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Hi, I can't believe all the negative comments you got over this. Everyone should be able to dress the way they want and not be judged. Whatever makes you feel comfortable should be good. I prefer to dress from head to toe as a women,others just the under garments, who cares live and let live. I was actually thinking of changing my look for going out as something more androgonous, let them guess my gender or not. Hugs Jaymee
Among my vices is an addiction to advice columns. Recently, I read a letter from a woman whose (adult) son was living together with his girlfriend. She Does Not Approve of unmarried people living together, and wanted to know how to make her disapproval clear, e.g., by excluding the girlfriend from family events and such.
The columnist basically said, all that you will accomplish is to alienate both your son and his girlfriend. No doubt, they already know your views. What is more important to you: your Disapproval, or your son (and a woman who might become your daughter-in-law)?
I think there's a lesson here for you orthodox CDers who feel the need to keep your Disapproval of us non-passers front and center. You will have no effect on how we dress and present. What you may succeed in doing is alienating us from TG and orthodox CDing communities. And in spreading a generally negative impression of CDers in general.
So: what is more important to you?
We live in a world of intolerance, disapproval, and prejudice, so this site really isn't to different from the everybody else is it? As someone has said to me and I have said the same, " if you want a friend, then show yourself friendly". Lets take this one step farther, if you want love and acceptance, then be loving and accepting.
Quote: The columnist basically said, all that you will accomplish is to alienate both your son and his girlfriend. No doubt, they already know your views. What is more important to you: your Disapproval, or your son (and a woman who might become your daughter-in-law)?
The really scary part of this is that I know of an almost same story. A friends wife was not accepting of her sons girlfriend and it was obvious to all. Well guess what, this woman never sees her son, his wife, or their children, but maybe once a year, so who is the loser? Obvious answer, everyone is! I do my best to not judge others because I don't know what they are thinking, or what is motivating them. In not judging, it is my hope that others will not judge me.
So the next time you get dressed up, think about what you are thinking about, and about what your motives are. Then remind yourself of how you want to be accepted, knowing that you are different, then accept others who are different from you, in the same way.
Whooo! Didn't expect such controversy!
For the record, I welcome all comments, but PLEASE! keep them polite.
I didn't aim this post at those who want to pass, or try to do their best to pass, you're after something else, that's clear, and more power to you. I don't think it's what I'm after. I started out from the fetish side of things, and the idea of wearing female attire, and the feel, still have an effect on me. Having said that, the ability to show of my legs, ( stockings and thigh highs do that for me ) the coolness and freshness of a skirt, the way the clothes move on my body, that is what appeals most. I like to display, the conventional method of male display is fun too, but the formal version, shirt and tie, nice overcaot etc, which I used 2 nights ago, while fun, is a little restrictive. I got compliments which was nice, but at least some of those were about the slightly "delicate" cashmere scarf that my GF loaned me. At that same party, 2 of the guys were wearing kilts, down one from last year ( he left the company, and his was a utility kilt, not the tartan of the other 2 )
My situation is somewhat different to that which many of you would find yourself in, I work retail, but it is a very liberal company, and it's almost a certainty that a kilt would be allowed, it certainly wouldn't get many objections, if any, from co-workers. I feel fairly certain, that I would get permision to wear a suitable skirt as well. Something like that picture I posted would go down well, I think. It will generate some comments from customers, and while out and about, a kilt will certainly be noticed and commented on, a skirt would get more, depending on presentation. That's where my uncertainty comes in, I'm getting more confident in myself as I age, but I'm still a somewhat reticent and introverted kind of personality, plus, I want to develop my own look, one that works, and that I can be happy with. What i was interested in at the start of this post was the various reactions you get from this kind of dressing, and thank you to those who replied with details. Every situation and location is different of course, but my own locale is probably more flexible in that regard than most.
Once again thanks for your comments, particularly guys who do present this way, and please keep further comments polite. We might not agree, and that's fine, but we should all try to learn from each other.
If you don't explain your "look" to the people you meet up with,then most won't "get it".Even if it is a simple statement such as "I love long skirts..Don't you love the colors of this one?" All that is fine,because you are explaining your presentation. Otherwise,you will be painted as "weird " with the broad brush others face.I don't think it is about cowering in your closet,it is about explaining your look to the "mainstream" world that will help with acceptance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jamie001
I understand your point, but I'm not sure if it is necessary to explain. Case and point: Today I went to the local Radio Shack to pick up some items and both of the male clerks working there had pink streaks in their sky-high spiked hair and earrings the size of Quarters that stretch the earlobe out of shape. They were employed by a major retailer and both of them were interacting with customers in a very professional manner and were knowledgeable about the products that they are selling. They were not explaining anything about their "alternative look" to the customers in the store. It just wasn't necessary.Quote:
Originally Posted by rogina garter
I replied earlier today about not thinking this was a good idea, and it kind of prodded my mind all day. As a CD who does my best to express my feminity when dressed, I forgot one major thing. We as CD's are asking the public to accept us as we are, as normal, non sexual predator people who are intouch with our feminity. Would it be fair to us if we did not also accept those who dressed in female cloths because they liked them, but didn't feel the need to move away from their masculinity. It kind of reminded me of that old Star Trek episode where there are two aliens fighting each other on the Enterprise. They both appear the same to us, until its pointed out that one is white on the right side and black on the left, and the other is black on the right side and white on the left. Are we not the same?
