Oh it's horrible !!

This is an update to my " Please don't wear a skirt and high heels " thread.

As mentioned I'm now sorting the paperwork out for the divorce submission and my wife said she would drop the marriage certificate in at my home and have a quick coffee . I was busy in the kitchen when she arrived so had my back to her as she walked in the door , she took one look when I faced her , pulled a face and said , " It's horrible !" She then went off to talk to the dog who she hadn't seen for sometime while I made the drinks , she was OK with me so we continued to sort the paperwork out . At the end I asked if she wanted to stay and have a quick meal as I knew she had to work later that evening , she just raised her hands and shook her head , she said she needed to do some shopping and then call in on her sister . I'd bought her a small bunch of roses , she said I shouldn't have done but I told her I appreciated how hard it must have been to come and meet me for the first time and also go through divorce papers . She began to shed a tear and started to say I shouldn't have lost something like this after 40 years , at that she walked down my path , got into her car and drove off .

So how do I feel ? Mixed emotions but on the whole relieved it's happened , no more hiding that part from her . What will happen in the future it's hard to say ? At lest I can now say I won't do male mode just to please her .

As for her reaction and comment , it did hurt for a few minutes but then what else could I expect , to be honest it will hurt if she repeats the comment to other people but I wonder will she ? Or will she actually defend me ? Which is worse for her ? Telling people I look horrible or telling them I don't look too bad .

Teresa,

Her comment could be more to do with the situation she finds herself in than any thing to do with seeing you dressed. You have at least as you say, taken it that step further in seeing you dressed. When, "She began to shed a tear and started to say I shouldn't have lost something like this after 40 years" that's something that works both ways. Greater tolerance on her part could have avoided the situation just as equally. Don't feel bad about it.

Hi Teresa

It seems like your wife was always going to say it was horrible. I don't think she can come to terms that you have changed, and Teresa is who you are now. Maybe having seen you now she will have a better conversation with her sister. I am sure she will have a time for reflection having seen you.

To be honest I have heard of worse Divorce meetings without the added complexity you have here, I think Teresa may be the focus for a lot of her anger which will make things a bit bumpy but you have to stay in the 'Reasonable' zone throughout.

It won't be the easiest of Divorce processes but certainly won't be the worst - and these things are never a straight line.

Divorce is seldom easy (I've had two) and the way I've dealt with it is to have as little direct contact with my ex wives as possible. If you absolutely have to meet her in person, perhaps a public place would be better.

Its quite possible that she was referring to the reality of the divorce after 40 years as what was horrible.

Jemima,
We are OK with using the Gov.org site and doing it ourselves , we've settled everything so it's matter of filling in the application and submitting them with the original mariage certificate and a payment of ?550.00 .

Helen ,
It's a steady process that's going to take time . She'll have to decide what's to be gained by being more tolerant , she is making it harder for herself but then that's in her nature . She works for the NHS , I do wonder how tolerant she is when dealing with TG patients , she really doesn't have any excuses because she's done the training .

Shelly,
I've always been grateful to my SIL , I must admit I wouldn't mind being a fly on the wall when she meets her later today . I know there's is going to be mixed emotions , her sister married the week before us under a bit of a cloud and they remain firmly together .

Kim,
It was definitely seeing me that raised the comment , I hardly expected her to walk in and tell me I looked stunning so I guess it could have been much worse , at least she didn't chicken out .

I feel like her calling sister is that she wanted to talk to someone that has already seen you like this. Hopefully on her side but from past descriptions I feel like her sister will try to appease your wife while defending what you do. It would be an interesting conversation to hear for sure :)

At least she didn't laugh hysterically. Seeing her "husband"(man) dressed as a woman had to be a shock even with a heads up to what you would be presenting as. I believe her parting comment was one last jab at you, especially with the shedding of a tear. I don't expect you to dance a jig over the divorce but from following your story up to now I think it is the best for you. No more crossdressing as a male(F2M) to appease her. It seems the only one she hasn't been able to bad mouth you to is the dog.

