Being Passable

I know that most of us would love to be passable but it's not always possible. I've been told when dressed fully, makeup, wig, jewelry and all I'm quite passable. One of my problems with being passable is my height at 6'2" and if I put on 4 or 5" heels I get so tall that I draw attention which I'm not necessarily looking for. The other thing which has been brought up by my wife is when we see a crossdresser who is definitely passable at first glance, my wife will say look at her hands, "she is definitely not a woman". So it's really hard for us to pass as women see things that most of us don't see but she is absolutely correct as my hands are defintely masculine and in photos try to keep them subdued if I can. Hands are a give away gurls no matter how hard we try to look fem on the outside. Of course their are exceptions as we've seen gurls who defintely pass in every aspect. But gurls when dressed watch the hands and don't draw attention to them if you don't want to be outted. Love opinion os this as real women will always go to the hands if there is a question.

Very very ture.

Define 'quite passable' :D

Hands can be a giveaway (e.g. size, 'roughness', shape and state of your nails) and you can try and hide them in plain sight by drawing people's attention away from them, but this is definitely diminishing returns territory. If you don't want to be outed, you shouldn't look like a dude in a wig and a dress. Many of us do anyway.

I must be part of the fortunate few. I utilize my hands constantly when I'm dancing and no one has ever said I look like a man. Whether we pass (or don't pass) will always be in the eye of the beholder anyway as you correctly say.:battingeyelashes::)

IMO there is more to being (presenting as) a woman. It will not only be your hands and height - although there are many very tall GG's with those attributes, others may consider attitude, voice, and actions as well as your attire, jewelry, makeup, wig, heels, and consider them to be too perfect or out of place. Presenting yourself as the best feminine image possible does take continuous practice and control. Some of us learn quickly enjoying our feminine mode, while others need to take a little longer.

I agree with chari it is better to spend your time on the things that you can change and improve upon. We notice things like hands, height, and size of feet more than the average person due to we are looking for it.

That’s true for you wipper-snappers but not so much for us senior citizens – gnarled, spotted hands look pretty much the same whether on a man or a woman. But there are other tell-tails that most people don’t think about. I knew a DDA (Prosecuting Attorney) who watched a female witness walk down the aisle and take the witness stand and his opening question was something to the order of “ are you a transsexual or a cross dresser?” In this case it was the elbows that were the giveaway. He noticed that as he woman walked down the aisle her arms angled in rather than out, women’s arms tend to angle out at the elbows to clear the hips. While this isn’t a 100% indicator it was in this case and he was able to discredit the witness. BTW: most men walk with their palm facing to the rear and by turning the palms inward we can more or less produce the same look.

I hate my hands, if it was possible and practical to get a hand transplant I would do it before SRS.

I agree with Candice. my hands are like ham-hocks....i always wear gloves (the lacey kind in summer) when en femme. Winter and fall it's always gloves anyway

The way the body reacts/interacts are usually the big tells with mannerisms. Stand up, lift your foot off the ground. Chances are you probably lifted your knee in the air where as most women will lift their foot into the air behind them. Point at the wall. Is your hand palm up? Probably not. Most women will tip their finger at the object they are pointing to with their palm up. These have just been a few of my general observations over the years, but posture and mannerisms will definitely impact your ability to blend in.

I agree hands do look different on men and women I have long fingers and in some ways have somewhat feminine hands but I'm sure they don't look enough if you look hard.
Now as far as passing I want so bad to know that I know if I chose to go out I would look good enough to at least blend and not be so nervous that I make it so people might take a second look. There are times when I makeup myself I think hey I can pass then I look again and think not a chance. I'm one of those that if I go for it I will just dress very conservative and not flashy so I can blend, just wish I had someone to go with that would help me feel comfy .

When my hands were smooth and slender it was good.
I still have smaller but rough hands although I have narrow wrists.

None of us are passable. We all have little things that will trigger the "it's a man" response.

You live in palm Springs. Don't ever worry about passing. Just go out and have fun.

My brother has performed in many shows at the Palm Canyon Theater. I went to see one of his shows 2 years ago and it was tranny night. All of the ushers in the theater were cd's. The people loved it.

Palm Springs is tranny paradise. Go anywhere you want and do anything you want to do.

Jodi

"You can fool all the people some of the time, and some of the people all the time, but you cannot fool all the people all the time." I would be happy fooling some of the people some of the time. You are correct I think the hands and feet are obvious giveaways and if that's true then a lot of us can't pass even wearing a Burka. I did compare my hands to my step daughters a few weeks ago and they were the same size, so I guess she has large hands and mine are small for our respective sexes. Jaymee

Interesting stuff I never thought of. (All the various tells) Myself, I've got real small hands and do computer work (so they're only moderately bulky)..but they can get a little hairy at times. Fine,blonde,esp on fingers, it's hard to see but it's there.
And actually, for several years, my winter gloves were already from the female sizings..small.
Male smalls still left me with that extra finger overhang I hated.. Soo :)
With my maid outfit, I actually had lace gloves...although that was more to coverup not doing nails...

