfortable in... The only reason why you may not want to is society's intolerance (yep that old chestnut again!). But its a numbers game - if more than the average person crossdressed then it would not be a problem and you would see most people doing so. Hmm, but then, it would no longer be considered crossdressing :)) Damn, gets complicated! Anyway, for me if I saw a MTF or a FTM who did not pass who was out and about, I would be surprised and of course I would notice, simply because I do not see many crossdressers or TG etc out in public. But would it offend me, worry me about rep, make me angry? Absolutely not. I do not expect people to tell me what I can and can't wear, I would be hypocrite if I did the same...
J
What a great post, thank you!! :)Quote:
Originally Posted by linda allen
I think it's important to remember the OP said the person she saw was dressed inappropriately. Even if her face does look masculine, she won't stand out so much if she dresses for the occasion. Night club wear belongs in night clubs, just as bathing suits belong at the beach. lol
It can take time for some CDers to learn to discriminate between what is appropriate clothing for some occasions, but not others.
Thanks for all of the replies to this post, I did not expect such a response. I have read and taken in your comments and have learned from them that I should not have been ashamed. I do however, still feel that if you do anything in this life, then it should be your best effort and show respect for others.
Christine
I'm 19 and i don't do look like a woman... i'm more like what some of you would call a guy in girls clothes... but i look good doing it and i rock my heels and think that if you look good and can do it without looking like a fool then go for it! i'm not sure if i ever wanna get a wig & do full make up.... unless i know that i will look amazing i'm not even gonna go for it
DING DING DING - We have a winner!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by linda allen
Exactly.Quote:
Originally Posted by Christine1954
Glasses - tame wig - boring clothes - and if you can go out in cold weather, a jacket, hat and glove LINERS ( give illusion of a small hand in a big glove, rather than a big glove over a big hand ) ... nobody will even notice you. As you get better at being unnoticed, you can get more appealing with clothes.
I don't think I pass at all even when wearing a wig, makeup etc. My last two days out I have not worn a wig or a make up but otherwise dressed and have spent time out on the beach or round the shops. I have not had any bad comment made. Yesterday while shopping for clothes I got chatting to the young SA we had a long chat about clothes and she said that you should wear what you are comfortable with. She saw nothing wrong with men in skirts but she admitted that she hardly ever wears skirts because of her pale legs. I suggested that she wear tights in a skintone, I told her I was wearing skintone tights(she thought I was bare legged) and she said she would try a similar shade next time she wore a skirt/dress.
Well, why limit public appearance standards to just crossdressers? From now on, fat and ugly men and women (and their kids too) are forbidden to go out in public.
Just one question: who sets the standards?
OMG I went out last night! Did anyone see me? Did I pass?
I do the same and other than some odd looks nobody has ever said anything.Billie JeanQuote:
Originally Posted by sissystephanie
I am 31 years old, dress appropriately for my age, but for the most part, never wear makeup or a wig when i go out. I dress to the nines from the neck down, but neck up, i am clearly guy. I do this for several reasons: 1) while I adore presenting a completely female appearance, i can satisfy my desire by dressing completely, without the chore of putting on makeup. 2) I am always clean shaven, head to toe. 3) and probably the highest on the list, I absolutely love the blurring of gender lines and confusion in seeing a very feminine shape and demeanor, crowned with the head of a man. It strikes up plenty of conversation and I have never once felt threatened or unsafe. I go to malls, do my grocery shopping and run errands this way. It also makes it easier to transform quickly after work, for a quick fix!
If others are standing still & you move beyond their location, you passed.
As an example of life's variety, the star of "Throw Momma from the Train" is a woman.
Here is my take. We all start somewhere and not all are stuck in the closet. For me I went out in skinny jeans and a shirt the first time. I still to this day do not wear a wig because it makes me feel fake. I am me and present as me. If that is wrong them oh well. I enjoy wearing nice fitting clothes and styles that are feminine n natural but do not wish to transition.Quote:
Originally Posted by Christine1954
I think whatever you look like you should be out in public after all we are all human. Of course there is such a thing as common sense. If ya wear a tutu and fairy wings to the mall you will get stared out. If you dress like a hooker whether you are a GG or transgender you will get stared at. Heck none of us can control what people think or even say. I just think as cd's we need to be prepared for peoples reactions good bad or indifferent. Wear whatever you want to wear, if ya want to go out it is your right! Of course people also have the right to stare!