I still stand by a kilt is not comparable in public to wearing a skirt. You may be teased about it, but everyone still percieves it as male clothing.
I would say that their look would be considered a trend for some young people,however your look would be thought of as a fetish..why? Because most mainstream males don't dress "that way"..People tend to label you,and move on. If they are interested in your interesting look,then they will talk it up..Happens that way for us in public at times.I have no problem with you "GFing",but I doubt it will catch on.
The reason that GFing will never catch on is because boys are taught when they are toddlers that anything feminine including and feminine expression is an extreme transgression and must be avoided at any cost. They are also taught that if they slip-up and inadvertently display femininity that they must compensate immediately by doing something that is considered to be extremely masculine. Also, if they don't abide by these unwritten rules, other children will verbally and physically ensure that they refrain from future transgressions.Quote:
Originally Posted by rogina garter
These ridiculous rules of masculinity need to change as they serve no useful purpose. Only then will it be possible for males to embrace GFing.
I don't dress to pass.
Panties come in alot more styles and colors
I've always liked panties better than mens
underwear.
Womens pants etc samething.
Am i more fem than masculine....yes
The general pop will say i'm crossdressed because
they're "womens". will most in cd tv tg world consider it
cding or a start?
Its all perspective
I've not read this thread, just the first post with the question, and I happened to notice my good friend Docrobbysherry posted up a couple above the end so I read his -er- hers about passing - yes I have seen her both ways, and yes, she's right about her appearance, but when clean-shaven, you're not that bad! :-)
Anyway, I'm one who just simply can't afford the time or expense to become passable. I can't afford the laser treatments, electrolysis, or even wigs. I can't afford to go to the salon to get waxed, my nails done, or even my hair styled. I work full time, and I'm in school part time taking 6 credits (12 is considered full time, so that makes me half time). I live as cheaply as possible in the littlest apartment I could find. I live very close to where I work so if my car breaks down I can walk or bus to work in a reasonable amount of time. I buy my clothes at the Goodwill bulk surplus area that Docrobbysherry told me about - $2.49 PER POUND for clothes! For me, a big purchase is to buy a $10 bra at Burlington Coat Factory.
So, I'm not passable, but I dress en femme 90% of the time. So, yes I do look like a guy in a dress. Hey, I'm not as bad looking as Corporal Klinger was on MASH, cuz at least I shave or trim my hair!
I think that the level of "passable-ness" that we put on ourselves is no different than the women we know that are deeply affected by the images of unnaturally thin models! What kind of hypocrite am I when I tell my lovely daughter that she's beautiful just the way she is, and yet I fret over myself for hours in the mirror trying to look passable?
Ann
Jamie001 says: "These ridiculous rules of masculinity need to change as they serve no useful purpose. Only then will it be possible for males to embrace GFing."
If you don't think that these rules serve any purpose maybe you need to be asking the "industrial military complex" if they do!
I will chime in and say that I use skirts, kilts or sarongs along with my other masculine attire. The skirts are generally of my own design, tend to be solid Earth tone colors. Right now I am finishing a long dark brown suede skirt. I will wear this with a sweater or sport jacket.
My sarongs are much more colorful and generally have prints. Most are geometric patterned prints, some flowered. I wear these to parties with solid colored polo shirts or t-shirts.
The kilts range from plain old solid pea green with cargo pockets which I use for hiking to more formal plaid (tartan) kilts which I wear with sport jackets.
I took an interest in skirts, sarongs, kilts some five years ago and I continue to work them into my wardrobe. Skirts are considered feminine dress by many in this culture and I do get some odd looks and stink eye on occasion. However, I collect a lot more positive comments than I do stink eyes.
My intent is to keep it "decent" and believable. Bottom line, however, is I am not breaking any laws and its really up to me and me alone what I choose to wear!
I will also put a plug in for skirtcafe.org, I haven't had any problems with those folks and I find them a breath of fresh air.
I can't even begin to wrap my head around wanting to go out in public in a dress of skirt and not try to present as a woman. I don't pass, so I don't go out in public and never will. But to wear my skirts or dresses without trying to appear feminine, would no doubt cause humiliation, laughter and people thinking I have a screw loose. Sorry, I do care what people think of me, even strangers.
Just my personal POV here. Please take no offense, none is intended.