Anybody that wears 4 or 5inch heels is going to out themselves. Look around at other women you won't see shoes that high. Save those for the tranny bars.

Lacey, you are a beautiful woman ; but even beautiful women have their insecurities. You are so blessed. Peace, Melissa

I figure if someone has to check out my hands to read me, that's one for the win column.

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Originally Posted by Jodi

Palm Springs is tranny paradise. Go anywhere you want and do anything you want to do.

Jodi

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Well if this is the case then I will retire in Palm Springs. My hands are size 4x so I'm screwed for trying to hide them. The good thing is there is lots of room for nail art

Yep, just another one of the mannerisms to master.... Here's one about hands. When you look at your finger nails do you turn your palm up and curl your fingers to see the nails? Male. If you hold your hand out palm down and out stretch your fingers... female..

I say, do the best you can with what you've got and get on out there... if you want.

Renne.....

I rarely, if ever, pass. While, at times I try to look as feminine as possible, I don't necessarily try to pass. If, when someone does a double take, they have to ask themselves, "Is that a man or a woman?", I feel that I'm successful. I identify as dual gendered, in the middle of the gender spectrum. There are times when I present as a woman, and there are times when I present as a man, and there are times when I present in the middle (both masculine and feminine). I really don't care if I pass as a woman. I do care that I pass as myself.

My ex-wife had larger hands than me, but passing does not solve our deeper issues. Be grateful you have hands with all your fingers, pull out that knuckle hair, and go enjoy yourself! :rose:

You're beautiful as you are. Be who you want to be, who cares waft people think

I don't even think about passing as I have too many tells to pass. I just prefer to blend and let people believe what they believe . . . if they think I am a woman then that is nice. If they read me and give me the WT# stare, that is their baggage not mine.

Hugs

Isha

I'm with Isha on this one.
If their first impression is female its all good,If upon further inspection they see the male cues then thats OK too by that time I have passed by them and they soon forget I was ever there.

We all have something that we think gives us away ,for me I am 5'8 ,medium hands and size 8 shoes ,so size is not a problem but I have a flat noise and I think it is a dead giveaway.
The plus side is that I don"t let that stop me ,I dress to blend in and there is not much I have not experenced as Terri ,so far no problems.

im lucky in a sense that i have small hands and petite feet.i can fit in a womens 9 shoe.my hands are small.but im 6 foot which puts me out of the possibility of wearing heals....at least out. with low heals and good makeup.my wig and a conservative dress, i can pass. its the voice that scares me how do u deal with that?

Whoever said if you can fool some of the people some of the time you are doing ok has got it right. I feel that I am probably getting away with it if somebody calls me Madam in a shop or café. For me the main giveaways are feet, hands and voice.

The list of visual tells is long. Not only hand size but foot size, height, adam's apple, shoulder-to-hip ratio, head and neck size etc. I guessing that the reason hand size is even being checked is that suspicion has been aroused and further investigation is being made. I agree with those that have said if your hands have to be checked then you've already reached a large measure of success. It's already been said that what we're really trying to do is fool the eye. If you're "tall" and you wear high heels or if you have narrow hips and you wear a tight skirt with no padding are you really trying to blend? It's easy to find examples of gg's who have wider shoulders, are taller, have bigger hands etc. but it's the complete package that adds up to the overall impression. You've got to be honest with yourself. Dress how you want but if you have the shoulders of an iron worker and you choose to wear a white spandex top, you're not trying to blend. If you're over 6' tall and you wear high heels, you're not trying to blend. If you have not butt shape and you wear pink yoga pants, you're not trying to blend. If you want to blend, disguise your male traits.

i agree i hate my hands they give me away for sure

Well, after 30 replies posted I think you get the idea. Just go be your sweet loveable self and don't worry about what you can't change.

You all look so lovely. I don't know why any of you would fret.

As for me, hands are only the beginning. I don't know how many times someone has said, "My, what big, strong hands you have!" For me, it's not the big eyes and the big teeth. Folks can tell that I ain't granny by more than my hands. Thirty-five years of hard work and competitive sports have left their mark. Right now, my biggest worry is how to get a close shave without looking like someone used my face (and other body parts) for a pin cushion. A glance at my busted up feet is a sure sign that I'll never have the pleasure of wearing open toed shoes. But, one thing I know is that I'm going to have a lot of fun trying to figure these things out.

Sooo many mannerisms to master. But whether we do so or not the whole purpose is to enjoy the person we are becoming when we dress, and that is the fun of it. I'm sure I'll never master it all!

There is certainly no way to hide it. Gloves work but seem out of date to me, unless attending a black tie affair. The best I've come up with is long sleeves with some large cuffs to pull partially over your hands, and don't put them out there for the world to see.
Much Love,
Kristyn

To me, the art of passing when I went out was just doing it and building up comfort level and understand what panic and preparedness means. You will know when you are ready to venture out when you say "I've just got to do this."

For me it is about comfort, blending and an outfit that I feel beautiful in... dress as others do and forget the stripper clothes...that may be a tell...(wink)!

Vanny

While I very much enjoy CD-ing, to become passable would require a miracle which will not happen to me this side of Paradise, so I can't even try!

