Debating.....now or later.

A couple of months ago i came out to a potential love interest with unfavorable results.
Her initial feelings were of excitement and support and went down hill from there.
I told her of all the research, finding out all about myself on the forums and reading literature.
2 days later i find out she went ahead and told her entire family and they gave her their version.......straight from the wonderful world of daytime talk shows.
She told me that i went online cause i was confused about my sexuality and would eventually "go gay" (yeah, i kid you not) and change my sex. I explained everything carefully and she just could not see the person i was the first 2 weeks.

Because i could see some other isues with her, i ended it.

Fast forward to today. I began dating a gal i met on a internet dating site and she's a real sweetheart, and we've been seeing each other for a few weeks.

The writing is on the wall i'm afraid. She's made several comments about my appearance in general. So far she's brought up my plucked, shaped and lightly darkened eyebrows, the long, well kept, and lightly polished fingernails.

She also said that she once dated a guy who she found out was a, gasp....."crossdresser". She wasn't overly mean about it, just said she got tired of him wearing her clothes.
Last night she felt about on my upper arms and inside my shirt and commented on the lack of hair.

The vibe thus far is leaning towards unfavorable, and i've been honest and up front without giving away too much info.
Nothing in what she has said thus far leads me to believe she's making any assumptions about me, the comments about the cd in her past were definitely not made for my sake.
I did make a couple of comments about gender stereotyping in regards to other matters.
I said something to the effect that i don't follow a rigid belief in gender roles.

My plan being to allow the relationship to build, for her to see that i'm just a kind and considerate person, a good guy who is just well groomed, before full disclosure.

We have a long day together planned for tomorrow that includes some driving so there'll be plenty of time for conversation.

My debate is in going ahead and having 'the' talk. Or at least in laying it out that i like the way i look and it feels right to me, and that i hope she see's the need for people to feel good about themselves.

Or of course, i could just go right to the nitty gritty of it. Part of this holding off has been for her sake, she's had a pretty rough go of it in life and i'm not looking forward to what could happen.

Anywho, sorry for the long post.
Not really sure if i need advice good folks, i've been round the boards long enough to have read it all, but if you have something of interest to share then feel free.

Maybe i just needed to vent a wee bit.

It's really too bad that so many people learn all they need to know about transgenderism on Jerry Springer.

Most surely is Celeste, especially when you sit right there and calmly and intelligently inform them you've read the opinions of therapists and counselors and thousands of 'actual TG/CDs'.

Ignorance is usually only blissful for those who don't get it,
those of us who do understand feel something much more powerful than bliss. :facepalm::hmph::notlistening::Pullhair::wall:

Any woman should be happy with a CDer. We have many more endearing qualities than most men and can be more in touch with our emotions. Maybe I feel this way because of what I have going on but I do believe in what I just said.

I don't see this relationship going downhill fast. I would like to be more positive but given the vibe from what she has said I think you are already down the hill and on the straight. But all the luck in the world.

I think that the two of you should sit down somewhere neutral, and have the talk.
I would start off with the fact that the two of you have come this far, and before it goes further,
you need to be honest with her. Tell her why you like to Cross Dress, and the fact that you are
no "Gay" or want to change your sex.
Being honest will not hurt anyone at this still early stage of the relationship, but could be a real
"Pane" later on. I hope the best for you, and let us know how it turns out.

As a side note; I told my now Wife on the third date, 12 months later we where Married, now
for 18+ years, and she is totally OK with my dressing.
Rader

Thanx Rader, i have always enjoyed reading from those with super supportive SOs, it does give me hope.

Have the talk. Putting it off would only cause greater problems down th road. Be open, honest and give her some material to read and digest that explains who and where you are. If she accepts the material and reads it, then your on the right track. If she blatenly refuses to your relationship is toast.

Hi Cassandrea, I have a feeling that this one isn't going to end well either.

I think it's time to tell her everything too, since she has already made several observations.

If you start the conversation then you can direct the flow of information. She may be operating under some false assumptions, especially if her past CDing boyfriend abused her trust or violated her boundaries.

She needs to know that just because someone engages in cross-gender expression does not mean they will take advantage of someone else, and when two people are in a caring relationship, the rules of engagement can be negotiated without either partner needing to fundamentally alter who they are.

And if after your talk she is not willing to take it any further, then it is best that you know this sooner than later, IMO.

Good luck! :)

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Originally Posted by ReineD

She needs to know that just because someone engages in cross-gender expression does not mean they will take advantage of someone else, and when two people are in a caring relationship, the rules of engagement can be negotiated without either partner needing to fundamentally alter who they are.

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Thanx Reine, good stuff as per usual. This comment in particular says what i feel.

I would discuss your proposed interaction and see if her views can be tempered a little.
Work at it, and if it is negative all the time you may have to go separate ways.

A year ago I was dating a pretty girl, but didn't feel we had a future. So, thot I'd mention my hobby and see if that changed things. All evening, she kept saying, "I don't know what to say". That was the last time I saw her.

