Getting increasingly frustrated with DADT...

[Sara Jessica]

Leslie L.
Reading your post several times, I don't get the wife's "total rejection" of who you are. You year-round body shave, go out, have friends and a wardrobe. She just doesn't want to participate and doesn't want you to out yourself. I don't see that as total rejection, unless by that you mean anything short of total acceptance. My first wife, having never seen me dressed, nor pictures of me dressed, nor found my clothes, nor anthing other than having awareness that I crossdressed, deemed that as a deal-breaker and divorced me, being unable to be married to a crossdresser. I've read many other cases like mine here on the forum. Many CD's here wouold like that DADT arrangement, as it sure beats total rejection and divorce. The woman I am now married to accepts but doesn't participate, so I do my thing without her. She also doesn't hunt and fish with me. So I do them without her and don't see it as total rejection of who I am. Leslie, if all you are is a CD, then I can see it as toal rejection. But if you are more than that, she is only rejecting the CD. Consider the glass half-full.

Nicole, you make some excellent points.

There are many in these pages who would give their right arm for Leslie's DADT situation, or for mine as well. Yet which is it, a longing to be able to share an integral part of our very being with the one we love most in this world or simply pushing that envelop as far as we can and then wanting still more???

The joys I experience go for the most part unshared. It's separate where we should be shared. It's alone where we should be together, at least in a "how was your day today honey?" instead of utter silence as if the day never happened. It's the absolute exhaustion that comes with the hiding to keep it out of her sight, and the sneaking when it comes to having to conjure stories about where I am...not to her but to everyone else.

Then there is the pure frustration of the separation in general. Yes, I want more than DADT. Do I want my wife to go running around town with me? It happens that I don't. I cannot think of anything more horrifying on a personal level. This is because when out with any natal female friend, I used to put an inordinate amount of pressure on myself to measure up and would get really down if I was perceived as anything less than a female. I've pretty much gotten away from this mentality but I can see it coming back in spades should my wife accompany me. It's not something she desires and I am all good with that. But still, I do wish for more on the home front.

Just as I am certain she wishes for less.

[ReineD]

Then there is the pure frustration of the separation in general. Yes, I want more than DADT. Do I want my wife to go running around town with me? It happens that I don't.

Sara Jessica, please take this in the spirit that I mean it (kindly), but I can tell you this from the POV of having been there that nothing will ever be enough until full and complete acceptance and even then, your wife's full participation still would not be enough. Maybe it has to do with the need to be seen and heard and believed and respected by everyone. It's the wish or the need for a multi-faceted life.

My SO also dressed at home for years. When she found an accepting partner in me, she wanted to go out and she did, alone and with me. Eventually she wanted to make friends who were separate from me. She wanted her own friends, her own experiences in which I was not involved and which were deeper than interactions with the obligatory politeness and niceness of SAs and nail techs. This is when she stopped dressing at home and when I suggested a nice dinner at home just the two of us, she kinda stopped being interested.

A wife's approval is only one step in the process.

[NicoleScott]

....I can tell you this from the POV of having been there that nothing will ever be enough until full and complete acceptance and even then, your wife's full participation still would not be enough.

In some cases, sure. But many of us are quite content with occasional dressing in private, and have no need for full acceptance. Maybe you are talking about those with intense internal feminine identities, who want to be recognized as a woman. Part-time dressers, especially pleasure dressers, don't have this need.

A wife's approval is only one step in the process.

Maybe this is my issue with your first quoted statement. What process?

[ReineD]

Maybe this is my issue with your first quoted statement. What process?

I agree, pleasure dressers don't have this need. And judging by many of the posts I read here, although the CDing begins with sexual motives for nearly everyone, it does settle down into a need to express a feminine identity for a lot of people even if this doesn't develop into an abject need to transition and live full time femme. There are many shades of grey.

In the case of an identity dresser, the process is all about self expression and ultimately the resulting acceptance from others, even if this is done in a way as to preserve his male career and his marriage if he wants to, by choosing to express femininity to select groups of people who only know her in femme mode. This is why non fetish CDers wish to leave their closets, and although they believe that a wife's acceptance is the be-all and end-all to their desires, once they achieve this it is rarely enough. They want to go out and be seen, heard, and interact with others.

[Leslie Langford]

Thank you, ladies, for the heartfelt and sincere responses to my original post in this thread.

Much food for thought here, but I think that it was Barbara Ella who really hit the nail on the head for me in her reply, and truly "got" the essence of what was troubling me so much - namely the inability to share something that is so vital and so much a part of who I am with the person whom I love the most, and who theoretically should also be my best friend and confidante in all matters, including this.

