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My wife likes the way I look as a girl so I am always enfemme at home. I know there are other wives that feel that way too (and most of them are stright). Yet still other wives barely tolerate CDing and some absolutely hate it to the point of breaking up marriages. I am wondering what theories others may have about why wives feel the way they do about this.
This is simple, Enviroment, Upbringing, and Experiences. (lots of good information in my HELP thread a few days ago)
Enviroment, if you were raised where you never heard of crossdressing, not even the term, not seen it, no clue of its existence, Its natural to be afraid of the unkown.
Upbringing, you may have had it drilled into you as your were raised from a child, this is bad, only bad people or sick people do it, now, wheather or not that true, you were taught to believe it.
Experiences, if you have had or seen people that have had bad experiences with a thing, you are going to be afraid of it yourself.
the reason I had the title of Liver and Onions in that last responce was, its a matter of taste, what one person can love, another one can hate.
my theory ? everyone's a unique individual and open to their own views and opinions , simple as that.
I discovered two years into my relationship (living tog not married) ....... I was deeply hurt by the lies, but I researched this on the net .. much against his wishes .......... our relationship ended .... not over his cding ..... but through his lies and deceit .... from day one to my discovery ....... and beyond.
Had he told me about his cding , prior to our relationship being serious I believe I would have still been willing to give it a go.
Having said that he did things sidelined to CDing that I would never, ever have accepted and there was no way on earth he would admit to any of that .... now I am not blaming cding for where he was and continued to go .............. just not my taste nor will it ever be ..........
Honesty is so important to me, he abused that, we are, no longer.
would I date a CDR again .... sure but they better be comfortable in both skins
IMHO the reasons are many. Among them are some of us move too fast in introducing our wives to our girl-selves. Some present the more edgy/ off-beat aspects of CDing to them, i.e. forced femme and sissification, without seeing if thats okay - thinking that since CDing is accepted everything is fair game. Some of us become completely other people, in other words, the person who is the boy is 180 degrees away from the girl, totally different from who she married. Finally far too often, some get far too wrapped in their girl-self when dressed that they forget about their wives. I recall a group meeting where one person socialised with the other CDers leaving her wife sitting in a corner alone. I went and sat with her cause I could see the hurt in face.
That's my thoughts
Huggles
Toni-Lynn-
There is one theory for every partner of a TG person out there! I wouldn't even begin to think of trying to unify them!:)
Sarah...
Were you absent the day they told us everyone is different and special in preschool? ;p
I think Toni has it summed up nicely though. When you try to be someone else, don't be surprised if your SO is upset. We don't just fall in love with someone because we just want someone to love, disregarding their looks and personality. We fall in love because we love them for who they are.
It is a mixture of many things including but not limited to:
* sexist attitude about men's looks and gender roles
* chauvinistic attitude protecting female entitlements
* paranoia that it will lead to homosexuality and sex change
* guilt about living with a "sinful or perverted "partner
* public shame and loss of face
* public outing threatening family income
* lack of knowledge and help resources
* inability to share with friends to release emotions
* breakdown in trust
* financial implications of second wardrobe
* confusion over sexual roles and thoughts of lesbianism
* lower self-esteem that her femininity is insufficient
* inability to compete with the CD's alter ego
Mix the above ingredients in a large bowl and you get a person who oscillates between feelings of anger, hurt, betrayal, confusion, fear and isolation.
I don't have that problem , CUZ I tell my girl friends about the 2nd or 3rd date and so far no one has gone screaming into the night. All wanted to dress me up right then and there. I was not ready then and have not had a girl friend for a long time.:Angry3: oh well:cry: HUGGS :hugs: :canada:
I believe many women are not that approving but by a woman's nature can be understanding and try to accept. I don't believe it is easy though.
emmi
you could ask the same question in another form. like why do some people like cats and why do some like dogs?
just one of those things.
why do some eat meat why do others not?
who know we are all different.
Toni-Lynn has made a good point, I have been guilty of this, my partner "J" a GG. loves and encourages Katie, but it can get a bit much somtimes, I remember on one ocaision we were going to London with a cd/tv friend of our's, well us to "girls" spent all afternoon choseing what we were going to wear, hoging the bathroom etc. and payed no attention to "J" and her needs. It was'nt untill we got in the car to go I realised she was upset, she even had to put her nail varnish on in the car, She got over it, but it could have spoilt a loverly evening. So girls all of us who have excepting partners, DON'T leave them out of things and remember how lucky you are. Katie, XQuote:
Originally Posted by Toni_Lynn
You fall in love with someone for who they are, and then that someone goes and changes the boundries. I'm not just talking about cding, this involves anything that one partner wasn't open about in the first place. The alcoholic who pretends they are a non or social drinker, the chauvanist who pretends they are 'new man', the free spirited girl who traps you with a pregnancy.
For some couples the boundry changes are a bit irrelevant. My SO didn't tell me, but with the level that he cd's I'm fine with it. However if I thought that cding was any sort of threat (to my sexuality, femininity, religious views, personal morality etc) then it probably would affect my relationship.
