I got caught!

[Judith96a]

Judy,
Ouch! I'm sorry to hear about your trouble. I'm not in a position to give much advice. I suspect that if I got caught I'd panic. My head says that's exactly the wrong thing to do but I know that's easier said than done! What I will say is that if you're going to do anything that could possibly be construed as provocative, eg retain a lawyer, then do so very discreetly. While you do have to be prudent, in case she goes headlong for the nuclear option, don't assume (or appear to assume) that it's inevitable or it could become self-fulfilling prophecy!
Read Sherrie's advice, re keeping calm and addressing concerns, over and over again. It's good advice. Remember that your wife is, to some degree, in shock.
And remember, we're here for you.
Hope it works out.

Last thought, others have said that it's probably too soon to be showing her photos and they may well be correct - unless of course she actually wants to see. It might just be worth asking her.

[Lorileah]

I know this has got to be very tuff for her. I did hate that I had such a big secret.

Size 13s I understand

It's interesting in a way that her brother is Gay and married and we have Gay friends but she says guys in dresses are creepy.

Apples and oranges. At least to the lay community. I find it interesting that TG people use the "you don't mind gays, why do you mind what I do?" argument and then they disassociate from the L&G community at every point ("Hey, I'm not gay!"). So, at this point, your wife is confused and upset because you kept a secret. You left something out she "found" (people here will say you wanted to be caught). So, how do you think she feels? You didn't trust her. That hurts. You didn't give the option to discuss it. That hurts. Oh, by the way...are you gay? She doesn't know. You say "No, I am not gay." but she thinks "wait a minute, you didn't tell me about your dressing, how do I know you're being honest now?" Do you want to be a woman...because you see, she thinks you are a little "fem" so...? This is why I always promote being preemptive. You are on the defensive now. You are having to react. But that's water under the bridge.

I blame it on that in a lot of movies that the serial killers dabble in cross-dressing. Especially "Silence of the Lamb"

Yep. and as long as the TG community doesn't stand up to that stereotype, you will always be. Also Psycho. Or you could be a clown like Mrs Doubtfire...or Flip Wilson. Or you could be a sexual predator. All things that we have to fight like other minorities had to fight. But you have to be out in the public eye to do that...sorta like the Gays did.

I was told I was the ugliest woman in the world by my MIL when I came out to her. It hurt, but I responded that I wasn't (actually there was something there about looking in a mirror...). It's a natural thing when someone is shocked or cornered to lash out with something they think will hurt you. Beauty is what beauty does, right?

And your marriage is a lie? Bet she is thinking the same thing right now. You have a chance to save it. You need to be open and honest...starting now

[Karen RHT]

Sorry to hear how something so minor (forgetting to put a pair of shoes away) could lead to something so major Judy. Despite her initial reaction, it's possible that with a bit of time, your wife may come to view things a bit more rationally.

As others have suggested, you need to be open and honest with your wife, but she needs to get over her hysteria, and quickly. She also needs to stop the assumptions and drawing meaningless (but convenient) comparisons. When you're being open and honest, she needs to accept your explanations as truths. Stepping down from her moral high horse will help her see things more clearly. She claims to have noticed you appear a bit femme at times. Did she also notice how many times you didn't just appear masculine, you were outright, full bore, annoyingly masculine?

Sorry Judy, I don't have any professional training in human interactions, nor do I profess to know or understand why humans respond to stimuli the way we do. I only know it's far too common for humans to react poorly when faced with situations they don't understand, have personal bias against, or just plain don't want to deal with a situation.


Karen

[Tracii G]

Her brother is gay and she has gay friends soooooooo what has that got to do with guys wearing a dress or anything to do with you?
I am getting so tired of people here making homophobic comments about CDing when they should know better.

[greeneyes]

DO NOT PURGE! whatever you do, don't purge, it is like burning money. go rent a small storage space and stick it there or something. Can I be just to the point? Honey if you are not having sex, and your marriage is a lie. Keep your stuff, rethink the wife. I know some people are going to get onto me for saying that but WHY stay with someone that you aren't even intimate with? Life is to short to be miserable.
I agree..get a lawyer...and hang in there...This too Shall Pass.

[Maria 60]

WOW! Those are pretty harsh words there, are you sure she's not a man. Sorry not a laughing matter just trying to put some light in a dark place. Don't purge, just try to store it all somewhere safe, i purged once and boy do I wish I had those slips and bras back. Hope it works out and vent here as much as you have to. Here we are always listening.

[Laurana]

Again?

Isn't this the 3rd or 4th time this has happened to you in a year?

[Judy-Somthing]

"Isn't this the 3rd or 4th time this has happened to you in a year?"

I tried to tell her in January which didn't go well. This is the first time she found a real piece of evidence!