M.

Really - someone feels they are "very passible" but they may be "outed" by their hands? If anyone can be "very passible" - whatever that really means - because of their appearance and dress and mannerisms, but are ultimately recognized by someone who notices hands - aren't they still "very passible" in the first place? And if a few people recognize their man hands, are they really "outed"?

Maybe we worry too much.

I have big hands, and for this reason I always wear long sleeves when I go out, sleeves that are long enough to cover about half my hand, if possible. When my sleeves aren't quite long enough, I'll wear thick bangle on both wrists.

I've been told by a few that I was passable, and with the right makeup I think I look good enough to go out. But once out we must remember how to walk and present ourselfs. I have kinda long hands and I've read that its best to keep them closed whenever I can. I have size 10 feet, but not many people would notice that. There's some interesting articles on the web about have a fem persona. I'm still practicing along with making my voice more fem.

Bravo... I think it comes down to many factors but confidence must be one of the most important. People look for those actions or reactions that stand out. I love it when people are confident in their right to be wherever they are and don't care.

That's what gets a passing grade from me. OWN it and I believe.

Hope that makes sense

Vanny

i think i do ok it's just my height and my posture which i feel is a dead give away.

What do you have tentacles and a hunch back? (Wink)

I guess the point is they may not give a care about you even is you are a he/she or it. I see what appear to be sexual/gender mixes in people all the time and the one thing that hits me always is how little anyone cares these days. Except perhaps US too much about ourselves. Yes, we need to be safe and yes you need to be careful but as many times as someone has already crossed many of our paths in public and nothing happened means it is highly likely it will repeat itself regardless of such flaws we see in ourselves

We are the next generation if CDs and folks to broaden the way for our children to more openly live their lives as whomever they want. I only have one rule, I don't want them to be mean!

And that is the case with my kids. One may be a cd in my opinion but who cares. I keep on saying be kind to others. Does it matter what they dress like. Think how scared and lonely they may feel. How much guts it takes to be out and about.

Everyone deserves to live their non-hate mongering lives as they wish. About six months ago he shared some stories about friends. I think he could care less now about gender stuff

Vanny

I can never look as good as any woman. Most are to me gorgeous. If you are dressed your age to look like you care how you look. Then to me you pass. I don't mind if you don't mind if you aren't passible. Just keep doing better at other things that help. Having your nails done as I do can make your hands feminine. But I am 24/7 anyway. Are you one of those who disagree with men cding yourself.

Try to look like 500,000 dollars not just 15 dollars, cause to me most women look like a million dollars.

Tess

hi Lacy,
oh you are so right. hands are a tell. i have smallish hands for a guy and when i compare size with gg's they are rarely larger or at least not much larger than theirs. i have soft hands too from working with computers and not having to do much manual labor, but no matter my fingers are thicker and palms are wider than gg's.

i'm 6' and love 5" heels, i so know what you are talking about with drawing attention. when i walk in a room en femme, everyone looks, it's like the jolly green giant just entered the room. at 6' 5" in heels, or taller in your case, you're going to get noticed.
hugs,
lesli

me passable? not possible!

uh!

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Originally Posted by Jorja

Well, after 30 replies posted I think you get the idea. Just go be your sweet loveable self and don't worry about what you can't change.

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Bingo! I think passable comes to telling everyone else in the world that they can miss my bleep, I'm going to enjoy myself :)

I hope not to offend, and it is certainly not my intention here. With VERY few exceptions, CDers without FFS, and HRT are going to get read if given a close enough inspection. Yes, once in a while I suppose someone may be fem looking enough thru genes or just very very good at presentation, but almost always, something will probably give us away. I do not think it is a bad thing if we go out in public even though we are read. We can still have a good presentation. I do think that sometimes there are people who are fooling themselves thinking they are passing when someone uses female pro nouns. They are likely being courteous and respectful. Perhaps they may feel you have transitioned so that you are in fact now a woman. Anwhoo... It doesn't mean we do not look good, and that we do not belong out in public. It doesn't mean that people do not look at us as women, even if they know that genetically we are not.

Well said gendermutt. While passing is important to us individually, how we conduct ourselves is more important collectively. Sadly it seems that most of the exposure mtf crossdressers get in the media, both news and entertainment, is of the more harmful, negative variety. Flamboyant drag queens, flaming gays etc. I shudder whenever I see something like this and bemoan the harm it does to furthering our desire to gain general public acceptance or at least tolerance. Over time I've managed to put together an image that generally blends in at night, from 20 feet and beyond but I'm working up the courage to do more. That's why I feel so affected when crossdressers in the media are subjected to stifled snickering and other forms of ridicule.

Hi Vanessa,

I just wanted to comment on your post. I too try to teach my children to be kind. I feel that prejudice comes from lack of knowledge. My children are young 13 and 10, yet they understand that everyone is different. I have tried to teach them how hard it is for some people as they have to hide who they really are. I have talked to them about CD's, gay and lesbian relationships to try to broaden their minds while they are young. This has needed to be done in an age appropriate way, but they are starting to get the message.

Leigh