Well, I just don't have the time slot or the facility to do a complete make-over. I generally will entertain myself with androgynous dressing and include giant boobs and stacked heels. I don't purposely get in anyones face but I do go about my business. Really, practically no one notices.
http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...1&d=1301018103
I like to encourage anyone who wishes, to go out and enjoy themselves no matter how they look. Yes, the person's appearance may not be where they want to be eventually, but if you never more forward, then you never achieve your goal.
I went out yesterday and passed. But everyone still looked at me with disgust. So I bought some GasX and I will try again.
My best friend could be that guy,she is in her 60s but dresses like a teenager,mini skirt,high heel boots,crop tops,the lot.She loves being a Crossdresser and lives her life to the fullest when she is out (which happens rarely these days),I wouldnt try and change her,she wouldn't be the same bubbly,fun loving person I became Pals with.Sure we get looks when I walk down the street with her,and a lot (even some other CDers dissaprove of her) think her odd but maybe everyone should deal with themselves without trying to foist there opinions on others,we dont all fit the ideals
Sophie
Everyone has to start somewhere. Are you asking if you should go out? Or are you asking if the person you saw should have gone out? Just do your best to look decent and go with that. I guess if you have some fashionistas to hang around with you have an advantage.
Go out however you want to go out, I do.
If you decide to dress like a female member of the band KISS but with a full beard and a neon codpiece, I may choose to cross over to the other side of the street and watch the show rather than be in it. And if am in the same room as you and you don't think my marginally passible soccer mom outfit is appropriate for the occasion, you can wander off and find the incredibly beautiful CD and hang with her.
In either event I can accept the choices others make and hope they can accept mine.
I see a lot of GGs that don't pass as female out in public all the time.
With the obesity of women and the dress down culture, many GGs do not make attractive women. While I don't pass very well, with a good makeup job, I could pass. I'm 5'9"", 150 lbs, size 10 to 12 bottoms, and 12 to 14 tops. I'm well within the acceptable GG size ranges. I think GGs do us CDs a big favor by not looking very well. It means that I don't stand out as much in a group.
My wife tells me that with full makeup on I have a chance. But then again, she says, Take a look around. There is some pretty damn ugly women. Hmmmm.
I know beyond any doubt that I'm not going to pass for female any closer than 30 yards. Any lingering doubt a blind person may have would be quickly eliminated when I open my mouth.
That said, I do try to put myself together well, most times... so at least someone might think, "hey, there's a cute transvestite." :battingeyelashes:
the SO and i were talking the other day and the subject came up and i asked her to please critique me on how xandria dresses, i asked her to please stop me from going out in public if i look re-donkulous.
the thing for me is this. I will never be "passable" i have such a deep voice and my body's frame is very wide in the shoulders and narrow hips so i know i'll get read right off the bat.. unless you look at me from behind.. HA! anyways because of my situation i like to get creative with makeup and what i wear
so i found this cute outfit.. you tell me.. would you go out in public wearing this?
http://i1208.photobucket.com/albums/...-03at17061.jpg
Someday I may attempt to pass as a female. It’s been a few decades since I really tried, and I was too young and too scared to do it often.Quote:
Originally Posted by Christine1954
I so enjoy wearing women’s clothing, feeling a soft nylon slip against my shaved, pantyhosed legs, that I’ve decided to give in and do the “guy in a skirt” thing. Even if I shaved and put on a wig and made myself up I know I would not look like a woman. I can appreciate the concerns of some of you here about crossdressers who don’t pass and who look freakish. I try to look good and not outlandish, even choosing skirts with a kiltish look and foregoing heels and other things I like to wear. It’s a look which I think I’m getting to work and I think it’s better than failing to look like something I’m not.
If I had your figure I would definitely go out, you look fantastic in that outfit.Quote:
Originally Posted by Xandria
Christine.