My wife can share all of her joys, sorrows, frustrations, successes, failures etc. with me with no strings attached, and I am always there for her. And yet, when it comes to me - not so much; there is always that elephant in the room, so to speak, and certain topics are always taboo. How fair is that? Where is the acknowledgment of the "for worse" part of the marriage vows here in equal measure to the "for better" part as busker pointed out? Loss of intimacy in a marriage is certainly part of the collateral damage here.

And why is this type of stigmatization tacitly sanctioned by a society that can somehow be far more forgiving of known personally destructive behaviors such as smoking, gambling, womanizing, alcoholism, and drug abuse etc. - and for no better reason than they just happen to be more common and therefore better understood, even if morally and ethically they are far less defensible than crossdressing if viewed objectively?

As Barbara Ella alludes to, my wife can come home from a shopping trip and gush all about that cute top, skirt, dress etc. that she just bought and which is to die for, but when I buy something similar that really rocks my world, who do I have to share that with? So when one of my GG friends who know "Leslie" comments favorably on one of my outfits or a pair of "killer" shoes that I might be wearing, is it any wonder that I am especially elated by this type of validation, even if my heart breaks a little bit at the same time? Am I guilty of "emotionally cheating" on my wife when I start to form such a strong bond with my GG friends in this regard because they are fulfilling a need of mine that my wife will/can not?

Speaking of which, some of the other posters here cautioned me not to read too much into this perceived acceptance by my GG friends and acquaintances. They essentially implied that the main driver for this was probably the fact that they were providing a service or a product, and that I represented a "safe" and therefore valued customer to them once they got to know me, even if I wasn't exactly "mainstream". Yes, I am not entirely naive, and yes, that thought has crossed my mind more than once. And yet...

Why would my make up artist have no qualms about me coming to her home studio for my makeovers and not agonize over what the neighbors might think if they ever caught a glimpse of me? Why would she willingly take photos of me in her backyard in broad daylight and in plain view after one of her makeovers to capture the results, some of which I have already posted here? Why would she arrange for one of her neighbors who is starting a home-based manicure business to do my nails after one of her makeovers, offer me a spritz of her perfume just before I headed over, and then come over a few minutes later with a bottle of her own nail polish for me to try out which she felt would go especially well with my lipstick? Why would she ask if I would be interested in contributing to her website by including some of my shopping and/or fashion tips to the blog attached to it - and which she posted openly under my name - and then offer me freebie makeovers in return? Why would she charge me a preferred rate on my regular makeovers on an on-going basis, even though it typically takes her more time to do one than it does for an average GG?

My guess is that it is not just about the money for her, but that maybe she actually likes me as a person, feels a connection with me on some level - and maybe, just maybe - also happens to be one of those rare people who gets great joy simply out of helping others - and especially when they see just how much happiness it brings them.

As for that consignment store owner whom I mentioned - I am always welcome and treated warmly whenever I visit her store, as are other crossdressers who shop there. In fact, it appears that she actually has an affinity for our community, and even schedules special shopping events for members of one of our local crossdresser social clubs from time to time.

And once, when I wrote her a complimentary note regarding my positive shopping experiences in her store, I also thanked her on behalf of our community for openly acknowledging that she has many transgendered clients along with her GG customers, as was mentioned in a newspaper article about her store that appeared around the same time. Not only did she thank me profusely for my endorsement, she asked if she might post it on her website in the "Testimonials" section as well - which she then promptly did. Again, "above and beyond" acceptance by this lady, and nary a worry about how her regular GG clients might react to all this. And it's not as if her CDing customers are vital to the success of her business - it's doing just fine on its own, and her store is always full of people whenever I go there.

Yes, I understand that the dynamic between a wife (or SO) and her crossdressing partner is far different from the one between the same crossdresser and a non-involved GG (even if she is a CD-admirer) - and especially if she has only ever met his female alter ego. And yet, there are so many GG's out there who not only find us intriguing but are also able to get past preconceived notions of what we might be, and recognize that we might have something special to offer that most "real" men don't. Why can't so many of our own wives and SO's come to the same realization, rather than continuously getting hung up on outmoded gender stereotypes?

[ReineD]

Leslie, would you ever consider printing this post and giving it to your wife?

You do feel hurt, this is apparent. I guess there's not much we can say to help you look at the situation differently. So, another tack seems to be in order, and this could be talking to your wife on a level that you maybe haven't before?