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I was just reading an article about how Michelle Obama shows out shopping regularly. She is the first lady and most people don't even recognize her. She was talking about going to Baskins Robbins for ice cream with her kids. People just don't notice as much as we think.
Has this story changed your perception of going out?
I can tell you from experience that this is the truth about how people react. If you blend and dress appropriately then people are just too busy to care about you.
I have just recently begun to wear pantyhose underneath my shorts and like you said no one really notices or cares!
You called it Michelle! Generally speaking, most people are so wrapped up in themselves and what they are doing that they don't notice much!
I haven't really noticed that Michelle. Probably because I am having too much fun.
Just because people do not say anything does not mean they do not notice. I agree if you dress tastefully- classy, not whorish, you will blend in much better. People do, however, notice. There are only a small percentage of CD's that can fool the public. Fooling in a picture is one thing, but being able to do it in real life interaction, posture, voice, and dont forget "the hands" always give you away.
As far as Michelle Obama, thye were probably just ignoring her. I would............
Interesting AKAMichelle, I find that if I create something I see the flaws but to others see it as whole unified creation. They do not see the mistakes that I see. Maybe I am too critical and see the flaws in myself yet others may see the total package and do not see my mistakes.
I see a male (neanderthal) others may not but due to my personality, I fear the rejection and negativity I may experience so I hide away in my closet. Hmmm food for thought though AKAMichelle.
This has been our experience as well. People do notice and we've not had rude remarks, until just last weekend when someone shouted something very rude to us from a passing car. I posted about this in another thread. But, you are correct, the people who are wrapped up in their lives do not notice anyone who passes by them, and those who take a moment to observe us rarely say anything.Quote:
Originally Posted by rebecca.cross2
On a positive note, the minute my SO interacts with someone and they can attach a human quality to the CD who is talking to them, more often than not they relax and discover that CDs are human just like anyone else! :)
I have been cursed because I love to look at people and I have seen things that most people don;t notice. Back in the time of the Donny and Marie Show was going on in Orem, Utah and I was living where I am today about 60 miles north of Orem I was out Christmas shopping and ran into one of the Osmond brothers. I made eye contact with him and he about swallowed his face. He was shopping and thought that no one would recognize him if he was shopping far enough from home. He just had the bad luck of running into someone like me who is great with faces and is always looking at them. We talked for a while and he thanked me for not making a scene and outing him in public. I had empathy for him after all I would not like to have been outed in public if someone clocked me as a tranny back then either.
I knew about the Obama's being more public than just staying in. I commend them for their efforts. But it has not changed my own views of people. My own experience has.
First... I don't exactly blend... as I don't wear makeup to pass. I present as both feminine and masculine. And yet I don't make a big show of myself either. I hold my head up... I smile... and go on about my business.
So all the negative warning seems to be just scare tactics. However I'm smart about when I go out and staying near other people. I'm not walking down dark alleys... but I don't live my life in fear of what could happen. Life is to short for that.
I do see from the corner of my eyes the occasional stares and smirks. They don't bother me much because it's not my problem. A few men and women have asked if this was a Scottish thing? I was wearing a plaid skirt. I tell them... No... and so far all have been polite. There expressions are varied at the news.
The merchants are more than glad I've come in to spend some money and are very accommodating. And there are some people who smile brightly at what I'm wearing, mostly women. They make my day brighter as I brightly smile back to them.
But I agree... most people are just going about there own business... as am I.
my experience is somewhat limited--I've only been out dressed four or five times--but it does seem to me as though no one really pays much attention. Even when I make eye contact with people, I don't see many raised eyebrows or puzzled looks.
5% rule applies. Most people are pre-occupied, looking somewhere else at the moment you happen to pass, in a fog, chatting with someone or on the phone, looking in a store window, etc. Only some of the few who really look at you, and not just with a vacant scan so as not to walk into you, will read you, and that depends, of course, on your passability as well how much observation time they have.
Lea
If jane Q public is like me.... When ever I notice something... "Look at that new thingy". my wife always says "its only been there for 3 years". Lol.
In the spring of this year I attended a construction labor protest at the state capital in Lansing, Michigan. Here there were thousands of construction workers and in the middle of all the sign carrying and renewing old friendships there was a guy taking pictures in a skirt and construction boots. Not a kilt but a kaki skirt and no one said a word. Not one remark , it was like he was being ignored by the entire crowd. I noticed him and everyone that was in his sight noticed him but nobody said anything. True story !
Yes there will be that somebody who notices and wants to make a scene, but that is the exception. People just don't care enough to say a word.