Glad you got past this. I know it must have been awkward/difficult/stressful and many other emotions. Too bad she had to sting you with her words. I hope you can find someone who cares for you like you've never experienced before, and some good friends you give you support. I take it she signed the papers? If so, what a relief for you. Do you feel you can relax more now? Good luck going forward.

Many thanks for all your support .

You can all be the first to witness the papers are all signed and sealed and in the post by special delivery , I never thought it would come to this but I'm now glad it has .

It is sad, that wives can wear anything they want, and wear there hair shorter than men's and it is just fine, but hell rises if a husband wear a dress or skirt or pantys.

Sounds like it went beautifully to me!:thumbsup:

Compared to how bad it could have gone!:doh:

Sherry,
I hate to quote words of a song but " I did it my way !" It looks like it's paying off !

Divorce among older men and women is not uncommon. I suspect her comments are related to ending a marriage which she assumed would survive until death had one spouse departing. After many many years most people assume husband and wife will remain together into their sunset years. Hopefully your wife will go on to fulfill herself with someone else and not sit on the 'pity pot.'

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Originally Posted by Teresa

As for her reaction and comment , it did hurt for a few minutes but then what else could I expect , to be honest it will hurt if she repeats the comment to other people but I wonder will she ? Or will she actually defend me ? Which is worse for her ? Telling people I look horrible or telling them I don't look too bad .

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She isn't an objective commentator. It's unlikely that someone you know or someone who has a duty to you would be objective. So you estimate a weighting of what your ex-wife said and a weighting of what you have reported others' reactions to have been upon your first meeting with them, and then you balance it all up.

( We aren't objective either. )

Good job getting through the process as peacefully as was possible.

- L.

Lydianne ,
I must try and be objective about it , I now have a several people telling me not to go back to male mode they really do prefer me as Teresa , my wife will gradually drift out of my life so I must listen more to the people who will remain in my life . My wife is the only one that tries to hurt me but then she feels she has good reason .

You both lost something after all that time.
The problem is that it's not what you did, it's how she felt about it.

I know the feeling. My siblings have been trying to hurt me for almost 66 years. If they found out i dress, it would be far worse even!

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Originally Posted by Cheryl T

The problem is that it's not what you did, it's how she felt about it.

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No no no no,, and this is not towards Cheryl so much as many here who feel like this . This is backwards .

This woman is /was under no obligation to like this . None . She thought she was marrying one person then 40 yrs on turned into someone she no longer knows, and yes it does scare her . People can and do act badly when they are truly afraid .

This is not going to be ok with everyone everywhere all the time . It's just not .
That is why it was important for Teresa to have told her before they married or way early on and that did not happen .
So it's , I am going to force you to like this under my terms or else you can be alone - after 40 years . Not much choice .

I see a woman who is very hurt at the loss of her man and after 40 years , it is like he died to her . So what if she can't accept this , not everyone can .
Also we have not heard her side of this story .

Just try to keep this as low drama as possible no matter what . Its all you can do .

Dutchess,
So many points to reply to .
Dealing with not telling her before we married , I was naive on two points , first I had GFs who were OK with my dressing so I entered into marriage not thinking it would be a problem . Secondly I could be like many others thinking it was something from my younger years I would grow out of .

I don't agree with making the ultimatum , I tried by various means to find a compromise , besides she was also laying her own ground rules , I tried to live within them but she kept moving the goal posts , I never knew where I stood from one day to the next . I agree she had lost the man she married but then she wasn't the same person I married , maybe she should have been more honest about not liking sex before we married . The honesty qusetion is a two way thing , she withheld certain details before we married . I'm afraid the biggest problem about my wife is she borders a control freak , I honestly didn't realise how bad it was until our separation . Her behaviour since has been a problem because she's trying every game in the book to win back that control .

