Crossdresser Going Into the Army

Hey everyone, my name's Alexis, and I've wanted to go in the Army my whole life pretty much, but also been a crossdresser my whole life and one thing I got a say, I think I've had the good fortune to actually embrace and accept this part of me during college, before going in the Army, because I know what I'm going to do with it.

Both my parents, my older sister, and my whole fraternity from college know about it, and I've go out to LGBT bars and other places I consider safe. When I started college I was trying to deny this part of me, but over the last few years I've found ways to safely embrace it even while I was in ROTC.

Anyway, I'm posting partly because I know I'll have challenges as a crossdresser and would love some insights, but don't want to stop being myself. Both the crossdressing and my desire to serve are immense parts of me.

I plan to put my safety above all else going in the Army, and I expect I'll enjoy my time in the Army, even if I don't end up staying long for reasons related to CDing or them trying to make cuts.

So anyway, I wanted to know what people think of my plans....

Right now I still hang around a predominantly lesbian LGBT bar while dressed up and occasionally go shopping carefully in some places. For me just doing this on occasion is enough, and I've gone extended periods without it (don't think I'll have an urge to buy a burqa over in Kabul), but I don't want to run from me either completely and so my plan was to use the internet to get in touch with supportive people in cities relatively close to my duty station (probably at least 30 minutes away though) when I get to one, and have a fraternity brother of mine who I trust mail all my things (clothes, shoes, wig, etc.) for me to someone who I can safely go out with occasionally as Alexis.

I'm curious if anyone would have any critiques or suggestions to add to these plans. I'm pretty sure I won't have too much trouble keeping this from the Army, but then I've still yet to start Basic. Also, another additional question, I am wondering about shaving these days in the military. One of my CD friends who's in says it's not a big deal, people might look at you a little weird or even tease, but it doesn't go too far or prevent advancing.

I'm going to have a lot of other questions actually related to this, but I don't want to write a whole book just yet, lol

Be VERY CAREFUL.
However innocent your intentions may be.
I have been challenged a few times photographing trains at the pentagon.
EVEN after getting permission. (It is a tastefully decorated subway station in Washington DC.)
Remember all communications are monitored in some way out of military establishments.
Keywords like sex, bombs, drugs, and rock and roll are amongst the more interesting they look at.
Don't go racing around in burkahs or even wear panties.
Whilst at home you may get a slap on the wrist, but over there you may be better off taking a drug overdose.
Even in a green zone these are extremely risky undertakings.
Remember always look over your shoulder and "BIG BROTHER IS WATCHING YOU"
Even this site is not a place to vent your plans, people put 2 + 2 together and it is not hard to work out the puzzle.
More---
Check around before joining as the military have changed their outlook towards Gays and I assume people like us.
It is more favorable now. I wish you every success in the military, I kept to myself and did not go around patting other soldiers on the bum as it meant a dis honourable discharge then.

Alexis,

I spent 25 years in the Navy and got a lot out of it. I did NOT dress while I was in however. One thing you need to be clearly aware of is that none of this new openess with the repeal of DADT applies to transgender. First, TG is considered an "illness" that you can be separated for. Second, military "justice" is about discipline, not justice per se. The Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) and the regulations of the individual services have some pretty broad provisions. Being caught crossdressing, caught with female clothing, etc. COULD be considered as a punishable offence under some of these provisions. I don't have my UCMJ in front of me, but the "conduct unbecoming" provisions come to mind.

Again, I'm not trying to discourage you. The military gave me an education, a number of life skills, and actually was how I met my wife, so in a sense they gave me a family too. You just need to go in with eyes wide open. Feel free to PM me if you would like to talks some more.

Debby

I mean, I'm not planning on even getting online about it while out on deployment. Are they really going to monitor my internet usage from my laptop that much? When I'm in the privacy of my room back in the States will I be unsafe just posting on forums and sending emails about it?

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Originally Posted by ak88gurl

I mean, I'm not planning on even getting online about it while out on deployment. Are they really going to monitor my internet usage from my laptop that much? When I'm in the privacy of my room back in the States will I be unsafe just posting on forums and sending emails about it?

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It all depends how you would be accessing the internet. If it is on a government computer or if you are accessing through a government network, then you have no expectation of privacy.

Even though it is probably more accepted now than it has been in the past, I would believe getting a TS SCI clearance would be more difficult with a cross-dressing background. Having clearance issues could put a real damper on a career.

You did not say how you would be going in. You mentioned college and ROTC but then talk of Basic, so Officer or Enlisted? If Officer, expect to have no privacy or chance to dress even if not deployed for at least the first year, you will probably be sharing quarters with other guys. If enlisted do not even expect to see much of the civilian world for at least six months, then do not be surprised if your life is closely controled for quite a while, possibly years, usually until you make at least E3 or better. As was noted, if you use a government computer or network, you have no privacy. If you live on base your quarters are subject to inspection at any time, so no place to hide anything. If you are in a position that requires a security clearance there is a very strong possibilty that during the investigation for this you will be discovered. I have heard of CDs with Top Secret clearances, but the CDing was only discovered well after the original clearance was granted, back in pre-internet days. Usually the problem is if CDing can be used as a blackmail tool against you. Even a private computer in quarters on base may be subject to search, so consider carefully. With the recent Wikileaks thing with the person blaming GID, I do not see the military becoming any easier on CD/TG/TS folks anytime soon. I also am not trying to dissuade you, I loved the time I spent in uniform, just giving you info. Good Luck...........Stephanie

This day and age one REALLY needs to examine their reasoning for joining the military. Many join for what many are FINALLY thinking is the wrong reason and that in financial help in life. I am sorry, I do not understand any one at this time that willfully would join the military. Why do I say this?

Look at what has happened to our fighting men and women after these wars we are in. We ended up losing MORE people in this ten year war (that is LONGER than WWII) than we lost on 9/11, the event that got us into this mess. Those that went for what were the right reasons back after that act of terrorism (that may not have happened had people not been so ho hum when an aircraft gets hijacked, I mean after all, who would have thought of using an aircraft as a missile?.....oh Lets see...Germany, Japan, Italy, The Brits, French...all those countries that had aircraft (though the Germans and Japanese had them be manned, and only the Japanese had truly suicidal weapons). But of course instead of having passengers trained to take down would be Hijackers...ala Air Al, we just are told to just let what happens happen, and the plane be taken off course.

Those men and women joining for the right reason, were abused and mistreated by our government. Yes there are many that will fare just fine, but there are many many more that are messed up for life, and for what? What is it that has been accomplished? The region is still a mess, and will remain such until it is converted into a glass bowl. (Something I sadly feel is an inevitablitly)

I think anyone at this time that is joining the military as it is is not quite thinking right. I know there could be family history and stuff, but you know there are circles of tradition that can stand to be broken. My father got royally screwed over by the Navy, despite getting an honorable discharge. His GI bill was only half paid, and he got NO VA rights.

