Cross dressing and marriage.

This was inspired by JulieC thread on marriage and fear .
Cross dressing and marriage , why does it have the effect on some marriages so much more that other things that a person could do within a relationship .
Most other things would have maybe one or two things against it , maybe to much money spent on it or to much time spent on it .
So what is different about cross dressing , well as was mentioned in that thread FEAR for one, but where is this fear coming from .
Unlike a lot of other things it can be coming from the CDer and the wife/SO of the CDer, the CDer may fear that their wife/SO will leave them because they are not manly enough, they may fear that they will lose their job if found out , they fear if they tell and they fear if they don`t tell and get found out .
The wife/SO may fear that their partner is becoming less of a man , they may fear that they will be left on their own if the CDer wants to go further with it , then you have all the out side interference , will all their friends stop speaking to them , will the children be affected and get bullied at school .
Cross dressing can if you let it ruin a relationship purely on that one feeling alone FEAR, yes i know that there are many other things to take into account but if in your relationship you can get over that fear of the unknown when it comes to cross dressing then you will have nothing to fear .
(But i may be wrong) :heehee:

I think a lot of wives just can't get past the "pervert" issue.... plain and simple.... everything else is secondary......

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Originally Posted by Karren Hutton

I think a lot of wives just can't get past the "pervert" issue.... plain and simple.... everything else is secondary......

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:lol2: Yes that as well but i did not realy want to talk about me :roflmao:

I'm with you Karen, my wife tries but it just makes her skin crawl

Love covers a multitude of sins, especially in a strong relationship. CDing can prove to be the "deal breaker", however, especially if the SO feels her essence as a woman is being threatened if it tends to be an obsession.

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Originally Posted by Karren Hutton

I think a lot of wives just can't get past the "pervert" issue.... plain and simple.... everything else is secondary......

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Sorry a lot of wifes/partners just plain can't get past the lies and decet you CDERS use the PERVERT word .......... many of us GG's don't

I agree with Denise. My wife will not think of me as a girlfriend just her husband who has the gift of caring, compasssion, understanding and ,oh yes, the love to be as feminine as possible.
Margot

My wife feels uncomfortable with me CDing. There are times, however, when she is perfectly comfortable with it. Neither time is affected by her thinking that I am trying to horn in on her femininity. She gets it that this has very little to do with her, and that she didn't cause any of this.

The other day, though, she grinned at me, and told me that if I am going to wear the panties that she is going to wear the pants...and put on some boxers! :love:

Tia

I think fear stems from secrets. Wives start thinking, if he didn't tell me this, what else isn't he telling me? If he wants to be dressed as a woman, does that mean he wants to be with a man? If he says no now, will that change? And I think all of that boils down to a wife feeling like they're lacking in some way and not enough for their partner.

If you walk into a stressful situation with those assumptions running around in your head, it's hard to hear what's really being said to you by your husband.

I went through the "does he want to be with a man when his femme side is out?", and "will he leave me for a man?", when my partner first came out.
But as we figure out where Melissa fits into our lives, that concern became less and less. But the only way our stressful issues have been resolved is by talking about it over and over again.

There's no way I could come out with my bi side or him to come out with his CD side, with other people, and see it turn into the constructive supportive environment that we've created. I credit the way we communicate.

I think in order to deal with fears and assumptions, both parties have to be willing to listen. I find that fear usually stems from misinformation that feeds into assumptions.

The more things I wonder about when it comes to my partner's CDing, the more questions I ask. I would rather get the answers from him than to go on an assumption only to find I stressed myself out needlessly about something. It's also not my place to decide how he feels about something or assume why does/doesn't do something. He should have the right to answer for himself.

I've come to find that she's becoming just as much a part of me, as she is a part of him. We sort of share her I guess. She brings out a different side of me that interests my partner, and I'm interested in his more submissive side that is Melissa.

