Discussion regarding Caitlyn Jenner

[flatlander_48]

DeeAnn, there's a difference between employee affinity groups where the focus is business pathways, which are secondary to a person's private life (and indeed everyone goes home at the end of the day to enjoy their highly individual private lives), and transitioned TSs who see themselves as women and who do not have a lot in common with people who identify differently and who may possibly end up choosing different paths.

No, we are not two different people and that's often where there is a disconnect. We are not one person 8 to 5 and someone else the rest of the time. One's personal life effects one's professional life and vice-versa unless one is subject to schizophrenia. To attempt to maintain that separation is not good. That's a problem that lesbians, gays and bisexuals have continually faced because you cannot effectively separate your life like that. This is the point behind the phrase "Bring your whole self to work.". However, my reference was to reinforce the thought process behind advocacy and activism.

It's like people who've graduated from college and are now moving forward in their adult careers, settling down, starting families, getting mortgages. You don't see them hanging out with college kids who have entirely different perspectives and priorities and who will also follow different career paths and live in different areas in different socioeconomic circles, etc.

No, it's not. They are no longer peers in a significant sense. Someone who is about to transition, or is in the process, has much more in common with someone who has transitioned than the situation you mention. There is no comparison with permanently life-altering events.

If you're talking about sticking around to tell someone HOW to transition (medications, which doctors to use, how far to take the transition, how to handle it at work, etc), then again the choices are too varied for one transitioned TS to advise another. Still, there are doctors to answer these questions, therapists, the HR department at work, support forums and groups where some transitioned TSs participate.

I NEVER said "tell someone HOW to transition". Please comment on what I write. What I said was sharing one's experience. While there are doctors and therapists who have transitioned, they would represent a very small part of the total number of practitioners. World wide, the company I work for has about 30,000 employees with HR folks at every site. I've been a member of our LGBT affinity group for 12 years. As far as I know, no one from the HR community that has transitioned; at least in the time that they have been employed here. We would have heard, unofficially, as it's hard to keep that quiet.

Why do you think that a TS woman can better assist someone beginning the process of transition (who is likely not yet sure how far she wants to take this because it does depend on personal circumstances for many people) better than the doctors, therapists, the person's own family, employer, etc.

Seriously? It's another piece to the puzzle; an experiential piece that may be difficult to find otherwise. I didn't put any qualifiers on it relating to beginning, middle or end, but be realistic. The vast majority of employers need to be educated as few have had to deal with transitioning employees. Further, what are your chances of having someone in your family to share their experiences?

If you're talking about transitioned women taking up signs and making their transitions public so help inure the public to the few transitioners there are, this is asking a lot. Not every person is prepared to live a public life (thus ruining their prospects of living quietly as a woman) for the sake of others who are not yet out. And what of these others? Should they all come out and carry signs even if they don't fully transition? Do you really think this will make a difference?

As I said, please comment on what I write. I used the phrase: METAPHORICALLY SPEAKING. It was an example of relative numbers.

If you're not talking about any of these things, then I'm at a loss to understand your main point.

This is really a simple concept. s said she was limiting her involvement in the community and placing more emphasis on her interactions in the cisgender world (or whatever the exact text was). This is her path to gaining acceptance. My point was that gaining acceptance is a game of numbers, hence the metaphor. Obviously, one can interact with only so many people. What if, by sharing your experiences and knowledge with others, it helped make things easier for them or perhaps led to a better outcome? Then instead of YOU interacting with the cisgender world, then it would be YOU and OTHERS doing the same thing. Your efforts are multiplied; many more positive impressions are made. It is a game of numbers.

If I remember correctly, same-sex marriage is now legal in 37 US states. It wasn't terribly long ago that the number was almost nonexistent. It wasn't one person or a small group of people that brought this about. It was a small army. It is a game of numbers.

This is how acceptance is gained. I didn't say that s's efforts on her own behalf were misplaced. What I talked about was a way to multiply her efforts.

It also struck me that what she said sounded like a typical male isolation pattern. It is the "I can fix this all by myself, I don't need help from anybody" notion. Sometimes, that just isn't the best way forward.

DeeAnn