Reading other threads on here show that sometimes the cder has not told their SO for a long time, and then when they do part of the cder's arguement is 'you fell in love with me, this is part of me' BUT she didn't KNOW about that part, she wasn't originally offered the full package.
Imagine if you ordered a salad. Lettice, tomatoes, cucumber and maybe mayonaise was mentioned on the menu, which turns up and you tuck in, then 5 mins later the waiter pours another dressing over your food. Some of you might think 'yum' but some of you would definitely think 'you've just ruined my food I'm not paying for that!'
When I told my wife...She questioned everything. And after it sank in for a while she told me that as long as I didn't try to hide any of these things from her it would be ok, but with boundries. And when I unloaded the whole wardrobe she freaked out. I guess that she summed it up by telling me that when she thought of me dressed it took away my masculinity. And I do understand that is somewhat of the purpose it guess. So she told me to never do it again or else. And so I keep to myself with my dressing. I love her and the kids to much to choose my own desires over them.
you know it's a crazy thing, when we first got married it was a real turn on for my wife as she just had a ball dressing me up to what see wanted to see. Now 46 years later she has ask me to tone it down now and again as I almost live full time.
Wifes are a funny thing :love:
And I would guess that many feel it is just plain weird. For most GG's, by far a majority, they see cross dressing as a fringe activity...something to laugh at either because they find it funny or due to embarrassment for the person doing the CD'ing. It takes a special GG to accept a man who is perceived to be on the fringe especially if she might have to defend that activity to her family and friends.Quote:
Originally Posted by Satrana
I don't think I have ever heard it put better than that!!!!Quote:
Originally Posted by Ze xx
Well put, Katie...Quote:
Originally Posted by KATIE TV
Hi Sasha Anne,
OMG .... I sooooo owe you an email ! :)
Anyway, yes, your question about what theories people may have about why wives feel the way they do about CDing.
Well, as you know my wife is accepting and encouraging of my CDing. But how come? ... well in her case, it is a combination of several things. Here's a copy and paste of some things she once said in an old thread:
"A lot of it may have to do with the fact that I am a very empathetic and compassionate person. I find it easy to see things from other people’s perspectives, to put myself in their shoes." she also said:
"The first thing I did was set out on a quest for answers to all the questions I had. I am a very inquisitive person by nature, another trait which probably helped me on the road to acceptance. I love learning new things and exposing myself to different experiences, and I am delighted when I come across something that challenges my previous way of thinking. I found myself fascinated by crossdressing and transgender issues, and I basically started reading everything I could get my hands on. Education was crucial to helping me overcome my fears and misconceptions, and without that spark of curiosity I doubt I would have done as much exploring.
It probably also didn’t hurt that I grew up in the 70s in a counterculture, bohemian family where radical beliefs and alternative lifestyles were, ironically, the norm. I learned at an early age that there are many, many ways to live besides what is shown on t.v. I suppose this made me broad-minded; it certainly instilled in me respect and admiration for people who are “different.” I can understand how SOs from more traditional or conservative backgrounds might have a harder time, and I sympathize with them, but fortunately for me I didn’t have any moral or religious baggage to deal with.
Last but not least, I think I was predisposed to find crossdressers appealing because I had always been attracted to men who are soft, kind, caring, and emotional, rather than aggressive macho types. Once I saw a connection between crossdressing and these “feminine” personality traits, it made me much more appreciative. Even as a little girl I preferred quiet, shy, gentle boys. I wouldn’t be surprised if at least some of those boys I had crushes on were transgendered."
All of the above is a copy and paste from this thread:
Accepting GGs: What makes us different?
Hugs
Rachel
Scenario 1
There is a potential for a GG to feel threatened if it seems there are 3 people in the relationship instead of 2. As Tony and others have pointed out, a GG will not feel she is valued if she is made to feel like a bystander, while her husband is off in a pink fog. Or if he is frequently unsatisfied or in ill-humor while he is in guy mode. The GG also wants her husband to be attracted to her and she would rather he think about how sexy that dress would look on her rather than on him.
Let's for a moment reverse the situation .. if the GG were to have an activity that equalled in time, resources, energy and emotional intensity and she expected her husband to tag along or stay behind while her priority was clearly elsewhere, if she presented, behaved, and smelled like a man, complete with body hair, buzz cut, and the appearance of male genitalia, if she bound her breasts, if she took hormones to toughen up her skin, or if she was preoccupied with whitey-tighties and could do little else than talk about them, fantasize about them, dream about them, and disappear for hours on end in a room alone clearly preferring to pleasure herself while wearing them than having sex with her husband, how would he feel? And how would he feel if she decided to go ahead with other behaviors and not tell him hoping he will never find out, because deep down she knows that she is placing her activities ahead of him and she doesn't want to deal with it? And if she feels whatever she does as a man doesn't count and it is not a betrayal to the marriage, so she spends a great deal of time fantasizing, yearning to be with another woman so she can experience what it feels like to make love while being a man. And in her mind her husband simply doesn't measure up because even if he dons the proper accessories, he still can never be the 'real' thing.