On top of that, you are acknowledging that you have a characteristic that the military will not like. One that you have been very open about (good for you on that count). In this day and age you don't think that will follow you into military life? Look what is happening with Bradley Manning. What a crappy argument of defense for what he did (however you feel about his actions, what he did has NOTHING to do with him being Trans Gendered)

I hate to bring in this strong of an example, but I would think you wanting to be in the Army would be like an Irish Catholic wanting to join her majesty's armed forces. Not quite foolhardy, but still not very wise.

I for one would not want to be part of an organisation that hates a quality of me that hurts no one, ruins no ones lives, and for the most part should not matter. There is also the whole thing of when you sign your name on the line you become United States Property. I think there is a passage in the Bible that is against such a thing, and it is not a mistranslation like much of the Bible (Deut 22:5, for one) but a clearly stated thing. Such as, you belong to the lord, or something like that.

But that is my honest opinion.

NOTE: Please do not think I do not honor those that have fought this countries wars, most notably the battles of WWII. But I view war as something that needs to go away, and frankly the only reason they happen is because people ALL over the world join those forces that even the founding fathers said should not exist in peace time. The military is VERY wasteful of resources, and is in many ways are harbinger of horrible "traditions". The above statement of "behavior of not becoming an officer" or what have you. For crying out loud, the military exists for one reason and one reason only, to destroy things. Every single thing in the military is in one way or another connected with the destruction of someone else's property or lives.

I wish more people would view war as an outdated, and in many ways, immature way of dealing with conflicts. Osama Bin Laden should have been sniped, as should Sadam Husien. Snipers and spies. Oh yea, that's right we have that stupid law that Ford signed prohibiting the assassination of key figures, I forgot about that bit of wisdom.

When I was growing up I was friends who fought in WWII, and every last one of them wishes that they had not had to do the things they did. They know it was for a good cause, but still many of them were against this country EVER entering another war.

WWII should have been the last of such large scale stupidity.

I served in the military BEFORE the DADT "law" existed. When my CDing was "discovered" thanks to a vindictive ex-wife my life became a living hell. I lost my Top Secret clearance, I was investigated by the USAFOSI, and sent to multiple Psychological examinations. In the end, while they could not prove I was mentally unstable and that I was NOT a security threat, I was still forced out of the military under a "Reduction In Force" program.

You cannot be this open with your CDing and think that the military is going to be "okay" with this aspect of your life. Not only will you have to deal with ignorance from some of the older NCO's and Officers, but your fellow recruits will NOT be your best buddies if they find out. Even though the military supposedly "frowns" on things like "Blanket Parties", that kind of "justice" is still being doled out.

OK. You asked for opinions. There are plenty of good reasons to NOT join the military. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ARihMrxdjU It is insanity.

Ok.... think I need to be more clear about some things. My parents and older sister know. My fraternity from school knows. A few friends from the LGBT community who I hang out with know. Most people who know me, however, do NOT know about Alexis, and I'm intending to keep it this way. I am still not exactly "out" and have no intention of trying to be while in the military or letting anyone in the military (other than three fraternity brothers I have in the Army who already know) find out about me being a crossdresser. I appreciate the concerns, but while I've accepted myself as a crossdresser, I did not mean to imply that I'm going to be going after a security clearance with a "crossdressing background."

I've graduated college with a bachelors degree but did not stay in ROTC to the end to commission, so I'm going in as an E4 Specialist. I already understood about government computers and networks and was not planning to keep anything in the barracks, which was why I was asking about my plan as far as having someone, well off base, keep stuff for me that I would have mailed to the person, so I could hang out somewhere safe well off base (i.e. an LGBT bar). Furthermore, I'm talking about this as far as when I actually get to a permanent duty station. The burqa thing was a joke, and I'm quite confident that I can go through the year long deployments without anything to do with crossdressing. What I'm asking about is the safety basically of getting my clothes stored with someone well off base, dressing well off base, and hanging out somewhere LGBT friendly well off base.

Ellyn, I'm asking for opinions soley on my plans to occasionally crossdress without letting the military find out, and if you have never served in the military, I'd actually rather ask you incidentally to keep your opinions to yourself entirely because the point was to get some insider perspective also.

I am active duty Army and have decided to retire to enable my transition. Believe me when I tell you there are 3 things you must know -

1. AR40-501 (STANDARDS OF MEDICAL FITNESS) specifically prohibits your enlistment (Para 2-27 n. page 15) or retention (Para 3-35, page 33) if you are a cross dresser or transsexual. Download the reg here: http://www.apd.army.mil/pdffiles/r40_501.pdf

2. This is not to say that there are no cross dressers in the military, but if they ask you when you enlist if you are a cross dresser and you say No you'll get in, but if your dressing comes to light you could never tell them you were doing this before you joined or not only will you be discharged under Para 3-35 you may also find yourself prosecuted for a fraudulent enlistment. And if you enlisted or later reenlisted in a program that gave you a monetary bonus you'll be required to pay this back. An ROTC contracted cadet (which you are not) may be required to pay the cost of the college classes they'd received (I have actually seen ROTC frauds prosecuted this way). You had better stay in DEEP STEALTH if you join.

3. The repeal of Don't Ask Don't Tell does nothing for us. DADT dealt with sexual orientation, NOT gender identity or gender expression. AR 40-501 is still in effect. In fact, if you do a web search for DADT Repeal FAQ you'll find that very topic specifically addressed.

Sorry, but this is the reality as of today. Maybe it will change before too long, but don't hold your breath.

I'm aware of the regulations and I appreciate your well-founded concern, especially with you being someone who has been serving. I'm very much planning on not letting the military know about this part of me, which is why I'm asking if my plans on how to deal with the crossdressing part of me sound reasonable in terms of safety. Am I likely to be caught off base on the weekends with the previously mentioned plans? Has anyone else done what I'm talking about or something similar?

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Originally Posted by ak88gurl

I . . . I'm asking if my plans on how to deal with the crossdressing part of me sound reasonable in terms of safety. Am I likely to be caught off base on the weekends with the previously mentioned plans? Has anyone else done what I'm talking about or something similar?

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Ah, I misunderstood. OK, this depends on many factors. Some posts have a higher number of homophobic, transphobic and misogynistic Soldiers than at others, and some career fields tend to attract candidates who are, um, somewhat less enlightened than others.

The Army is a pressure cooker of sexual assault, and don't think that croossdressers do not get assaulted. The percentage of sexual assaults in society at large is between 15 and 20% (18% seems to be the average) whereas the incidence of sexual assault in the military is between 38-48%. This is documented and the DoD knows about it and is trying to address it. Add homophobia / transphobia to the mix and all I can say is you'd better keep your eyes open.