First of all. I do not, nor have I ever dressed to impress. For the most part I really don't care what most people think of my fashion sense. I dress comfortably according to my own wishes.
As for becoming a laughing stock, I laugh at their jokes with them. It has a tendency to throw them off and defuses the situation. Just go along with their jokes. Laugh at yourself with them, you may find that you like it. If you can't take a joke, then maybe you should not go out dressed at all. You cannot and will not be on good terms with everyone on the planet. Don't even try. Be yourself and treat your detractors with an overdose of humorous indifference or just ignore them. You do not need to explain to everyone why you dress as you do. (Make a joke yourself.) They're going to draw their own conclusions anyway.
Lighten up and laugh. Life is sooooo more more enjoyable that way.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ceri Anne
I will agree with you wearing a kilt is deffinatelt no the same as wearing a skirt. I have both and have woren both out and there is none of the odd stares and snikers I when I wear my kilt. I do think it might help Underdresser feel more comfortable going out at first in a kilt, If that is something he would like to do. If one has never been out in a skirted garment before it can be a little intimadating as we all know and a kilt while mens wear is still diffrent then the norm for most poeple.
Hmmmm, this is exactly what women faced 50 years ago when the started wearing pants. All of those women must have had a screw loose. :brolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by BRANDYJ
My screw isn/t loose any more I tightened it. Now to put on my skirt and get out tight screws and all.
YES. Well spoken Underdresser.
I too like to dress femme, but am not passable, and don't try.
I often wear femme tops and carry a purse in male mode.
I also dress in pantyhose, dress, forms, etc. while sporting a mustache.
Most people don't care how you dress, as long as you pay your bill, and aren't in there face about it.
None of us here have the same needs or expectations, we should ALL be accepting of others no matter their differences from our own.
Interesting thread with some very judgmental viewpoints.
I don't own any guy jeans anymore. I always wear women's jeans. And some of them are very feminine and tight. I often wear these with sandals and painted toenails but a guy t-shirt and nothing else. I also wear feminine shorts and capris in the same fashion.
Some of you don't get it. I'm not doing this to provoke a reaction. I'm not doing it for ANY external reason. I'm doing it for how it makes me feel.
Many of you live in a self-deception, thinking you pass when you don't come close. The truth is, 99.5% of CDs do not pass and never will, no matter how much makeup they plaster on, how big the hair, how much padding. You're easily read. Sorry but wake up, take a good look at your pictures and see the truth.
After I realized this, I stopped caring about passing. I admit to feeling more comfortable and confident when fully dressed and made up, but that's really because I'm hiding under a wig and mask of makeup. It's not because I'm passing. I've got a force field of feminine things surrounding me; protecting me.
Typing this in my home, I'm sitting here in tight jean capris and a pink tank top. No forms, no wig, no makeup. I dress like this every day since I work at home. And if I feel the need to go to the store, I just put on a guy t-shirt and go, leaving the capris and sandals on. I wear the guy shirt for my own comfort in public, but I still wear the capris because... screw 'em, I like to wear capris.
Ciao
Duana,Quote:
Originally Posted by Duana
Thank you for your response. Hopefully the folks that make an effort to pass (even if most folks here will never be passable) and the male/female gender blenders such you and I will realize that we need to respect each others methods and presentation because it is who we are.
I have read all the post and I am disappointed in the lack of brotherhood. The more you divide the group up the less the support you have. So what I have intrepid and I could be wrong is there is a hierarchy to crossdressing. So I am to believe that if you dress fully make up and and go out you are at the top. Those that just wear clothes and go out are next. Then those that under dress and go out. Next those that fully dress and stay in the house. And lastly sorry folks are the ones who just put on certain articles of clothes and stay in the house. But you could keep dividing these groups to make yourself feel more superior if you are not as high on the list as you want. Just make the list longer behind you to make yourself feel better.
There is a guy in my city that walks around in women’s clothes, earrings and makeup, but he is bald headed. So where would he fit in. He dressed fully but had bad hair. My kid asked why he dressed that way and I said because he can. It is not how a person dresses it is how they act and treats others. I see even in a group of crossdressers that some don’t treat each other good unless you think they at your level or above.
Should be "lack of sisterhood".Quote:
Originally Posted by Jessica S
Attention all "GFers",I am one of you at times as well!! I have a "roller dyke" look that I use when I am Rollerblading in Ft Lauderdale by the beach. I hate"helmet hair" as much as Shrek does,so I skip wearing a wig.Enough makeup to be girly,lipstain and earrings..boobs in my sportsbra,of course,cause I like having em.. And when I went to Zumba class in Boston a few times last spring,Unitard,lipstain,no boobs,short skirt[to cover my butt like a girl],no wig to sweat up,and the drag queens doing the class as well said I was "GFing" them. I explained that it was just practical girliness to me,like my rollerdyking look.I can relate,but I save my practical girl look for exercising only.