Getting increasingly frustrated with DADT...

[Rebecca Star]

when a wife finds out some years into the marriage she feels as if her husband omitted to share an important part of who he is with her, and she feels betrayed.

In my previous career I worked in the beauty industry. Over 18 years with women as clients. I listen to not only their good times but not so good one's too. Through all if these stories which had led to issues within their relationships, the one defining emotion was that of feeling betrayed. The trust factor and what being lied to then did to them as women.

I understand telling a potential partner you CD could spell the end of that relationship, I also believe it's the right thing to do if you love someone. Telling the truth ain't easy but living a lie is a hell of lot harder on not only yourself, but the person who your hiding the truth from. And frankly, from my experiences, the "truth" always comes to light eventually.

Granted back when you got married Leslie it was different world and as you say Men were Men and Women were Women. So I can't imagine the stress on your shoulders at that time.

Albeit, this doesn't help your situation Leslie. I just felt it was important to write what I feel, in hope others here who maybe in the start of a new relationship may see why it's a good idea to fess up now than later.

[Leslie Langford]

Leslie, as you know, I'm in one of thoses DADT situations as well. But everyone is different. My wife, like yours, simply cannot wrap her mind around the whole thing. She watches all these shows on TV, like Dr. Phil and Oprah (when it was on), and is seemingly very accepting of trans people. She just can't handle her own husband being one of them. And over the years, I've done this thing on my own for so long now, I admit I'd feel a little strange crossdressing in front of her. Had things worked out differently, who can say? I might be a lot more "out" than I am now. But we've reached a balance that works for us. The other shoe hasn't dropped yet, and she's not had to confront me face to face about all of it in many years.

I agree with you that it's frustrating. I agree with you that ideally we'd all like to be able to share this most integral part of ourselves with the persons with whom we've chosen to share our lives. But instead, I continue to do my best to keep this out of her life, and concentrate on making every other thing in our marriage as good as I can make it. If that's the very best I can get, then I'm willing to settle for it. Bringing this whole thing out into the open in front of her and forcing her to deal with it is not worth the personal cost to me of losing her and all that comes with her. So I do what I've always done - suck it up and deal with it by myself.

I guess the bottom line for me is that although there's no way I'll ever stop crossdressing, being way out and open about it isn't important enough to me to end my marriage over it.

Thank you for that very thoughtful response, Marla.

Yes, we do seem to share a lot in common, but on the other hand, there are probably different degrees of DADT out there depending on each individual couple's ability to compromise. Yours sounds like a "true" DADT situation where the boundaries are clearly drawn, and both parties respect them unconditionally once mutually negotiated.

In my case, DADT is a bit more fluid and situational. Extended periods of time may go by when my crossdressing is never mentioned and appears to be tacitly accepted. However, when we do have an argument - regardless of the topic - my crossdressing tends to get trotted out in due course as a way for my wife to claim the moral high ground - at least in her mind. The obvious intent is to somehow diminish me by putting me in the position of being more defensive than I might otherwise be. This is a very manipulative practice that women commony engage in, as they tend to approach arguments from an emotional standpoint as opposed to relying more on pure reason.

Marriage counselors typically advise that it is both normal and healthy to sometimes have heated discussions as a way of clearing the air when couples disagree on a subject, or if one party feels slighted as a result of certain actions by the other. But at the same time, they advise following established "rules of engagement" to keep these fights both fair and productive, and not have them degenerate into marginalizing or diminishing the other person by resorting to insults or name-calling, which then becomes counter-intuitive.

I would categorize my wife's approach as one that typically veers off into the "unfair" category, especially when previous DADT agreements then become victims of collateral damage in the process.

That, too, is part of my frustration with our version of DADT...

[Sara Jessica]

Sara Jessica, please take this in the spirit that I mean it (kindly), but I can tell you this from the POV of having been there that nothing will ever be enough until full and complete acceptance and even then, your wife's full participation still would not be enough. Maybe it has to do with the need to be seen and heard and believed and respected by everyone. It's the wish or the need for a multi-faceted life.

My SO also dressed at home for years. When she found an accepting partner in me, she wanted to go out and she did, alone and with me. Eventually she wanted to make friends who were separate from me. She wanted her own friends, her own experiences in which I was not involved and which were deeper than interactions with the obligatory politeness and niceness of SAs and nail techs. This is when she stopped dressing at home and when I suggested a nice dinner at home just the two of us, she kinda stopped being interested.

A wife's approval is only one step in the process.