Also, some areas where you might be stationed will be more trans-friendly than others. This will have some impact on your safety while out and about in general, but if you are spotted by a Soldier you know and he snaps a cell phone photo and takes it back to post all bets are off. That's assuming that this is all that happens. The incidence of sexual assault by straight Soldiers against other straight Soldiers (I'm talking about males) is shockingly high. We're talking all the way up to and including rape and gang rape, and again, DoD is aware and is trying to bring that down.

Imagine what will happen if you meet some of THOSE guys! If they won't stop at raping a guy who looks and acts male then you could find yourself in a very dangerous situation.

I do not go out in my military town. I leave town and do all my socializing there. In a couple of months it won't be an issue, but for now I consider myself to have no friends when it comes to this. I have a very close friend whom I am dying to discuss this with, and even he won't know about this until I am a civilian.

Thanks Michelle. That's more the sort of answer I was looking for, and would like to hear more of from other people.

While I think it's unwise on their part, largely for the regulations mentioned, which again I've been aware of, I've spoken with at least two crossdressers online whose units completely know, one of them a Cav Scout who says everyone in his unit up to his Battalion CO knows, and while he has received a fair share of harrassment, no one is trying to kick him out as long as he doesn't take it outside his room on base and changes off base if he has to do it off base. His unit has known for like 3 years, since before DADT was repealed, and he has reenlisted.

Anyway, I have the strongest intentions of taking maximum precautions to try and make sure I'm not found out, but also if someone does snap a photo on the cell phone, is there also anything I can say to make sure I'm not discharged on terms other than honorable? I mean, yeah, so supposing I was seen crossdressing, that doesn't necessitate that I'm a crossdresser much less someone with a "gender identity disorder" does it?

I was the first to weigh in here and am astounded at the level of GOOD advice I have ever read on any thread.
Most of it quoting military regulations.
Weigh these suggestions up, and as you have the mindset that you want to sign up remember the difficulties,
Living off base, friends you TRUST at the weekends, all costly and risky. Your friends are 3/7 days at the best.
During the week in a pub while you are on base. " We know a poof that works on the base with rockets" Someone hears the keywords "poof and rockets".
And then "POOF."
I wish you well and weigh up the advice you have had here tonight London Time.

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Originally Posted by ak88gurl

I mean, I'm not planning on even getting online about it while out on deployment. Are they really going to monitor my internet usage from my laptop that much? When I'm in the privacy of my room back in the States will I be unsafe just posting on forums and sending emails about it?

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i am not in the milatary...and a life time of thank you's to those who have served....

but every line and key stroke you type on any goverment computer, or net work they have even a finger into is copyed....at all times.

it is big brother you know.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ak88gurl

. . . I've spoken with at least two crossdressers online whose units completely know, one of them a Cav Scout who says everyone in his unit up to his Battalion CO knows, and while he has received a fair share of harrassment, no one is trying to kick him out as long as he doesn't take it outside his room on base and changes off base if he has to do it off base. His unit has known for like 3 years, since before DADT was repealed, and he has reenlisted.

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This is troubling, because that CO is simply not doing his job, and that only gives your friend a temporary safe haven. If a future unit commander is the sort who follows the rules then your friend is gone. Just like that. Worse, when they try to figure out why the reenlistment happened then someone else (and perhaps not just the commander) will likely get into trouble for allowing it.

So the problem is that unless you are deep stealth your survival is wholly dependent on either someone not doing their job or someone who decides to take a risk and shield you. That is way too dependent on others' incompetence or their good will, neither of which give you any protection when the spit hits the fan.

Like I said earlier, I weighed all the factors and decided that the Army was not the best place for me, and I really am counseling you to not try and mix your gender expression with military service. I know you're earnestly trying to find a way to make this work, but I really do advise against it.

As an ex navy (NZ) and ex teritorial (Reserve army) I have an isnight into how two branches of the forces in NZ work. Although the current policies speak about acceptance and tolerance with those different from us (or the normal expectation of normal) in reality these views and rules are just there as window dressing. In the real world (in the trenches and in the lowers decks if you dont conform you will be singled out and victimised, humiliated and possibly harmed by the neandertals that are homophobic or affraid of differences. I would suggest keeping this CDing well hidden. Dont tell anyone, even a best mate as the realisation that you are not like them could be a turning point for your friendship (hell families and wifes have a hard enough time dealing with this stuff). As much as it pains me to say so you need to put this facet of your life on hold and repress it. By all means do what you wish in private (I mean off base and away from others other than accepting others - like us here) but keep this part of your life locked away and never become complacent and take any underwear to the base with you. It will be discovered at some stage and then your life will become harder than you can ever believe. I saw first hand how one of the guys I served with in the navy was treated by his best mates when it was discovered he was gay. His friends turned on him worse than his enemies (had to prove they werent like him I guess) and his carreer ended withing a few months and the NZ defence forces had an equal opportunities employment policy at that time (LGBT friendly culture and policies).

Be careful who you tell (I still wonder if my wife will out me in a fit of anger one day, so cant imagine having told someone I was just friends with), keep it hidden and repressed while away (people will notice stuff - BIG BROTHER is always watching ALWAYS!!!). Booze always loosens lips and the wrong people will hear what they shouldnt.

On the flip side the experiences and places I travelled were amazing once you learn to see beauty within all aspects of nature (A desert with moving dunes unmared by tracks or prints is amazing, snow cover can hid the damage of war and soften the egdes of broken buildings, the smiles of children who are still too young to buy into the propagander is priceless).

Just be careful, never complacent, travel with friends, never wander off on your own, watch out for local street vendors hawking their goods (keep some money in your pocket and leave your wallet tucked away inside a money belt against your stomach not in a back pocket), be wary of eating at street vendors, stay away from warm goats (or cows) milk as this is a sure fired way of getting a stomach complaint, drink from cans or bottles you have seen opened (dont put your drink down unless you dont intend to pick it up again), dont have drinks with ice in them (poor quality water supplies - dysentry again...), take a cheap camera with piles of memory cards because later on you memory will fade and no one will see what you have (speaking from experience here, but we didnt have digital cameras in my day), Above all have fun, embrace new cultures and be safe.

I never regret the things I have done just questioned the timing - LOL

PM if you want to chat more.

Regards,

H.

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Originally Posted by Loni

i am not in the milatary...and a life time of thank you's to those who have served....

but every line and key stroke you type on any goverment computer, or net work they have even a finger into is copyed....at all times.

it is big brother you know.

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Excellent point. I was always told it it couldnt be written on a post card and given to everyone of the crew for delivery to the correct recipient then it shouldnt be writen, typed or spoken. Nothing digital ever goes away ever...

Your life belongs to the branch of service you join remember that.They are not understanding about TG issues or what you feel for that matter so keep that in mind.
If you join put your CDing aside while you are in there.They will look thru your mail trust me and if your friend mails you CD items they will see them.
I applaud you for joining I really do and I understand your desire to do so.
For your benefit put your other side on hold for the time being.
My drill Sgt said your heart belongs to your Momma your ass belongs to me and Uncle Sam.