But you're right...the support and openminded part of it comes from lack of fear. And a whole heap of trust. I trust what he says about how he feels, why he CD's (even if the reasons change over time) and in the end the rule is, "if one of us is uncomfortable, than we discuss." That way it doesn't give "fear" a chance to dig in her Manolo Blahnik heels and wreak havoc. ;)

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Originally Posted by Sheila

Sorry a lot of wifes/partners just plain can't get past the lies and decet

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You reap what you sow!

Fear is a strange thing which causes you to do some really stupid things. You know better than to hide it from your SO, but you do it anyway. Fear just causes you to be Stupid until one day you wake up. That day we finally learn that hiding, lying and covering up your cd'ing a 1000 times will still have the same result as the first is the day we finally grow up.

I finally learned but the damage is still done to my marriage. Just don't cover up your cd'ing. It is better to tell your SO sooner rather than later. The longer you wait the more likely you will have a terrible outcome.

Joanne, you're right -- most women at best would be insecure and at worst TERRIFIED or REPULSED by their SO being a crossdresser.

I'd say in general that most brides expect their husbands to be the manly pillar of strength they can lean on. CDing, of course, is pretty much the polar opposite of that so it's no wonder wives are so shook up when they learn. Then there's the "pervert" stereotype, and the assumption we're just gay at heart and must dress just to get ourselves a man... :brolleyes:

It takes a lot of talking, reassurance, trust, and love to get past all that and get your wife to understand that you're not a monster and that everything will be OK. Both parties have got to work for it. But it can be done! :hugs:

My wife & I went thru a lot of Bulls**T problems to reach the point in which we now live. I can truthfully say that she's 90% accepting of my lifestyle. The strange thing is a lot of the problems we encountered were of our own making....Here''s a few (and how we overcame them them)

1 - Is he a pervert? ...overcame this by to acting as any normal woman would...trying to be sensitive,nuturing and caring to her needs.
2- Is he gay? ... The only way to overcome this is to not give her any reason to think that.
3. Does he want a sex change? ... Ditto answer #2
4. Is it going to take over our marrage? ....Overcame this by trying to be more sensitive to her needs and not walk out in a dress & heels when she needs a man to talk to.

The list could go on and on, and I suspect there are some wives who'll never accept it. But if you're a CD'r and have a reasonably sucessfull relationship, it's worth a try to come to a compromise.:love:

My wife of 35 yrs, happy married, with 2 grown up boys, has got used to me under dressing and doesn't mind , hose,stockings, knickers ,cami tops even nail varnish colored on toes ,clear on hands,BUT, that's as far as she excepts at the moment,when she looks at clothes catalogs or we go shopping in girly shops, (GREAT TIMES )she always asks my opinion, her taste and mine are slightly different,
when I say, I love that dress, she chirps up, and you would wear it, I reply and why not,then goes of in a huff.
when I say, I like that silk and lace top, she replies no it makes you look like a woman (that's the idea dear) and totally disagrees etc etc etc.

She is my best friend and we have been through hell and high water together,but I just cant bring myself to go the whole hog and chance messing up 2 lives

She is not aware how deep my c/dressing goes ,or that I've always done it ,and all my top clothes are at a gg friend of mine ,who I go out and shopping with so I just continue with the baby steps at home, one at a time trying not to tip the scales too far

maybe, just maybe, I will live long enough to go the the whole way ,with her by my side, that would be heaven.

:hugs: to all

J-JAY

Some women my actually view "the woman in the mirror" as another woman - a form of cheating. Women can be very competitive and possessive about their men... :straightface:

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Originally Posted by FireflyGG

I think fear stems from secrets. Wives start thinking, if he didn't tell me this, what else isn't he telling me? If he wants to be dressed as a woman, does that mean he wants to be with a man? If he says no now, will that change? And I think all of that boils down to a wife feeling like they're lacking in some way and not enough for their partner.

If you walk into a stressful situation with those assumptions running around in your head, it's hard to hear what's really being said to you by your husband.