I totally hear what you're saying Reine and while I cannot predict where that line between my wife and myself on this subject will ultimately land but I can say with a degree of certainty that her participation in the outside world is not likely to become part of the equation. Part of this might be the fact I have cultivated that multi-faceted life for my TG being. I have a circle of the best friends one could ever hope for who bring me support, fulfillment, happiness and joy. One of these friends is a natal female who my wife knows all about (particularly because she is a business partner as well). And this doesn't speak to the number of vendors/artists/SA's who I could count as wonderful acquaintances (and even friends to a certain extent) as Leslie describes. It is a full life, a rich life, that I am blessed to have in the outside world. And if my wife said tomorrow that she wanted to be a part of it, it would give me pause, simply to get over my own issues of inadequacy, but I would never deny her. At the same time though, I will never ever see her participation in the outside world as being an ultimate goal.

Could is such an important word in so many contexts. for those of us with serious illness--I have lung cancer--I COULD die sooner rather than later. Yes, you COULD transition down the road, or tomorrow but it is such a conditional word that sometimes life just seems to stop for the person whose every waking moment is fixed on the thought.. The trick--for all of us--is to look at the future, plan for things ahead that allows us to keep moving forward (despite the handicaps) and , in the end, "no one gets out alive" (or maybe we all transition). It is a real problem to remain positive , and that, in your case, you won't transition, and your wife will live happily ever after. It is so easy to talk ourselves into the darkness and breaking that pattern is hard as hell. Letting go (of a person or idea) is part of the process to a renewed self.

Keep fighting the good fight Busker, from one cancer survivor to another.

As for the comment I made about the fact that I "could" transition, I put that in there because it emphasizes an additional degree of pain that my wife feels. It's one thing that any husband out there might want to present as female, go out in public, etc. but it takes it to an entirely new level of stress on the part of our SO's if there is a real possibility of transition. There are plenty of tales told out there of individuals whose bell goes off and they toss aside a lifetime of accomplishments in favor of a need to transition. In my opinion, this is such an added burden on her, knowing that it could happen to me at any given time. Trust me, this is a reality that I fight daily, lately to the point where my heart feels like it's going to explode. And it's why I find it hard to fathom how any of our SO's who are faced with such possibilities can put up with such an unknown. It must be love, a similar degree of love that I hold onto in my efforts to stave off going down that transition path.

[ReineD]

Sara J, I hear you. Not every wife wants to go out in public with her husband. I was just saying earlier that sometimes CDers (usually before they've ventured out) believe they only just want their wives' approval and then they'll feel satisfied. But when they get it, they realize they want approval and acceptance from others too. They move on, so to speak. And in the case of my SO, she rarely dresses at home any more. She can go out with me or without me, it makes no difference, she receives an equal amount of satisfaction.

[Stephanie47]

I know your pain. I'm a closeted crossdresser with a wife who knows. She participated many decades ago with bedroom play. When it started to be more than that, she turned off. We had our "disagreements" which resolved nothing other than to establish DADT. I do not even desire to engage in as many activities as you are doing. In the beginning she threatened if we ever divorced, she would "destroy" me by telling the world. Then she said, if we ever divorced, she would not do that. I really do not believe her. So, in a DADT marriage, you kind of sit around and wait for the other shoe to drop. Maybe counseling would be of benefit, if the parties went to a qualified counselor. Once the issue is out to friends and family, it seems most women get into the "poor me, I found out my husband is a CROSSDRESSER!" I go to counseling with my wife for a totally different reason (PTSD) and I know for sure, counseling would never work for crossdressing. I think many wives have separate issues which prevent them from seeing the husband's side. My wife wishes she never told me of her youth and what she did, because (my belief) she would play the poor victim. I am trying to deal with her issues, which she refuses to acknowledge.

Since fifty percent of marriages fail for some reason, and, you wonder how many others have failed but are not dissolved..............Why struggle????

[kimdl93]

....Marriage counselors typically advise that it is both normal and healthy to sometimes have heated discussions as a way of clearing the air when couples disagree on a subject, or if one party feels slighted as a result of certain actions by the other. But at the same time, they advise following established "rules of engagement" to keep these fights both fair and productive, and not have them degenerate into marginalizing or diminishing the other person by resorting to insults or name-calling...

As you point out, a couple may discuss a topic with intensity, but when it degenerates to this degree, its entirely fair to call a time-out. Let your wife know, before hand that you won't participate. The moment she resorts to name-calling or insults, its the end of the discussion, not to be resumed until at least 1 day later. This sort of thing is a learned behavior and it can be unlearned.