I realize I've just painted a worse case scenario. I am not saying the majority of CDers habitually engage in these behaviors. But these are all behaviors I've seen evidenced in the forum many times.
[SIZE="1"](For the record, I am NOT describing my own SO :<3: :) )[/SIZE]
Scenario 2
Then there are the GGs whose husbands do not behave the way described in scenario 1. I've gotten the impression there are many CDs in this forum who would just love the opportunity to dress if only once per week without feeling they have to hide so as not to incur their wives' wrath. These are not individuals who overindulge in a pink fog.
It may be these GGs have very similar barriers to acceptance that CDers have had all along the sometimes lengthy path towards their own self-acceptance. It is easy to forget that by the time the CDer is ready to come out to his wife, he has already worked through all the issues that she now faces for the first time. What is it that prevents CDers from accepting themselves for so long? "I am ashamed, am I gay, am I weird, am I a pervert, what is the matter with me, I hate this, what will people think, I will lose friends, jobs, family if they find out, this is not right, I will purge, this goes against the way things should be, this is ungodly, unhealthy, I don't want my kids to know, etc." To this, add the questions that are specific to GGs: "How far will it go, will I lose my husband, what if I am not attracted to him sexually anymore if I see him in a dress, am I not enough for him, what if over time he becomes more interested in other men or CDers than me, etc".
SOs need education and time to catch up.
Scenario 3
Unless the GG from the beginning agrees to spend her married life with a woman, not a man, how can she be expected to become OK with full or almost full time femme, even if the TG progression does occur over a period of decades, or only after the kids are grown, or retirement?Quote:
Originally Posted by Carol A
It is difficult to deal with changing rules if the GG finds out about the CDing well into the marriage. It is just as difficult if she gets into the relationship knowing about the crossdressing, but the rules change with the progression and the transgendered expression and identification intensifies. There are a few very special GGs who are OK with living full time, but I do not believe the majority could. Being supportive to a crossdresser who still identifies and is happy and comfortable in his male self, even if it is 50% of the time is quite a different matter than supporting someone who is no longer interested in being male.
This is why I have mixed feelings about "easing" the SO in on the CDing levels. She may begin the relationship assuming a very different scenario than the CDer ultimately or subconsciously has in mind.
:hugs:
My own theory is that people don't always know why they are attracted to someone; that we create an image of the person we love based on everything we know about them, and fall in love with that image. And sexual attraction is a big part of that; it would be very difficult for any straight person to fall in love with someone of the same sex, and just as difficult for a gay person to fall in love with someone of the opposite sex. So when a wife suddenly is faced with her man doing everything he can to appear female, it really kind of screws up the sexual attraction, and once it's gone, it's very difficult or impossible to get it back like it was before. Then you're reduced to just being very close friends at best; but for most people, a romantic relationship is something we want, no, need in our lives to be happy. And romance is difficult to achieve without sexual attraction. When you add that in to a woman's having difficulty figuring out her own desires, perhaps being upset when being intimate with her SO while being stuck picturing him as a her, it just makes life very difficult for her. So, lots of them don't want to deal with it, and just bail out of the relationship.
Rachel Morley's wife said it just about the best way possible. I was fortunate to have a wife who also was very accepting, for many of the same reasons. Some of the posts, from GG's who are/were either SO's or wives, show the reason for the necessity of total honesty in those relationships.
To be a CD and marry, or live with, a GG and not tell her about your CD activites upfront is totally dishonest. How would you feel if several years into the relationship she told you that she had another lover? Or that she was really a Lesbian? You would be shocked to say the least! And if you were married, you would probably want a divorce! Why do think her feelings would be any different? She thought she married a real man, and now you tell her that you like to wear feminine clothing?? Of course she is going to think, "OMG, I married a GAY man"!!!!
Upfront totally honest communication is the only answer, on both sides!!
Stephanie
Lady on the outside, but man underneath!
Tradition!! Tradition!!! Tradishuuuuun!
Yup. Tradition = ingrained prejudices and expectations. Such asQuote:
Originally Posted by lucille tallady
The traditional social taboo that "real" men cannot display any femininity. In reality it takes a "real" man to admit he has a feminine side - all men do but are too afraid to admit to it or take any pleasure from it.Quote:
Originally Posted by sissystephanie
Because they feel like they're losing their man
As ReineD said...Absolutely. Couldn't agree more. I feel uncomfortable when I read about 'easing her in gently'. As an accepting GG I needed to know 'worst-case' scenario as soon as I was told. I don't believe my SO has moved the goalposts since first coming out to me... I looked for that at the beginning but he's stayed consistent. Therefore, all the answers I received to the questions I asked at the beginning are still the same today.Quote:
This is why I have mixed feelings about "easing" the SO in on the CDing levels. She may begin the relationship assuming a very different scenario than the CDer ultimately or subconsciously has in mind.
I may sometimes have wavered in my acceptance, or rather questioned my acceptance but that's only natural and healthy. And our bond has strengthened because our relationship is based on truth and not a series of unwelcome or shocking disclosures.