@Tracii G: I'm not going to have crossdressing items mailed to me or brought on or anywhere near base. My plan was to wait until after I've been put at a duty station, find a support group or something, another CD, TG, LGBT individual, after I've been at my duty station for a while, and have my things mailed to THAT person to stay with. On weekends when that person is up for it, I'll go off base to do my thing entirely off base somewhere like an LGBT bar.

And question, am I in danger of being noticed just going on a forum like this using my personal computer in my room if I'm on base? I don't know how internet access works and if I'll be on a network constantly where they can/will see everything I go to.

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Originally Posted by ak88gurl

@Tracii G: I'm not going to have crossdressing items mailed to me or brought on or anywhere near base. My plan was to wait until after I've been put at a duty station, find a support group or something, another CD, TG, LGBT individual, after I've been at my duty station for a while, and have my things mailed to THAT person to stay with. On weekends when that person is up for it, I'll go off base to do my thing entirely off base somewhere like an LGBT bar.

And question, am I in danger of being noticed just going on a forum like this using my personal computer in my room if I'm on base? I don't know how internet access works and if I'll be on a network constantly where they can/will see everything I go to.

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With the internet controls it is likely that unless you have a private line (and even then ???) then you are using their facility and therefore their bandwidth which entitles them to track its usage. Be very careful.

So what if I go use the internet on my laptop somewhere off base? Are they still going to have a way of finding all the sites I went to?

Your plans border on the insane.

If you can't put your crossdressing on hold for your enlistment, DON'T enlist.

S

Look, I will put it on hold if I have to, but excuse me Stephenie while I ask what your military background is and what's insane about my plans? Can you elaborate and add something to the discussion? Or do you feel that acting disgusted with my "insanity" is simply enough?

I don't think you are seeing things 100% rationally. You are joining a very close knit society (not even truly American in a sense, as you forfeit all of your rights to enlist) which views that important part of you as: a weakness, criminal & a mental disease. If you do join, forget about doing anything at all involved with Cding, for the whole time you are in. You life could be at risk if discovered. They just had another Code Red in Afghanistan which had nothing to do with Cding.

Don't believe everything someone, even friends, tells you about what it's like inside. Each persons experience will differ. You are putting way too much trust in things that are never foolproof. People & friends can turn on you. Laptops & E-Mail accounts can be hacked, etc. All your online postings can be traced back to you if someone has the time, resources & desire. In fact, that will possibly be a modern form of McCarthyism in the near future.

The only safe way to do anything that I could see, would be doing something off base while on leave. Again, be super careful. Do not keep or bring on base anything like clothes & pics, mail them home to your family. Do not keep or do anything Cding involved at all with your personal computer or cell phone, as you have zero 4th Amendment rights while serving. Even if you live off base or keep a storage locker, figure they can be searched if they wanted to. If you want to E-Mail, do it off hours/on leave at a public library on their computers. Use a drop E-Mail account set up for that purpose only. Even doing that has some small risk to it. It's a small world, you never know who you will run into later & who will remember you. Don't talk about it to anyone either. Loose lips sinks ships. Focus on serving, saving your pay, and getting out alive & intact. Good luck.

I am a crossdresser in the Army. I have been in the Army for over 7 years, and I have been crossdressing for over 15 years. There are challenges, but if you can go for a year or so without dressing, you should do fine. The hardest part was not dressing when I was in Iraq for 15 months. Luckily, my wife is supportive, so that helps a lot.

The internet will not be a factor unless you are living in the barracks, or using the internet at the office. If you are in either of these locations, CID does, in fact, periodically check the traffic to ensure there is no browsing of things like child pornography and the such, but crossdressing is not really looked for.

As many people know, the Don't Ask Don't Tell policy has ended, so if you are homosexual or bisexual, no one can do anything to you about it. Crossdressing, though, falls under transvesticism under the Uniform Code of Military Justice, or UCMJ. There is no actual law against it, ut there is a regulation that states transvesticism does not meet the Army Standard. No punitive actions can be taken against you for this act, though. The only thing that they could get you for is if you go out dressed as a woman to official events. Yes, you are a soldier 24/7, but MOST commands know that what you do in your spare time is your business. If you shave your entire body, simply tell people you were on a swim team in high school or back home and you have to keep shaving or you break out. It is that simple...or just tell everyone that you hate body hair. If that is good enough for someone like Vin Diesel, it is good enough for everyone else.

I would say DO NOT check any of your crossdressing sites or emails when you are at work. At home, there is nothing they can say, unless you are doing something illegal, like buying/selling drugs, or child pornography.

As far as having a friend of yours mail all your stuff...just take it with you. You will not be searched, and you won't have to explain it to anyone. DON'T take anything to Basic or AIT, but when you get to your first duty station...if it is not overseas...take it with you or have the movers pack it up and move it. The moving company cannot disclose anything that is in the box without being extremely general, like clothing, shoes, papers, books, and they are not military. They are civilian workers for a civilian company who is contracted by the Department of Defense. You don't have to worry about anything when you are moving your stuff. Plus, by taking it with you, you are saving all the money of shipping and postage, you know it won't get lost, and you can file claims against it if anything is damaged by the movers. I have had moving companies move my dresses, wigs, heels, underwear, and everything else overseas twice. Once to Korea, and once to Saudi Arabia. If it can make it through Saudi Arabia, who has the strictest customs department in the world, it can make it anywhere. Deployments are different, though. Everything is searched during a deployment. Don't deploy with anything except maybe a bra, a pair of panties, and maybe a single skirt and blouse. You may have free time with no roommates where you can dress in the privacy of your own room or tent. If you don't want word getting out that you have these things, though...don't take them at all...battle buddies will play pranks by moving all your stuff around and will find them.

With this all being said, by all means, join whichever service you would like. If you have any other additional questions, comments, or concerns, please feel free to look at my profile, and contact me via any of the methods there. If you are contacting me outside of this site, please let me know that you are the crossdresser going into the Army. I have plenty of info and tips, so please don't hesitate to ask.

Trust me if you're CAREFUL you can serve and still enjoy some of your feminine side. I just finished 20yrs acitive duty Air Force.

AK, just because someone didn't serve doesn't mean they can't have a valid point. I think everyone fully understands how well compartmental you plan to keep things. On paper, it sounds pretty well thought out and should work. But then you have real life. Using your laptop off base, not connected to ANY government network should be OK. But your laptop would be on base when you're not using it, correct? If it's there, it can be looked into. Also, take into account crowd mentality. Each guy in your unit, alone, might be OK with it if they found out. But once someone else knows, now they have to distance themselves from it, and that lone figure starts to become a group. They all egg each other on. Knowledge is power, and power can be corrupted. You would be dependent on someone else knowing about you. If there was a falling out between you, or anyone you met at any outside club, they would have some power over you. Hopefully nothing like that would happen, but are you willing to hand over that much potential power of yourself to someone else? No one can answer for you, only you can. It does truly suck that the 2 can't be mixed, but that's life. Along with others that have stated it, I hope you really do think this over long and hard, and all the possible outcomes. I wish you well on your journey, whichever path you do decide to take. You have much more guts than I.