I went through the "does he want to be with a man when his femme side is out?", and "will he leave me for a man?", when my partner first came out.
But as we figure out where Melissa fits into our lives, that concern became less and less. But the only way our stressful issues have been resolved is by talking about it over and over again.

There's no way I could come out with my bi side or him to come out with his CD side, with other people, and see it turn into the constructive supportive environment that we've created. I credit the way we communicate.

I think in order to deal with fears and assumptions, both parties have to be willing to listen. I find that fear usually stems from misinformation that feeds into assumptions.

The more things I wonder about when it comes to my partner's CDing, the more questions I ask. I would rather get the answers from him than to go on an assumption only to find I stressed myself out needlessly about something. It's also not my place to decide how he feels about something or assume why does/doesn't do something. He should have the right to answer for himself.

I've come to find that she's becoming just as much a part of me, as she is a part of him. We sort of share her I guess. She brings out a different side of me that interests my partner, and I'm interested in his more submissive side that is Melissa.

But you're right...the support and openminded part of it comes from lack of fear. And a whole heap of trust. I trust what he says about how he feels, why he CD's (even if the reasons change over time) and in the end the rule is, "if one of us is uncomfortable, than we discuss." That way it doesn't give "fear" a chance to dig in her Manolo Blahnik heels and wreak havoc. ;)

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Sorry for the massive cut and paste, but :thumbsup: to this.

I see that when I choose women I must look for the ones who aren't threatened and are secure in their "femininity" enough that what someone wears does not concern them in the least. I think honestly they have more fun when there is no clothes involved. So the ones who are strong and confident in their own sexuality are not scared by a male who is strong and secure in his (even if that involves dresses). I believe that is why the younger generation is more accepting of gender bending than the older ones.

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Originally Posted by sheidelmeidel

Some women my actually view "the woman in the mirror" as another woman - a form of cheating. Women can be very competitive and possessive about their men... :straightface:

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This is similar to what I was going to mention. Having a 'spirit wife' at the same time you have a physical wife can be viewed as a special breed of polygamy.

It's not exactly the same as having to wives, since one is partly ethereal and, for all purposes, you, but many of the emotional complications would probably mirror that.

However, your own discernment has to take over there. There are things for the one, and things for the other.

But still more important, I reckon, while the act of cross-dressing itself may not do much for a marriage, the potential self-knowledge and relatedness it can teach the CD can drastically improve relationships, even shaky ones. This makes the inner 'marriage' to the feminine side a question of becoming whole enough to sustain and revel in a real-world one.

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Originally Posted by Lorileah

I see that when I choose women I must look for the ones who aren't threatened and are secure in their "femininity" enough that what someone wears does not concern them in the least. .

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See I wasn't that smart... I choose one who wore the same size clothes!! Duhhhhh.. :D

Obviously I should have put more thought into it.. Never figured she would ever find out.. Any my wife is over the lying thing.. She just assumes everything I say is a lie and that works for me!!

I don't think my wife could handle it full stop.

I have repeatedly over time tried to broach the subject, but her comments seem to make it clear that she only wants a man doing man things (and who can blame her - that seemed to be the deal when we married). However I have done all the macho thing and it does'nt work. I think she really does appreciate my femme side (cooking, cleaning and caring) but there does not seem to be that happy compromise that many of you attain.

My wife tolerates most of the things that I knowingly do and don't do in our relationship and puts up with Annie as long as I am discreet when I am out in public. She will not, however, go out with me when I am dressed as a woman. She has the fear of Annie being found out and fears how our neighbors, friends and co-workers would re-act. Her fear is greater than mine and she currently cannot get beyond her fear.

In a way, although she is married to a transgendered individual, she is very homophobic as she has said several times that she does not want to viewed as a lesbian. I sometimes cannot understand her statements as we have marital relations as two women and she is quite accepting of me as Annie in the bedroom.