If you're not crazy about her, u may have nothing to lose by telling her.

Tell her you don't need HER clothes,you have your own..The faster you have the talk,the better...so you can move on!

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Originally Posted by rogina garter

Tell her you don't need HER clothes,you have your own..The faster you have the talk,the better...so you can move on!

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That's about what I would say. "Well, the good news is, I don't need to wear your dresses, I have my own."

But realistically, from what you have described, in particular, your own feelings for her ( or lack thereof ) I would just end it.

That's just my opinion.

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Originally Posted by rogina garter

Tell her you don't need HER clothes,you have your own..The faster you have the talk,the better...so you can move on!

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Also might add that you are willing to let her wear your clothes, if she takes care of them :-)

MsMJ. You have a variety of opinions, and this is mine. Now is the time to be honest. She has taken an interest in you and noticed several things about you. She is interested. You will sense when the moment is right to do this, but I do feel it is the right thing to do for her sake, as well as yours. You seem to have a lot going for you, if she sees that, all the better.

Barbara

You seem to be doing well with letting her know how you feel a little at a time. If a good opportunity in a conversation opens up I would go for it then. If not, then yeah, in the near term it is probably a good idea to have the talk. Good luck!

Have THE talk and get it all in the open.Best to find out now than down the road where she feels deceived.

I read your thread and then all the replies and then reread your thread. Nothing I read changed my initial opinion of you are wasting your time. My initial thought was that she suspects someone and is giving you all kinds of hints and signals because she thinks that if you change there could be a chance of having a long term relationship. We all know that you won't change and I don't think that she will change either. Tell her soon and find out what her feelings are and quit guessing.

I had an injury and feared that it was serious but was afraid of going to the doctor for fear that he would confirm that my injury was truly serious. I finally got the courage to visit the doctor and upon examing me he told me........................

Isn't it odd, that she has been drawn to two crossdressers? Maybe she unconsciously is attracted to some underlying quality or qualities she's found in her crossdressing beaus. Have the talk, get it out on the table. It sounds like she's is suspecting anyways.

Life just keeps getting too lifey for me. Seems the last 4 yrs of my life has been one thing after another.

Well our nice day out, up in the mountains ended badly.
We had a car accident but luckily we're both ok, and considering the narrow dangerous section of road, we were very lucky.

Anyways, enough about that.

We we're both kinda down until later in the evening at her house and one thing led to another and she insisted i stay the night.
The serious and traumatic events of the day must have been part of the mix but we moved past some areas that were bogging me down.

We spent the morning having coffee and clipping coupons. She slid a 3 bucks off Covergirl one over to me and asked if i'd use it. I assured her i would and she just grinned.
A while later she was redoing her nails (she does the Kiss glue-ons) and asked about mine, i told her what all i do and it lead to longer talk.

She started by asking me more about my brows, she assumed i just used the brow liner pencils, so when i told her that i plucked and shaped them she was surprised (i thought that odd cuz i get looks all the time from how thin they are for a guy).

She asked about what all kind of comments i've gotten...from family, or anyone.

She even went as far as to ask me to work on her brows, and maybe we'd do each others toes. I was expecting it to bring up the more obvious question, but it didn't.


Her accepting my more feminine grooming traits is great, but it is also nowhere near full disclosure and i wonder if she just can't fathom the idea of me crossdressing.

For now tho, i'm gonna stand by my decision to allow the relationship to grow, at least just a little longer.
And yeah, trust me good people i know that it can make things harder too.

Acceptance of femmy grooming traits is a heck of a good sign.
And...you got a great coupon.
I hope it works out well.

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Originally Posted by MsMjSerene

She told me that i went online cause i was confused about my sexuality and would eventually "go gay" (yeah, i kid you not) and change my sex.

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That's totally unfair. If she got on this forum she would know that only 60% of CDs get with guys, and only about 5% end up changing their sex :D

I am sorry for your car accident but was glad to hear you are both OK. Best wishes on the relationship. By the way would you help me with my eyebrows? (kidding)

I think its ok to keep dating her for a while before you make a full disclosure. She's picking up some cues and probably won't be totally surprised when you give her the whole story. And I do think that its important for her to see the whole of you before she gets fixated on one aspect.

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Originally Posted by kimdl93

And I do think that its important for her to see the whole of you before she gets fixated on one aspect.

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Thanx Kim, this is exactly why i was so upset with the first gal, she had time to see me for me but her family did not and went the wrong way at warp speed.
And their bad influence on her because of it, dug us too deep a hole to come out of.

This gal has seen me in my better male traits (yeah, there are actually a couple), i was there to be strong and comfort her on saturday when she fell apart (she was driving) after the crash.
She has seen pictures of me out in the field doing that hunting thing and we both share a passion for being outdoors, so she knows i have a masculine side, just not one of those sickening macho idiot sides.