I apologize for a response that really has nothing to contribute but I find this incredibly interesting. As someone who has followed this issue via NPR and the web, I have been waiting for this to present itself in a space that I frequent (although recently I just 'officially' joined the forum... yes a lurker). Having known some military MEN (haughty and rather men's men) who were a bit homophobic and a few who were lovers of TGs (sexy men I might add ;) ) I just find this incredibly interesting because the military (albeit regimented and with a lot of protocol), embodies people who are of all ilks. This of course does not mean that the official p.o.v. is that way and I of course understand that. I guess I just want you all to know that this is an interesting, relevant, modern question that is incredibly relevant to this issue. I apologize for not having anything to contribute but my enthusiasm for the topic.

Kisses,
Sarah

oh, PS: thank you to those who have served and those who are enlisted. May God bless you for your service and sacrifice. (I support the troop and perhaps not the policy)

I served four years in the Army National Guard, and my time is not fully up. Although I am being discharged for being transexual, I am only being discharged upon my own request. For me because I am living in a fairly conservative area and live full time as female, I cannot continue to live in the area as I have exausted and been excluded from most employment opportunities. Now as far as regulations go I should be removed from duty, but my chain of command as it turns out valued me as a soldier enough to try and keep me in.

There are some things to look out for though.
Crossdressing is against regulations and is deemed "conduct unbecoming." For doing so you can be discharged less than honorably.
Watch out for being to open about it. I was foolish. My whole unit knows now. I got lucky because people already liked me. And it didn't affect me much. Also some of the stigmas about crossdressing verses haveing diagnosable GID may differ. Though I am not sure about that either.
Also I would personally advise against joining active duty as you never know who you will run into off duty. Even as national guard, I have run into other soldiers out and about. And only one or two of them that I know live in my city.
I also would refrain from using military systems to contact other crossdressers about crossdressing. You never know who is watching. Before I came out to my commander, he already knew I was transexual because he had found a video of me online. So even using civilian systems can be risky.

I have never been careful and it has cost me a deployment which would have provided my transition in full.

I hope this has helped. :)

Thanks for all your responses.

@Sarah: Expression of enthusiasm and interest for the subject is fine too, maybe even helps get more discussion. I just don't want to look at another 2007 Democracy Now video about going into Iran (not even going to begin to discuss that on here) or anything similar as an argument for why I shouldn't go in the military.

@Teagan: I'm so sorry to hear about the deployment and being found out but I'm glad to hear that your CoC still valued you some as a soldier. I would assume that means they're not giving you a dishonorable discharge but maybe a medical or something.

@Kelly: I appreciate your concern and don't totally mind people who haven't served giving input. But if all someone can tell me is I'm "insane," or oil wars blah blah, the war is horrible etc. everyone is entitled to their opinion but those things don't contribute anything to the actual conversation I'm trying to have. Not interested in how anyone feels about our involvement in any war or personal opinions of my mental state, but Kelly, your post is relevant and I do want to be careful about trusting people. As far as my "openness" I told a few family members one at a time and people from my college fraternity one at a time, who are not only like family but unlike many in the military are all pretty open, and also discrete and intelligent people (openness be damned, I don't tell anyone if I have even a suspicion they might open their mouths about it and let it slip). Few people mentioned things like getting a security clearance with a crossdressing background, but I actually already have the secret security clearance and I don't have an out in the open crossdressing background (just a circle of friends who know). I wasn't sure however how much they could monitor my internet usage on my laptop if I'm living on base, but was trying to find out about that and now having been told I'll simply take anything CDing related to internet usage off base and not on military networks.

@McKailah: Awesome response. I'd imagine having a supportive wife and living off base probably helps a lot with this. I'm single so, no such luck for me unfortunately. Also, going in as an E4 (got my bachelors) I'll probably be living in the barracks a while, which was why my plans was to have the stuff mailed, and not to me but to someone supportive I'd eventually find living well off base (like someone from a TG support group or something) if I'm at a station long enough to worry about it. Also, taking stuff on a deployment is definitely not something I'm going to try. At one point in my life when I was trying to "quit" I went two and half years without dressing. It's not a period I would I would like to go for now if I can help it, but if I need to I feel confident that I can. I'll handle the year long deployments fine, especially as I'll be busy doing the military stuff, which may suck at times but is something I will embrace because it's like a part of me as well. I've actually done periods of military training of a couple weeks while I was in ROTC of up to 4 weeks, much shorter than any OSUT but what I can say about it is I couldn't get enough training and enjoyed it and/or was challenged enough that I didn't really think about CDing.

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Originally Posted by TVKellyNY

AK, just because someone didn't serve doesn't mean they can't have a valid point. I think everyone fully understands how well compartmental you plan to keep things. On paper, it sounds pretty well thought out and should work. But then you have real life. Using your laptop off base, not connected to ANY government network should be OK. But your laptop would be on base when you're not using it, correct? If it's there, it can be looked into. Also, take into account crowd mentality. Each guy in your unit, alone, might be OK with it if they found out. But once someone else knows, now they have to distance themselves from it, and that lone figure starts to become a group. They all egg each other on. Knowledge is power, and power can be corrupted. You would be dependent on someone else knowing about you. If there was a falling out between you, or anyone you met at any outside club, they would have some power over you. Hopefully nothing like that would happen, but are you willing to hand over that much potential power of yourself to someone else? No one can answer for you, only you can. It does truly suck that the 2 can't be mixed, but that's life. Along with others that have stated it, I hope you really do think this over long and hard, and all the possible outcomes. I wish you well on your journey, whichever path you do decide to take. You have much more guts than I.

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TVKellyNY,

Actually, those who haven't served, or who know not how the Military works, should not offer advice on how to do things on or off post regarding this issue. People who serve still have their rights. Illegal search and seizure still apply, so nothing is going to be searched or looked into unless you are going on a deployment. When you are entering the gates at a post, if you have a military ID, you just go through. The guards look at your ID, look to make sure there aren't any other people in your vehicle (by looking through the window) and send you on your way. I don't know what the big deal is with the internet situation either. As long as you aren't using the government network, which is ONLY located in your office, you are good. The only things you have to make sure you don't view on post is child pornography and other illegal stuff like that. A laptop cannot be looked into just because it is on post. CID has to have reasonable evidence to seize your computer and look into it. They can monitor traffic, but they are only looking for illegal activity. They could care less about anything else.