So the point is that our fears are keeping you in the closet. Not reality! I don't pass well but I have flown and spent vacation in SF and Chicago.
The choice is yours to make. Are you going to stay locked up by your fears or go out. You could even go out of town to go out, but don't let fear be the reason to stay at home.
I literally just came back from shopping at Steinmart and having a leisurely cup of coffee at starbucks. I'm sure that a few people notices (and read) the tall lady - but I never picked up on a single adverse reaction. I did notice that a number of people just didn't pay any attention to me at all...which was just fine. the young male cashier at Steinmart couldn't have been more courteous and friendly and the staff at Starbucks are always equally so. There were three kids - late teens I suppose - just ahead of me at Starbucks and honestly, not one of them seemed to notice me.
With how many sercet service dudes? right...Quote:
Originally Posted by AKAMichelle
People notice everything. People definitely notice CD's in public. You may want to think people aren't noticing you, but they are. The question is - Does it matter to you?
Maybe I'm lucky because I'm 5'6", but I never had a bad reaction in crowded shopping malls, movie theatre lobbies, restaurants, supermarkets, etc. So far I have been ignored........and that's exactly how I like it.
Anyone who want's to question if I'm a guy or a girl, fine.
Anyone who who has figured out the truth, fine....just be nice, that's all I ask.
Quote:
Originally Posted by AKAMichelle
I just want to add, both these statements are true. People do notice (when they take the time to look), and most don't care, just as any one of us won't care when we see any stranger that we believe looks out of the ordinary, what ever that might be to us. I mean, people don't get emotionally invested in someone they know they'll never see again.Quote:
Originally Posted by MissMarcie
The mistake, I think, is in many CDers believing they are not read. Very few CDs can pull off making others believe they are GG, especially when there is any form of interaction.
People have their own agenda and unless you interfere in some way with that agenda no ones cares. I am terrible at faces and often my GF would say "did you see who that was?" as someone walked by. I would have not even noticed an NBA basketball player. On the other hand I notice things while driving and she didn't. So it depends on your priorities. When I am out and dressed I want someone to notice otherwise I can just wear what I normally wear and be invisible
CD'ing aside, IMHO I really do think that most people are so self-absorbed that you could walk through a crowded mall dressed like a chicken and fewer people would notice you than wouldn't. :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineD
I agree with your last comment. Lacey Leigh's books talk about assuming you are always read and just not caring. I think that this is the best attitude to take.
Deb
I have been going out in public for the past 6 years dressed totally enfemme, but otherwise looking like the man that I am. No wig and no makeup!! I go everywhere, malls, restaurants, post offices, and even to the doctors office, and no one ever pays any attention to me!! Of course the people in my doctor's office know I crossdress so naturally they don't care. Occasionally some person, usually a GG, will ask me where I got the outfit I am wearing! But that is about the only comments that I ever hear!! People just don't care, unless you look real wild!!
Exactly. And even more than just not caring, it's good to assume that when you get to know people while dressed, many will respond positively as they have with my SO. A CDer doesn't have to be mistaken for a woman in order to be accepted for who she is.Quote:
Originally Posted by Debglam
I have to agree wholeheartedly. Its more than just indifference - people can be genuinely welcoming and friendly even to an apparent CDr like myself.Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineD
This afternoon I stopped at Starbucks for a smoothie and then to Dress Barn. The young male baristas were entirely courteous. While I sat and enjoyed my smoothie three young men, college students I guess, sat the sofa and easy chair oposite me. None of them said or did anything to suggest they were the least bit uncomfortable with my presense. When I got up I offered another member of their party my seat and they smiled and thanked me.
At Dress Barn, the store manager (Kelley) greeted me and reminded me she'd helped me choose tops a few weeks ago. We chatted as I browsed. I only bought a couple of necklaces (bogo) but we had a great conversation. She knows I'm male, married and so on, and truly she couldn't have been more friendly. Sure, she's paid to be friendly, but it was still very pleasant.
A few minutes ago, I had to drop our dogs off at the kennel - we're making a trip out of town. Rather than change back into drabs, I decided to heck with it and brought our girls in just as I was. I visited with a couple that was dropping off a pet and with the girl at the front desk. She had to call our vet to get a vaccination record, and said "she's here dropping them off" while she was talking to the vets office. Maybe she thought I looked like a mature woman or maybe she was just being very considerate. Either way, I enjoyed the expereince and felt fully at home en femme.