I've told this part before but it came to a head in my forties and I had to tell her because my head felt it would explode . It was OK at first but then I began to feel totally rejected and unloved , I nearly ended my life through these feelings . I entered counselling through this but from the start she wouldn't join me , I was the broken one that needed fixing . That is possibly the point we should have called it a day with our marriage but we soldiered on to keep the business going and raise the kids . It finally came to head again in my sixties but this time I had to see how counselling could help me but again she refused to join me or even discuss it . I was trying to find ways to live with it but felt I was banging my head against a brick wall , I had no where to go with my counselling until my gender counsellor suggested I go out to a social group . My wife surprisingly went along with this but the freedom it gave me I realised exactly that I needed to find a balance , so at that point we decided as she couldn't live with it and I couldn't live without it so we decided to separate . That was two years ago , she knows I'm living full time and she knows who has seen me but yesterday she decided to bring the marriage certificate and see me for the first time . As I mentioned I gave her a bunch of roses before she left in appreciation of what she had done .

I've thought overnight about her " Horrible " comment , I've mentioned before how she admitted she's lost control of me , I now see her comment not so much as a personal put down but she had entered my home totally out of control and out of her depth . We both knew it had to happen , it won't be a bad thing for her because her thoughts have become a reality , she can now deal with it and move on . She may or may not want to see me again that is her decision .

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Originally Posted by Alice Torn

It is sad, that wives can wear anything they want, and wear there hair shorter than men's and it is just fine, but hell rises if a husband wear a dress or skirt or pantys.

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This isn't directed at OP bc I dont know his situation. There are some wives who are ok with husband wearing women's clothing. Mine is one. There are some who are not. But some posters here say they are a women or want to be a women is a whole different ballgame. Most wives wouldn't accept that.

Teresa
You have done such a great job moving on with your life. I'm sure you'll move on from that comment (reaction) with your head up high and the same lady like grace you have show all of us though your post on here.
Connie

Connie,
Life is moving on , the divorce papers are in the post to the regional divorce centre .

As for the comment I've had a rethink what she may have meant by it as you can see from my reply to Dutchess , she walked into a situation beyond her control and that was her reaction .

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Originally Posted by Paulie Birmingham

But some posters here say they are a women or want to be a women is a whole different ballgame. Most wives wouldn't accept that.

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That ^^^^

This whole OP and this whole story over the years really stresses the need to tell first before marriage no matter what , it would save alot of time and tears and pain . If they leave then FINE- who wants to be married to someone not suited to them .

I know and remember all of this from all the years Ive followed this story but the truth is NONE Of us know her side . None of us .
My ex husband trashed me worse than this to his CD and TG FB friends because I would not allow him to dress AND act like a prostitute in public and I didnt like that he had a website devoted to his admirers photo requests - and more :/ - , while my late totally out tg companion would have painted a completely different picture .
Those FB people see me as a demon , you all see me fairly normally . It all depends on the person telling it and how they see things .

No one is to blame if they don't like this or acts badly because they lose their 45 yr marriage over it . Not being able to wrap your head around dressing or the behaviors that go with it does not make you a bad person .
I hope the grass is truly greener for you but trashing this gal when the first time she sees you like this is on the day of her divorce is too much .
I am VERY accepting but I don't think I would have been very happy either .

I think you may have mistaken her statement … Divorce is a horrible procedure even when it's amicable , so my guess would be that the "it's horrible" comment was related to that and not toward your appearance.

Facing life alone in your later years can be daunting to say the least.

I think she regrets not being more accepting of your dressing.

Dutchess,
That is the part that hurts , I would never down my wife or trash her in this way , OK you don't agree with not disclosing before so I remained in the closet trying to do my best. She knew my mental state and what I was going through so to see someone go down hill to the point of considering ending their life and do little to help hurt at the time and still hurts now .