I have been outed through Facebook to my Commander. It was a few weeks ago. It was initially embarrassing, but legally, there is nothing they can do about it. The only way you will get into trouble in the military for crossdressing is if your roommate finds out, asks you not to do it around him, and you do it anyway, OR if you attend an official function dressed up.

Other than that...join, and have fun being yourself.

I enjoyed my service time during the 70's, but had to lie about being a cd'er when I first enlisted. I think the question was "do you wear womens cloths" or something to that effect. I think the consensus is that the military is not as uniform as we always think it is and that you may never be found out or you may be found out and the local command may not care or you may be found out and they will care, worse case senario.

With all your best laid plans, it's still going to be a risk. If you get a secret clearance, the FBI will be around asking some of your family and friends about you. They may or may not ask about cd'ing specificly, but who knows what your friends may volunteer. The odds are you will be OK, but it's up to you to take that risk.

I think if I were to do it over again, I might would serve as a DoD civilian employee instead. That way you can still serve your country without all the rigamoroles of military life, get better pay and still enjoy the benifits of seeing the world on the governments dime.

I didn't catch what MOS you are going in for, but let me offer some insight from what I know. I spent a little over 4 years as an enlisted Infantryman, went to OCS and became a Signal Corps officer. I didn't buy my first skirt until I was in OCS, but I did have a lot of TS/TG pictures on my computer. One day my roomate let someone else use my computer and my stash was found. Other than a whole lot of teasing - seemed that the entire company knew about it, nothing was said - and I was selected for OCS by the commanding general of the division at the recommendation of all my commanders from the brigade on down. Infantrymen are known for having odd fetishes anyway, so I just blended in. Depending on where you go, your chances of being able to dress in your home are slim - most likely you'll live in the barracks. That said, the new barracks tend to have separate private bedrooms with a shared bathroom/kitchen area. You're biggest problem will be the unannounced room inspection or health and welfare inspection. You might be better off storing your clothes in your vehicle. Rarely will there be a vehicle inspection - something really bad has to happen like a lost sensitive item (think rifle, night vision device) or someone has a gun or drugs in their room. I never had a vehicle search when I was enlisted and had 2 as an officer. When you go through the gate, they generally don't open bags - never have had them ask to see inside one of mine. As far as the computer network, most of what people have posted is wrong. CID doesn't monitor any network. The Army is behind a firewall and web filters. If you try to go to a site it doesn't like while at work, it won't let you. Sometimes they haven't found all the sites; took them 3 months to lock out BME. Your best bet is to keep it professional at work. Your barracks internet is paid for by you through a commercial provider. There are no filters and no one is sniffing it, other than maybe the ISP. You can do anything that is legal on that network. The same basic rules apply while deployed. The work network is more heavily filtered, depending on who runs it, but this is mostly for bandwidth reasons. I know of a guy who was googling all sorts of porn sites - he had an open line, which should tell you how high up he was. When found out, all that happened to him was getting fired and sent to a new job. Not the greatest thing for a career - officers getting fired generally means that your not getting promoted anytime soon. The commercial network that you pay for is yours to do with what you will, subject to the rules of the ISP and General Order 1A, which prohibits porn anyway. I have been involved in investigations of soldiers for extremist activity and child porn on their personal laptops. No one has ever come to me and asked me to look for evidence of crossdressing, or anything else because there's nothing they can do about it. Trust me, the 1SG is really who you want to be most concerned about, and they generally have more than enough to keep them busy with real problem soldiers. That said, don't give them a reason to examine you from a bad perspective - good advice for CDers and everyone else. As long as you have thick skin, you'll be fine.

As far as a security clearance, I have a Top Secret/Secure Compartmentalized Information (TS/SCI). The only questions the investigator asks are very general - have you any knowledge of dishonest acts - theft, etc; do you know of any reason why this person shouldn't have a clearance; does this person drink a lot? They are looking for issues that would cause concern for your level of responsibility. Being enlisted, your chances of requiring a TS/SCI are low unless you go into intelligence. Later, if you go into special forces, civil affairs, or psychological operations, then you'll need one. To get a Secret clearance, they simply do a records check. If you haven't been arrested and don't have a lot of speeding tickets, you'll have no issues.

The Army can be a great life. It's what you make of it. Do your job to the best of your ability, don't create headaches for your superiors, know your place (very important), and finally, don't act high and mighty because of a college degree. Very few people will be impressed - remember, 2LTs have them as well. I walked into my company as a SPC and was chipping tile from under the urinal on my second day. Seize the opportunities that get presented. Once I finish vet school, my plan is to go back in. One day you may walk into a clinic and meet a veterinarian who has pierced ears, likes to wear skirts and Mary Janes, and has a Y chromosome.

Thanks Angie. Really informative response there. I'm still pretty much decided for the moment that I won't even have clothing on base, the internet monitoring was what I was most concerned about. I have to go in active at needs of the army, so the way things are right now, even with the very high ASVAB scores I have, I might not get the greatest MOS, but I have been interested actually in special operations having known a few people in SF, CA, and Psyop. What I really want more than anything is to get into SIGINT (either be a 35N or 35P) and try and eventually get assigned to a SOT-A. Before that I was seriously considering 18X, but as someone with a very analytical mindset I feel I would be really good at something like SIGINT.

Short of those, it all depends what's available, but even with the limits to choices that I'll have the way things are I'm confident I'll find something that works alright by me. I'm not going to go in thinking I'm anything special cause of the bachelors degree either.

Be aware of the times you are dressed in the privacy of your own room (BOQ) Bachelor Officer Quarters, and someone calls you with an emergency in your unit that you need to take care of immediately. Running out the door with make up on. try explaining. As it has been stated the military owns you 24/7. Exception is when on leave (subject to military needs). Becareful. Good Luck.

I think you'll find plenty of kindred souls in intel- just be sure it's they would are the first to reveal and you know them and their associates very, very, very well. Don't dress anywhere near post and never, ever even consider it when you are deployed. Stateside it's not a big deal so long as you aren't are on post/base and don't get stopped, etc. On the other hand, this will be one of those things that you are stressed over. I'm guessing you're also somewhat open minded in your other attitudes and pursuits- be prepared for a shock... I was both enlisted and commissioned and astounded how attitudes of bigotry, prejudice and intolerance have crept back into the military since 9/11. It's not the same was it was and not in a good way so please, don't do anything with CD until you are through secondary training and at your first assignment and never when deployed. Other than that- the military is a great career so long as you understand the system enjoy it. Do try to get your masters, etc while in. Even though it's difficult with the time and other constraints, being ready for transition out is important at all times especially during reductions and if you CD.