Relationships are complex, even in the most ideal situations and given what we bring to the table, we should be happy with any amount of acceptance we can receive.

<On Soapbox> I don't have a lot of experience with women. I have only been married once and my wife and I will celebrate our 41st anniversary next month. But this is what I have experienced and observed in 60+ trips around the sun.

One- Marriages based on commitment to one another are more likely to survive than those based on fulfilling a need in your own life. The difference is in one case you are investing in the relationship and in the other, your looking at what you can take away from it. Younger people are particularly vulnerable to this. How often do you see youngsters playing video games hit the reset button because the game is not going as they want it to. Sadly this behavior translates to other areas of life as well, including marriage and relationships... if it isn't working out, terminate the relationship and start over. It requires no self-examination. On the other hand, If you have invested in the relationship, it forces you to look at what you have brought to the table and how it has affected the outcome.

Two- Know who you are committing to. Sounds obvious, but you would be amazed at how many couples I have counseled that said they didn't know some pretty basic things about their patners... political views, education level, the fact that he likes to play golf every weekend, that she squeezes the toothpaste tube from the middle, and so on. Unfortunately in this day of instant gratification where you can download music, pick up fast food on the way home, on-line banking, etc. Of course, if one believes a relationship is moving in direction where commitment is a real possibility, then it is equally the responsibility of BOTH parties to disclose details to one another. "But if I tell her I cross dress she might not love me any more." If you don't tell her, she's not in love with you anyway. She's in love with a character you are playing and your chances of a long term relationship are two... slim and none. Better to find out now, early on in the relationship, than later on when other innocent lives (children) are involved. Besides, isn't it better for your partner to love you for EVERYTHING you are?

Three- Communicate with one another. What too many couples fail to realize is that communication is a two part process... and talking is only ONE part of it. Listening is just as important. And it's the only way you have of determining if your partner understood what you said. If you're listening and don't fully understand something that is said, ask a clarifying question. One technique that is often successful is, "What I heard you say is... Is that what you meant?"

Okay, I've probably gone on too much here. The bottom line is no matter how pretty the house is, if the foundation is faulty, the house will become damaged, or worse, destroyed. And the foundations of love, are trust and truth. Trust me, the chemistry will take care of itself :D.

<Off Soapbox>

There are as many reasons as to how wife's and SO's react to cross dressing as there are cross dressers. Each case is individual in acceptance, fears, etc. The one constant, in my opinion, is that if there is open and honest communication the major hurdles can be passed. For example, when I first came out to my wife it was with a lot of discussion, research and more discussion. There were the usual ups and downs of acceptance levels that many here have discussed, but with time the acceptance has grown for me.

As an example, I just asked my wife if it would be OK to get dressed this weekend and to out to a local bar that cross dressers attend. I have never asked this before, although she knows that I have gone there when she was out of the country. Her response was that it is my life and that as long as no one would identify me as her husband it is OK. It has taken several years to get to this point because I did not push the issue.

There are spouses and SO's totally accept and participate, others that want no part of it, those that accept from a distance and those that end the relationship. So, what is the answer. Who knows?

My favorite is vinegar and oil! The LONGER u let it sit, the more it SEPARATES!:doh:

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Originally Posted by Karren Hutton

See I wasn't that smart... I choose one who wore the same size clothes!! Duhhhhh.. :D

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That doesn't matter, Karren! My ex was 5'4". She left her clothes from her 110 lb. days, in the closet when she moved out. I'm 5' 10", and 155. I STILL can fit into those clothes!:D

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Originally Posted by Holly

<On Soapbox> ...insert all of Holly's wise words here....<Off Soapbox>

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People will throw shoes at me if I quote that much text (and one shoe doesn't do me a damn bit of good...if you could throw pairs, in size 10, then we can talk) but I wanted to say I agree completely!! Very well said. :thumbsup:

Finding out their knight in shining armor, is really just wearing pantyhose, can be a major letdown. Just sayin.....