I got a funny text a little bit ago, she asked me..... "why r u you?"
I sent back..... "tis magic, maybe soon ill tell ya bout it"
Her reply was just a smiley face.

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Originally Posted by MsMjSerene

Thanx Kim, this is exactly why i was so upset with the first gal, she had time to see me for me but her family did not and went the wrong way at warp speed.
And their bad influence on her because of it, dug us too deep a hole to come out of.

This gal has seen me in my better male traits (yeah, there are actually a couple), i was there to be strong and comfort her on saturday when she fell apart (she was driving) after the crash.
She has seen pictures of me out in the field doing that hunting thing and we both share a passion for being outdoors, so she knows i have a masculine side, just not one of those sickening macho idiot sides.

I got a funny text a little bit ago, she asked me..... "why r u you?"
I sent back..... "tis magic, maybe soon ill tell ya bout it"
Her reply was just a smiley face.

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This sounds a bit like my GF and I. Though in her case, it mattered more to her that I wasn't scared off by her intelect. ( Fat chance! That's one of her best points! )

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Originally Posted by UNDERDRESSER

This sounds a bit like my GF and I. Though in her case, it mattered more to her that I wasn't scared off by her intellect. ( Fat chance! That's one of her best points! )

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I hear ya there dresser, nothing sexier on a woman than a nicely developed intellect, in fact my personal belief is that the smarter the GG the more inclined she is to be accepting/supporting. Afterall, it takes intelligence to see past the artificialities of the binary gender belief.

My girlfriend was raised up in the world of professional dance (irish step, she once toured with the Lord of the Dance and danced with Michael Flately himself), and i think that kind of life opens the mind much moreso than a lady who grew up out on the farm.

Oh and hello out there Teri in Idaho.

Sounds somewhat promising. If you want another way to see what her views are, can Holloween help? Keep us posted with whatever you wish to share and I hope things only get better. The big question is when and only you can get a feel for that.

It sounds like things are moving in the right direction. By that I mean the relationship is being built on honesty and trust. As with so many other threads like this my only additional counsel is to be patient and let her unwrap this puzzle at a speed that is comfortable for her. That is just a necessary level of respect for her at this stage. Just match it with open honesty and see what develops. Best to you both.

Well 2 plus weeks later and wow, how things have progressed and all for the better.

Our feelings for each other have grown stronger, and i'm now officially out.......yipppeeeee!

And she's totally on board, i guess my early radar readings were wonky. I pretty much told all there is.
I called myself gender variant, that i have felt these gender differences since i was 5, have spent a good deal of my life wishing i had been born female, etc, etc.

Her remarks were basically...."you don't want a sex change do you?", "just don't get in my things is all i care about" and "if i say anything at all it'll prolly be that i'm jealous cuz your so slim".

I told her to let it wander about in her brain, think on it and se sure to ask if she has questions, i'll answer it honestly and fully. I suggested she do some research.
Speaking of which i had her go to wiki and read the definitions on sex and gender.....amazing how many people think gender is male and female.

I also told her that i most likely won't be wanting to fully dress in front of her, that i'd be happy to just feel free to wear women's under things as that is what i'm used to.

I'm of course feeling really pleased about all this, i was afraid i'd spend my life alone and wishing for the love of another.
At least the future looks much brighter from here.

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Originally Posted by MsMjSerene

Well 2 plus weeks later and wow, how things have progressed and all for the better.

Our feelings for each other have grown stronger, and i'm now officially out.......yipppeeeee!

And she's totally on board, i guess my early radar readings were wonky. I pretty much told all there is.
I called myself gender variant, that i have felt these gender differences since i was 5, have spent a good deal of my life wishing i had been born female, etc, etc.

Her remarks were basically...."you don't want a sex change do you?", "just don't get in my things is all i care about" and "if i say anything at all it'll prolly be that i'm jealous cuz your so slim".

I told her to let it wander about in her brain, think on it and se sure to ask if she has questions, i'll answer it honestly and fully. I suggested she do some research.
Speaking of which i had her go to wiki and read the definitions on sex and gender.....amazing how many people think gender is male and female.

I also told her that i most likely won't be wanting to fully dress in front of her, that i'd be happy to just feel free to wear women's under things as that is what i'm used to.

I'm of course feeling really pleased about all this, i was afraid i'd spend my life alone and wishing for the love of another.
At least the future looks much brighter from here.

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I have never been happier my love with all of you masculine side and your feminine side.

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Originally Posted by MsMjSerene

Well 2 plus weeks later and wow, how things have progressed and all for the better.

Our feelings for each other have grown stronger, and i'm now officially out.......yipppeeeee!

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Originally Posted by GG7irish

I have never been happier my love with all of you masculine side and your feminine side.

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This warms my girlish heart to see. I'm so happy for both of you right now!

May you have a long and happy life together, each appreciating all the aspects of the other, and always full of love. :hugs:

- Amy