High ASVAB, bachelors degree and the recruiter is telling you needs of the Army - might want to see if you can find another recruiter. Actually, when you get to MEPS, talk to the career counselor. Before deciding on a job other than 11B, 19K, 19D, or 13B - i.e. a combat arms position, make sure you talk to someone in that position who has no vested interest in getting you into the Army. We had a really smart guy who would have made a great 13F - forward observer for artillery, but the recruiter described the 13D job in such a way that it sounded the same. In reality, the 13D sits behind a computer or plays with maps. If you have any questions, I have intimate knowledge of the following MOSs in a line unit: 11B, 11C, 92Y, 92G, 13B, 13D, 13F, 13S, 13R, 13W, 25B, 25C, 25S, 25Q, 25L, 25N, 25U, 91W, and 91T. I can tell you the good and bad of both. If I had to choose an enlisted job, it would be 11B or one of the 25 series (Signal). If you like animals and being Hooah isn't for you, the 91T is a great choice.

Also, as far as having to run out the door to respond to something - it doesn't happen unless you are deployed. I agree that I probably wouldn't dress around any installation. I don't even wear earrings within a few miles of the base, nor in areas of heavy military people.

Dear ak88,

I did serve many years ago.

I did NOT call you insane. I said that what you are planning BORDERS on the insane. You are planning to keep your crossdressing a secret from the military. Good luck with that.

I stand by what I said. If you CANNOT put your crossdressing on hold, stay out of the military.

That's a really simple straightforward bit of advice. Heed it or not. It's up to you. I assumed that you were asking for other people's opinions when you brought your question here. I gave you mine.

S

Frankly I find it absolutely disgusting that a force that "fights for freedom" actually asks applicants if they cross dress. What the hell is that all about?

DADT repeal should also cover CDs. Why you ask? Because much of the bigotry and hatred we face IS based on homophobia. It is usually a homophobic reaction that people get when they encounter those of our ilk. What is my mom's thought when she sees my heels after snooping through my closet without my knowledge? "Why are you dressing like a woman? Are you trying to attract men?"

It is something that stems from the hatred of Gays. I find it very very ironic how the United States Military forces excercise those behaviors that they supposedly fighting against in other people's countries.

Sorry Alexis, I have to agree with Stephanie S. I've never had anything to do with the military, I don't even live in the same country as you, but even I can see that making a legal declaration that you don't CD, when you have been doing so for some time (and have every intention of continuing to do so), is a potential recipe for disaster. If your military are anything like ours then you could very quickly find out just how unforgiving they can be about blatant lies like that.

Have a good think about it. Make your mind up.
Then think about it some more, including the bad bits (that you don't want to think about / don't believe can happen) this time.
Then make your choice: Crossdressing OR enlisting.

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Originally Posted by ak88gurl

So what if I go use the internet on my laptop somewhere off base? Are they still going to have a way of finding all the sites I went to?

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To Whom It May Concern (Some very caring personal advice: Please feel you make take it, or leave it?)

I feel obligated to a "sister" to give you fair warning, AK88: "You have been advised, very, very wisely by everyone here, so far, but have seen fit to 'do it your way regardless of the potentially 'dire' future consequences starring you in the face for your DLO (military talk for Desired Learning Outcome)?' “ For that I wish you all the luck in the world, because you are certainly going to need it, young lady, if you persist in this wish to CD while on active duty in the service of your country (BTW I salute you :thumbsup: and applaud that very action enthusiastically, as I have done exactly the same as a combat pilot in Viet Nam, having served honorably and with distinction). My qualification here? My own rule was: “Never do anything ‘irresponsibly that can result in dire consequences to one’s well-being’; and that means, doing “IT” within one (1) hour of your home base.” For me that meant 500 miles (@500 MPH, you see? And, I am still batting 1.000 to this day. Hoorah!). :devil:

FYI I have one more qualifying credential to present to you in order to make my point to you "Perfectly Clear!” :straightface: I also have an extensive background in security, “privacy,” and all related matters thereto. and you are totally "naive" in such matters, so beware lest the snake bite? For starters, I would advise you to simply start with a Google Search: "NSA Whistleblowers Fort Gordon, GA". Afterwards, then proceed with extreme caution as you are about to embark on what I personally feel is a suicidal mission, dear one, as you will be judged with "Extreme Prejudice Once in the Breach!" Just remember, "You cannot do an ALT|CTRL|DEL, (computereze: three-finger salute) simply to re-start the game anew where you are about to go? Your very future depends purely on your choices here and now. So act accordingly. Period.

There are tons more, of course, but here's just a "couple of responses off the top" (13,700 Results in 0.21 seconds) you'll get from that Google search, et al.:

In an ABC News broadcast (09/09/09), NSA's Ears Wide Open Brian Ross reveals what the government heard on wiretaps. (http://abcnews.go.com/video/playerIndex?id=6000186)

New NSA Whistleblowers Say NSA Spied on US Service Members and Aid Workers by Hugh D'Andrade, October 10, 2008 Electronic Frontier Foundation (https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2008/1...whistleblowers)

Finally, Whistleblowers Report from the Inside on the NSA Program by Shayana Kadidal, Senior managing attorney at the Center for Constitutional Rights, October 9, 2008 (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/shayan..._b_133457.html)

Including, and, as mentioned earlier, Bradley Manning had and his alter-ego 'Breanna': Investigators reveal strange mind of soldier behind Wikileaks scandal. Read more: (http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...#ixzz1hfzevFM3)

And, regardless of how (any)one feels about "Privacy, etc.", "The Beat Goes On, and On, and On, and..." :Angry3: Always remember this: “Big Brother is indeed watching… You, and You, and You, and…” Best of Luck, always,

L&R
M.

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Originally Posted by Pythos

Frankly I find it absolutely disgusting that a force that "fights for freedom" actually asks applicants if they cross dress. What the hell is that all about?

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I find it disgusting that someone would spread lies. Never have I, nor any other soldier I know been asked about cross dressing at enlistment. I have a 50-something page application for the Army Medical Department and there is no mention of cross dressing. They want to know if you have loyalties outside of the US, have even been arrested, or have ever plotted to over throw the US government by violent means. Perhaps you are projecting your issues with your mother upon the US Army. If you would read my rather lengthy post above, you will find that I had several items that one wouldn't expect to find in the closet of an Infantryman, and definitely some pictures that might cause the uninformed to think I was gay on my computer, but nothing was illegal. The old phrase was "Statement, act, or marriage" as far as determining homosexuality. You could be as gay as you wanted to be, but you could not tell anyone, have homosexual intercourse, or marry or attempt to marry someone of the same sex. If none of those conditions were met, no one could touch you, we didn't care. Obviously, you've been listening to too much anti-military propaganda, rather than talking to the actual people who live it daily. You're stuck in 1999.

Ok, am I the only one that can ask the obvious before this kid puts her/him self in potential harms way? Alexis, what does your Gender Therapist say about you pursuing active duty? Reading your posts here, you seem to have already made up your mind that you are going to do this while you are going to pursue crossdressing in your spare time at home, and when and where you can you will use the internet to check in on TG websites to keep up on the community and your friends. You also seem to have all the answers for yourself, as you have posted a comeback to every single person here that has posted anything that advises you against this. So here...I will refer back to my previous question, and ad to it ARE YOU INSANE?????