I have not dressed to "pass" in over a decade. I wear articles of women's clothing becauce I like them or they are comfortable. I try to look nice, and often look better than others I see. Admittedly, my styles is mostly androgynous (flats w/jeans, etc.). It only matters that you are comfortable with yourself. I also feel that by being a bit obvious I may give others who see me encouragement to be more bold. I have not had a bad experience yet.
Like most of us, I would not pass as a female in public. However, that doesn't stop me from wearing fem jeans, shorts, tops and some eye makeup/light lipstick along with shaved legs and painted toe nails......:battingeyelashes:
I never pass, but often go out. Tonight it was a little cool, so I wore a turtleneck with a necklace on the outside, knee-length pencil skirt & pantyhose, leather ballet flats, canvas purse. And handlebar mustache. I got a few odd looks, didn't pay much attention. Sat on the terrace at the restaurant, shaded by vines, watched a DVD on my MacBook, and enjoyed dinner. Age-appropriate fashion, something any respectable woman my age might wear. Except for the handlebar.
Just out of curiosity, Lainie, why do you keep the mustache? :hugs:
At the risk of saying something politically incorrect and perhaps offending some people - and considering how high some of us have set this mythical "passing" bar - how "passable" based on those standards were GG's like Julia Child, Janet Reno, Golda Meir, Margaret Thatcher, Susan Boyle, and Bea Arthur, among others?
I really wish society was more accepting of gender mixing. In a perfect world, men could wear dresses and not care how passable they were (and wear mustaches with it, too). They'd only worry about passing if they personally wanted to.
Do you think it's likely that as transgendered people get more rights, that crossdressers will too? Rights for crossdressers seem to lag behind - ie work codes are modified for transgendered but not for crossdressers. I'm well aware of why this has taken place, but I'd still like to society move more towards general acceptance.
Yes - my thoughts exactly. The moment I stopped worrying about what anyone else (other than my wife) thought was the moment I entered a very happy place. I know I don't "pass" but I also know that I feel very fulfilled whilst hitting the busy shopping mall for a few hours. I try to blend in as much as I can, and smile a lot. I get a lot of smiles back, and a few :eek: as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sara Jessica
Tash :)
So much of the stress I now associate with cross dressing (I was never stressed before) centers on whether or not I could potentially pass in public. I'm still not sure whether I could or not, but I figure I should stop worrying so much about it. I'll never know until I try. My BDD issues will not allow me to ascertain whether I could or not until I actually try, to be honest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leslie Langford
Um... I think that's just proof that the reptilians can pass for human... sorta. :devil:
Like many others here, I will probably never pass fully. However, I do think that we should carry ourselves in a certain way. Sometimes some cd's may go out and give a bad name to others. I understand you're living out your fantasy, but some of us are simply trying to be accepted to do the thing we love, dress. We all started dressing behind closed doors. I know i dressed behind closed door for years, before I ventured out, and I must say it was amazing. However, I carried myself as a respectable female. I try to dress in age and size appropiate outfits. I understand to each their own but we must think about ourselves as a group. Lets not spoil it for the next girl that wants to venture out...:)
Dack, when you see that laws are for transgendered, that includes crossdressers as they fall under the transgendered umbrella. So when you see cities passing anti-discrimination laws against TGs than CDs are covered too.Quote:
Originally Posted by dack
The person that the op is describing is my Hero.......
Love, Ericka
eeerrrrrrrrrrrrrr no. I look like a 6 foot pitbull in a dress - i'd love to go out and blend in but i'd end up being smacked - i just couldn't explain that one away.
However, if you feel you could blend in then i guess go for it.
Christine, try passing as yourself. It works for me. Don't worry so much about being read and enjoy being who you are. Passing is such an overrated concept.Quote:
Originally Posted by Christine1954
I know it's hard not to make fun about other crossdresser who you see that aren't quite getting it right yet. Look at it this way: It takes a lot of courage to walk out in public like that. So give the lady some credit for that. High heels take a while to learn. It's like walking a tight rope. It takes a lot of practice to master. Not everybody can do it. Ask any young lady who just started wearing high heels. They know.