I feel so bad for hurting her! This morning she said she still loves me but she feels well be living as room mates from now on.

[Sharon B.]

This morning she said she still loves me but she feels well be living as room mates from now on.
So if you are or will be living as room mates does that mean you will be able to dress as you want?

[Karen RHT]

Ok...you folks can shoot me down in flames if you disagree but you didn't hurt her, she's hurting herself. Yes she's "shocked" at her discovery, but she refuses to look beyond her own personal fears and biases, and is focused on them while ignoring you. She said she still loves you, but considers you a room mate. What kind of love is that?

Time for her love to overcome her fears.


Karen

[JenniferR771]

She always thought you were a little fem and married you anyway? She never asked if you were a crossdresser? Gay men seldom marry women--they can't stand the drama. " You would make an ugly woman"--( the competition scares her.) If she thinks you are a different person and "not the man I married"--how superficial! Did she marry a suit and tie--or a real person? Is she still the woman you married--gained a little weight? Cut her hair short? Wears jeans? Lost interest? Is it like living with your older sister?

Happened to me 15 years ago--still together, DADT--but gradually more flexible. She bought big storage tubs to store my dresses, wigs and shoes. (Outdoors in my shed).

If you purge--hide the wigs. But it will be fun shopping for new clothes.

Don't get a marriage counselor with a conservative viewpoint--mine convinced me to purge. (But I kept some of my girly things.)

[Connie D50]

I wouldn't purge say your taking it to good well and find a safe place.

[Sarah Louise]

Judy, the fact that she said she loves you is positive. If you haven't already, I suggest you find a quiet time and talk this through with her. Tell her you'll be completely honest with her and make sure you are.

It's been a big shock for her that will take a while for her to get her head around. But if you keep lines of communication open, answer all her questions and keep on reassuring her there's a good chance you'll come through this.

Good luck!

[Tracii G]

Still loves you yeah I have heard that one before.
She is biding her time until she can legally drop the hammer on you is what I think. I know that will sound harsh to a lot here but that is just how women are.
Deceptive and conniving is what a lot of women are and they don't do anything without a plan.

Personally you have tried to come out but she doesn't want to hear it and doesn't care about you or your needs.
You don't mean anything to her and its her way or no way. You opinion and well being mentally don't matter to her is what it looks like to me.
I think its time to stand up and be listened to.

[~Joanne~]

Sorry to hear about this I wouldn't purge, she didn't find all of your stuff, just the heels, so i'd wait till she is gone and pack it all up and hide it elsewhere, some where she won't go or look. Unfortunately I have to agree with leslie though, it was careless to leave your heels under the bed. I know we leave telltales all over the place but a size 13 pair of heels under the bed is a totally different story. I know she didn't sign up for this but at the same time, neither did you. I hope this works out for you.

[VeronicaMoonlit]

I find it interesting that TG people use the "you don't mind gays, why do you mind what I do?" argument and then they disassociate from the L&G community at every point ("Hey, I'm not gay!").

Yep.

You left something out she "found" (people here will say you wanted to be caught).

Oh I'm damn sure she subconsciously wanted to be caught:

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...nto-the-closet

So, how do you think she feels? You didn't trust her. That hurts. You didn't give the option to discuss it. That hurts. Oh, by the way...are you gay? She doesn't know. You say "No, I am not gay." but she thinks "wait a minute, you didn't tell me about your dressing, how do I know you're being honest now?" Do you want to be a woman...because you see, she thinks you are a little "fem" so...? This is why I always promote being preemptive. You are on the defensive now. You are having to react.

Which is why I said to Judy, EIGHT months ago:

http://www.crossdressers.com/forums/...=1#post3928609

You need to be open and honest...starting now

Judy has shown time again that she doesn't understand the need for that, she's been here a year and has learned diddly squat from our mistakes of the past.

Again?

Isn't this the 3rd or 4th time this has happened to you in a year?

Oh, you remembered the passive aggressive telling-without-telling as well? I'm glad someone else did.

"Isn't this the 3rd or 4th time this has happened to you in a year?"

I tried to tell her in January which didn't go well. This is the first time she found a real piece of evidence!

I feel so bad for hurting her!

But you didn't feel bad enough to tell her directly when we TOLD you to do so EIGHT MONTHS AGO! No, you have to beat around the bush and be passive-aggressive and not deal with it directly like an adult. And now you're dealing with the fallout of NOT doing that.

Be direct, be honest. Tell her everything. What you do, how long you've been doing it, your feelings about it. Everything. Have a freaking adult conversation about it.