Going back to the point of trashing , she's has given far more , I have never hurt and insulted her like she has me , she likes playing these mind games , and hurting people at times , I'm sure even without the dressing issue we would have parted , to her it was the ideal excuse .

I did give her options to get the marriage certificate to me , it was her choice to visit me at my home . I hope the grass is greener for both of us , she's already booked her next Med cruise , not exactly holding back is she ?

Paula, You are right. I dont disagree.

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Teresa and Duchess both make valid points. The sad thing, is none of us really know another person, what triggers them, what they will do in certain situations, and when one changes, and we all can and do change in our journeys. My parents stayed together in an embattled war zone marriage, and al of us kids are alone, and very messed up in the head. SOMETIMES, SEPARATION AND DIVORCE, are the merciful things to do, sad to say. My dad was alcoholic, a mama's boy, and had a hobby that she was not into at all, and it was the most important thing to him. She utterly resented it, and his drinking got worse, too. He was anti social unless when drinking. She was also anti social, but overly protective of her kids, and did not want to share us. She did not want her kids to marry, either, and none of us are now, as seniors. I think my parents would have been better separating for a while and getting counseling, but neither got any help at all. So us kids suffer the rest of our lives. SOMETIMES, DIVORCE REALLY IS THE MOST MERCIFUL THING WE CAN DO, if BOTH are not willing to seek help. Not just one.

I'm sorry to hear that you and your wife weren't able to work things out Teresa. I could relate to your more detailed explanation as my wife likes to control the narrative as well. Sometimes her and I share a laugh about that but it's not a laughing matter when I am the object of her attempts at control. I hope that things improve for you.

Teresa, thanks for sharing these difficult moments with us. I sincerely hope you will both be happier from now on, however for your wife I'm not so sure. I find her last comment before she drives off truly heartbreaking. Trying to put myself in her shoes and imagining saying these words, I can only feel great pain and sorrow. If that is true and she really, sorely misses her husband (the one you were in her eyes before crossdressing was disclosed), it may explain a lot of her reactions. Bitterness can be expected when you are losing the companion of a lifetime because you were faced at some point with impossible choices. I did the same mistake with my wife and came out to her after 36 years together (we met at school at age 16). In her posts in this thread, Dutchess gives very true and very moving statements of what this situation can be for the wife, and I mark her words. My wife is currently doing her best to face the situation, and I help her as much as I can. But I reckon I did her wrong, big time, by not telling her before we committed together or later got married. Damage has been done, and I can only try to mend what can be. She's a brave soul, seeking help in these forums (some of which kindly came from you) and trying to learn the ropes of being a crossdresser's wife, but at this point she has no idea if she will ever be able to face it or if I will ever be able to compromise enough for a mutual understanding, and our couple's future is at stake. She's the love of my life, and I want to make it work and make it up to her, and the story of you and your wife, and the way it ends today, gives me a lot to think about. I could be totally wrong, but my impression remains that your wife still loves you, and if that is true, some of her actions may be interpreted differently than what they appear to be at first glance. I wish the best to you two.

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Originally Posted by Teresa

Dutchess,
That is the part that hurts , I would never down my wife or trash her in this way ,

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? What site was I reading for the last four years or so?

Diane,
It does appear that I'm washing my dirty linen in public sometimes but this is basically a help forum , to share experiences has to help or guide others .

I'm aware of Dutchess's words and understand them but I may have become more cynical about marriage , sometimes the words used suggest a husband is a possession and not a human being . It is quite a rude awakening when you realise the love of your life has another side to her , I accept when I came out to her in my forties the damage was done , it tested any love left between us . We tried to keep it together because what other people might think not for what we were getting out of it . I have to admit I asked her how much she ever loved me on more than one occasion , I could count on one hand the number of times she put her arms round me and told me she loved me in all our 45 years of marriage , deep down I've been hurt for a long time , that is aside from my TG issues .

Teresa, It would appear that the meeting went OK. Divorce is hard, but you seem to have handled it well.