You really need to seek a professional 3rd party. It's clear to me here, just through reading your posts, that your ability to keep this a secret will not be very well put. Let me fill you in on something here. I live full time, and every day I come across someone I know out of the corner of my eye. In the back of my head every where I go is, when will someone decide to take there bad day out on me? Here is another reality. Although a majority of military members are good loving people that are just trying to do there duty, there is a faction represented by the same percentage as civilian population that are not. I think we could all agree there is a "type" that is drawn to military or law enforcement that are inclined to not be very trans friendly. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE read the TDOR list from last year. When people are outed, people die. Some people are outed despite taking extreme measures not to be.

Your a kid...put your real thinking cap on here. Get a third party therapist involved, and really do a thorough self evaluation before you make a commitment that could end up damaging you for life.

Ok, am I the only one that can ask the obvious before this kid puts her/him self in potential harms way? Alexis, what does your Gender Therapist say about you pursuing active duty? Reading your posts here, you seem to have already made up your mind that you are going to do this while you are going to pursue crossdressing in your spare time at home, and when and where you can you will use the internet to check in on TG websites to keep up on the community and your friends. You also seem to have all the answers for yourself, as you have posted a comeback to every single person here that has posted anything that advises you against this. So here...I will refer back to my previous question, and ad to it ARE YOU INSANE?????

You really need to seek a professional 3rd party. It's clear to me here, just through reading your posts, that your ability to keep this a secret will not be very well put. Let me fill you in on something here. I live full time, and every day I come across someone I know out of the corner of my eye. In the back of my head every where I go is, when will someone decide to take their bad day out on me? Here is another reality. Although a majority of military members are good loving people that are just trying to do there duty, there is a faction represented by the same percentage as civilian population that are not. In the military these types of people have a on documented license to act out their bigotries. I think we could all agree there is a "type" that is drawn to military or law enforcement that are inclined to not be very trans friendly. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE read the TDOR list from last year. When people are outed, people die. Some people are outed despite taking extreme measures not to be.

Your a kid...put your real thinking cap on here. Get a third party therapist involved, and really do a thorough self evaluation before you make a commitment that could end up damaging you for life.

OK, so let's just take a chill pill and think on it for a second.
I am astounded by some of the awesome advice and information that was offered.

TG's are NOT covered under the new change in regs regarding homosexuals being allowed to serve now. I doubt that your average soldier realizes that though. The vast majority of people lump us all together LGBT, and right or wrong, most who might stumble on to you are going to think "Oh he's gay and that's allowed now."
Security clearance - that does have the potential to be a significant problem for you. When I was in the Army and worked on a nuclear missile with a top secret clearance, it was before the internet became a household thing. I have NO idea what they might be able to discover about you through the internet. For example, I have no idea if they have some way to find your account here if you dont volunteer the information to them. Honestly I doubt very much that they can, at least not without a great deal of effort that I find it hard to imagine them going through without a compelling reason to do so. I also have the worry in the back of my head as to what some of your former ROTC peers might say if and when they are interviewed as part of a security clearance background investigation. Are they going to feel obligated to share that information with the investigator? Are some of them active duty now, and might they not feel compelled by their own ethics and oath to tell this to an investigator?
A couple of people have told you to only share this with your most trusted friends and I'd like to respectfully disagree with that advice. Tell freaking NO ONE, not under any circumstances, and not for any freaking reason. TELL NO ONE who is in any way, shape, or form associated with your career in the Army about this. EVER.
Would they actually prosecute you if they caught you later? I doubt it, because they really don't like that kind of publicity. To the best of my knowledge, they have never prosecuted anyone for this, though I'd bet quite a few have been quietly separated from the service for it. It wouldn't surprise me if some of those that were separated were threatened with legal action if they tried to fight the separation, but I can't recall ever hearing of anyone that was actually prosecuted for being gay or TG. So - thrown out of the Army - entirely possible. Sent to prison - highly unlikely.
Can you get away with going out to "friendly" clubs while on active duty - you betcha. I have shaken the hand of quite a few that came down to Austin from Ft Hood on weekends.
Internet usage and privacy - I should imagine that anyone using the internet these days knows that any company (this of course includes the US Military) can monitor your internet usage while using either their computers or their network. What you do from your own PC at home should be reasonably private though. Of course no one is safe if Uncle Sam has a really good reason to start looking in to your activities, but your average soldier does not really need to worry about Uncle Sam monitoring their internet activities while on their personal PC and using their own service provider.

Can you get away with it? Probably, IF you keep your mouth shut and dont tell anyone and IF your old ROTC peers don't volunteer the info should they be interviewed as part of a background investigation for a clearance.
Can you get caught? Sure! If your dumb enough to use their PC's and networks to visit sites like this, or to send and receive emails, or if you're stupid enough to let someone know about this or catch you cross dressing. I'd still think that the worst case scenario would just have you separated from the service and right back to where you are now, so what is the real risk?

I know it's all kind of a mixed message, so where does this leave you? Damned if I know! As far as I can tell it is now up to you to decide if you want a career, or at least a term in the military bad enough to risk it. Personally I've never been prouder of anything that I have done in my life than of my Army service.

Angie CD, i was able to find the post. yes I misread. It is IF they ask you that question. I still find it odd that you cannot excersise an activity that for all intents and purposes harms no one in a force that protects us from other forces that would kill people like us.

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Originally Posted by Michelle.M

I am active duty Army and have decided to retire to enable my transition. Believe me when I tell you there are 3 things you must know -

1. AR40-501 (STANDARDS OF MEDICAL FITNESS) specifically prohibits your enlistment (Para 2-27 n. page 15) or retention (Para 3-35, page 33) if you are a cross dresser or transsexual. Download the reg here: http://www.apd.army.mil/pdffiles/r40_501.pdf

2. This is not to say that there are no cross dressers in the military, but if they ask you when you enlist if you are a cross dresser and you say No you'll get in, but if your dressing comes to light you could never tell them you were doing this before you joined or not only will you be discharged under Para 3-35 you may also find yourself prosecuted for a fraudulent enlistment. And if you enlisted or later reenlisted in a program that gave you a monetary bonus you'll be required to pay this back. An ROTC contracted cadet (which you are not) may be required to pay the cost of the college classes they'd received (I have actually seen ROTC frauds prosecuted this way). You had better stay in DEEP STEALTH if you join.

3. The repeal of Don't Ask Don't Tell does nothing for us. DADT dealt with sexual orientation, NOT gender identity or gender expression. AR 40-501 is still in effect. In fact, if you do a web search for DADT Repeal FAQ you'll find that very topic specifically addressed.

Sorry, but this is the reality as of today. Maybe it will change before too long, but don't hold your breath.

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