My sentiments exactly, thank you for putting them so eloquently.Quote:
Originally Posted by Farrah
Christine
I know I can never pass for a woman. I'm six foot and two hundred pounds. The best I can do is to take a walk at night or go for a drive. I dress tastefully for my age. I love dresses and heels, although I recently purchased a pair of flats for walking on concrete. Those shoes with the narrow heels make a lot of noise in the evening. I do not want to attract any attention. When I was a lot younger and many pounds lighter I ventured out on several Halloweens. I bought something in a Safeway which drew cat calls from an obnoxious male. On another Halloween I went into a doughnut shop and received a nice compliment from the female cashier. Even though my city and state have favorable laws for cross dressers, there is no guarantee to safety with adolescent males and other idiots. Also, I do not want to embarrass my wife and family if a neighbor recognizes me in or out of my car. Someday I hope to get up the 'balls' to hide them and attend a gathering of cross-dressers. Someday!!!
For those of you that feel you can mingle freely without any recriminations from those around you, my bonnet is off to you!
Geeee, that's a lot of answers. I am focusing more on the original question and what's behind Christine's thought. I very much tend to emphasize passability in order to gain respect, I believe that my own rendition of what shall be deemed appropriate stands from insecurities and shame.
It is rather obvious, when passable, need to face ridicule and laughter is diminished to mere spec of dust and thus fulfill the objective of being dressed as a woman to be one accepted by society at large, not because they are ok with transgenderism, but because they see her as genetic woman.
The conclusion, I feel, brings on another set of questions. This appropriateness of image will be seen differently by different groups of transgender people. I for once want to envelope my entire being in femininity so I can see a true image of a woman I believe to be my entire life. For me passability is of utmost importance and brings on fulfillment curing dysphoric nature of my transgenderism.
I can only imagine that for simple crossdresser, who doesn't yet realize deeper disconnect between body and mind such transformation doesn't seem like the only viable option and near passability is ok. Then there are some others who feel the right to express their inner fem through what ever means possible even they do not pass at all, and kudos to those girls because it takes tremendous guts to do such.
Is it right then to be you, well, if it doesn't cause an accident or a new born baby to cry, or gods wrath upon my region of earth =)..................WHY NOT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
As I understand it, laws do get passed protecting transgendered in the workplace. These do not equally apply to crossdressers. If this were the case, I could move to another state then wear a skirt to work without declaring myself transgendered.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sue
If you know of locations for which this is not the case, I'd be really interested to know about them, though.
I have seen some GG in my time that would be better suited to dress as a male than the female that they were born as.
I know I would make a better looking female than some that I have seen at the very least I try to dress fashionable.
I used to have time to go out somewhat or I should say I made time to go shopping at the local Lane Bryant store on two occasions last year and hope to make it there in the next couple of weeks.
Yes its good to experience going out even though you dont pass, the experience is worth it as it makes you realize what you really want out of CDing.
As an addendum to my previous post, let me add talk show hostess Wendy Williams to my list, and don't tell me that she doesn't at least look like a crossdresser if not an actual "she-male".Quote:
Originally Posted by Leslie Langford
She is tall, hefty ("pneumatic"), has had numerous plastic surgeries, sports melon-sized implants, and has often been compared to transsexual performer Amanda Lepore. The behind-the-scenes look at her dressing room and her routine preparations for her show appear more like an M-T-F "Glamazon" transformation session than a regular make up session:
http://www.popeater.com/2011/01/13/w...ni-body-video/
And you tall, muscular "gurls" worry about not passing??? Wendy "owns" it - so should you. :eek::heehee::thumbsup:
All places. What I am saying is that being a crossdresser is being transgendered by definition. So if there is a law that covers transgendered, then you are covered.Quote:
Originally Posted by dack
Hah!!! There's hope for me yet. On my own personal standards, I do not pass, therefore I do not go out in public.Quote:
Originally Posted by Leslie Langford
Sometimes it's more than justabout the clothing. I Think that if a person has the courage to go out dressed then that is alright by me. Yes, sometimes some of us
are not at our best, well there are some ggs that arn't always at thier best either. So I don't judge and like i said already, if a person is alrigh with themselves enough to go out, then it's ok.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leslie Langford
Can we add Ann Coulter to the list? :D