It’s possible that perhaps you’ve accustomed yourself to just not noticing or caring that there are people paying attention to you. Unless you happen to reside in the most liberal minded community in America…(does it exist?) people are definitely noticing you. They may not be saying or doing anything negative, but they are definitely observing you. You may very well live in a liberal area, but I can assure you, there are plenty of places where people will be very vocal concerning your appearance.Quote:
Originally Posted by sissystephanie
The way i handle it is I know that im really not fooling anyone ..This is me, im trying my best im having an awesome time ,deal with it ... I carry my photo Album with me all the time my best pictures in a carry on bag ..Anytime i find someone looking at me to long i just whip out my pictures and show them just how pretty i can look under the right conditions. This allways starts a very fun and friendly conversation .Try it it works great... also the best advice i ever got was " what is passable, if you feel like a girl your a girl"
I didn't read the original Michelle Obama article but I do get the point. There have been plenty of times that I have been out an no one seems to even notice me. Ok, I do have some things going on with me that don't make me stand out (5ft 4ins, 126lbs) but nevertheless, if people have read me or not, they rarely let me know that they have .... which is dangerous, as it makes me think I'm more passable than I am. Oh well ... who knows or cares. I'm totally ok with them reading me and ignoring me :)
Most of us when we go out are overdressed, compared to others that we might run into. If we are overdressed, then we will stick out and will be noticed. I have followed the advice of my wife and dress more casually.
How much do people really notice? Well...if your hair or dress is on fire... :D
How many details can you recall about the last three people you saw in public? Age, shirt, shoes, eye color, nails, jewelry, complexion, hands, moles, scars, belt color, gait, stance, gestures, emotional state, and items they were holding. See how many you can list.
This issue and the answer is one of those "debatable" issues heavily influenced by what we choose to believe or deceive ourselves into disbelieving, as we filter our perceptions and logic to the point of justifying doing the things we want to do.
The closest think to a "correct" answer is that it depends upon the person presenting and the person observing. Is it possible to "go unnoticed"? Yes. Is it possible to identify even the most "passable" M>F or F>M? Yes. Some people are naturally more perceptive than others and good at "reading people". Some are quicker learners than others. Many just don't care. It has a lot to do with the scenario and amount of time people have to observe.
The more knowledge you acquire about sensory perception, human behavior, body language and "deception", the more proficient you will become in "blending in" and/or "recognition". Your expertise is a reflection of the effort you devote to perfecting it.
When I had an art glass business, my partner and I would invent games to play while standing for hours at our tables cutting glass. One of us would identify a person, place or thing we both witnessed, and we would compete to see who could recall the greatest number of details. (Alternating back/forth, one non-duplicate detail per person, until we were both "empty").
I used to tell people how much the technology in those street cameras can invade privacy.
I can't tell you how many times I hear this "Oh, they can't do that!" I don't even bother mentioning it anymore. I know this is a bit of digression from topic, but...
Think you can "hide" in a crowd? Let this image of a crowd at the 2011 Stanley Cup load, and then use the zoom control on left. (Wait for image to focus after you stop each time).
http://www.gigapixel.com/image/gigapan-canucks-g7.html
:love:
This is a good post and I have enjoyed reading every ones comments.
I always notice when I see a CD or trans person MtF or FtM. I am expert level at clocking gay people too.
People notice, they even feel us on a soul level.(I am a Mystic, Really:)
I live right out side of NYC and am in there allot and see some great looking cd's and trans people...and not so great looking too.
But I for one extend xtra love to those I see, and know that there is a more highly evolved spirit before me.
What I mean by xtra is I will make eye contact and smile or see them and welcome them as they are part of me.
Aww ... I used to live about 15 blocks from the street corner that Eluuzion posted, many moons ago. I have many fond memories of the place. :)
Fascinating technology.
I'm sure I get read by some , but as for negative comments, no, never. Also, being read and being noticed, are two different things we soon discover. I often make eye contact with women while shopping, I smile and they smile back. I believe women take notice in how someone else is dressed nicely, or with a hair style/color they like, or makeup they appreciate, or shoes they love, etc. I believe as someone that is out regularly, more often than not, that is my case. People are too busy living their daily lives to concern themselves about anyone else anyway. They may notice, but don't have time nor desire to comment, compliment, or criticize. They just want to go home and relax.
Yeah, most of us saw the contrived photos of Michelle Obama shopping "incognito" in the Target. The AP photographer "just happened to be there". She looks like a slob in the pictures. Lesson learned: if you want to blend into a crowd without being noticed, dress like a slob.