Veronica

[Aunt Kelly]

Two things...
One, it seems pretty clear that your marriage has issues that go beyond the one most recently added.
Two, the particulars of those issues are unknown to anyone on this forum, so take anything that anyone says about how to approach those issues with a much skepticism. Maybe your wife is reacting out of fear from the recent revelation and with time and communication, maybe counseling, things will work out. Maybe she is a conniving shrew who believes she has found the hammer to beat you with, emotionally or even legally. The point is that we don't know. Only you can know that, and it rather feels that you're not sure.
My only advice would be to get sure, one way or the other. How this gets resolved will have profound consequences, maybe good, maybe not, so go in with your eyes, ears and mind wide open.

[Dana44]

I had one woman that was on her high horse and you cold not change that. Yep we divorced and she told the world that I crossdressed. Judy, do not purge. Do talk to her about you. It seems you only like to crossdress and go no farther than that, you just like the clothes. Tell her abut yourself and see if she responds. I had to divorce my high horse lady because she was destructive to our relationship. We all deserve to be loved and totally loved by our partners and not thinly loved. It sounds like you should look into a lawyer, They are pretty good at judging relationships when you give them all the information. .Judy you deserve to be loved. But also try to find a therapist that can help in this situation and if she does not come back down to earth, then likely there is only one option.

[Teresa]

Judy,
Your wife really is putting you in a difficult situation now, to me she is saying in different words that it's either your crossdressing or your marriage. I do understand where she's coming from but she's not giving you the chance to explain your CDing needs.

If like most of us you were born like it and will end your days with it, nothing is going to change that, OK you have the slight confusion of being gender fluid , where you have ebb and flow. To cut that need off completely and to try meet her demands isn't going to work if you are totally honest with yourself.

You need to forget the stash of clothes, ( don't purge !) they are irrelevant,it doesn't matter if you have one dress or a thousand , you have to come to terms with your needs even if it does take counselling and then put your wife in the picture, if you still love one another strong enough then hopefully you can resolve the problem.

I found once the word separation had been used and mutually agreed to the sensible talking starts , the important issues are put on the table and the true values realised. We came to a compromise which at the moment is working, but for me stepping out the door as a CDer was part of the deal in return I gave my wife a husband and a father for the children.

[GretchenM]

Judy,

If your wife claims she still loves you then there is an opportunity for repair and recovery of the marriage. If you still love her, then it is pretty much only fear of exposure of other secrets you both might have that is holding you back from jointly going to counseling. But it is also an opportunity to pull much closer together than you ever were. The counseling must be approached with a view toward full disclosure and honesty because the trust between you has been damaged.

My wife and I (both in early 70's) have a roommate kind of relationship in some respects. She lost interest in sex years ago and my ability is pretty limited as well. To us it is no big deal because we still deeply love each other and we don't need sex to validate that love. Our closeness and sharing validates it. We view each other as equals. She knows about my gender variance and accepts it but wants nothing to do with it actively. She has never seen me. That's fine. It is just one of those things we can't share. When I came out she was suspicious of all kinds of things that might being going one. I went to a gender therapist; she went to a therapist that helps loved ones of gender variant people. We found a common ground. It was rough, but since then (2012) we have been somewhat closer than we were before and more trusting of each other. It can work for the two of you as well, if you want it to.

Gretchen

[Lorileah]

Gay men seldom marry women--they can't stand the drama. "

More than half the gay men I know were married to women. Many have children from that marriage. In the 40's through 80's it was common for gay men to marry women as what they call "beards". They may not want to sleep with women, but they marry frequently

( the competition scares her.)

I doubt she thinks it is competition.

[Michelle (Oz)]

Judy, I think it is far too early to be able to interpret what your wife is really saying.

My wife's reaction to when I first talked to her about wanting to dress again was extreme. She threatened suicide - she couldn't live with me but couldn't live without me. Spend the next 36 hours in bed crying. Horrible time and I too felt so bad. Things settled down a little over time but I felt I was walking on egg shells.

Then she saw me with a pair of size 12 shoes and went into decline again although not to the extent of the first time. (Shoes seem to do it every time.)

I went to a psychologist after the first bad experience and her view was that (1) there was nothing wrong with me and (2) my wife has played her biggest card (threatening suicide) in an effort to stop me dressing. Her view was that she wouldn't go through with the threat.

There are some strong similarities here for you. Your wife is escalating the reasons why you should stop dressing. My position was that I couldn't stop. We fell into a DADT arrangement and I was very careful to keep my dressing hidden using a storage facility as my extra dressing room. Not perfect though - the shoes was one of two errors. Each time though was less traumatic than the one before.

Wind the clock forward 3+ years and she has never seen me dressed in person or photo. She knows where my clothes are and that I dress regularly. Two days ago, she was looking for some presents that had been stored and went through a wardrobe where some clothes are stored. No negative reaction.

I think the difference in her attitude is that she no longer fears the future. She has her husband. My life is compartmentalised, complex and very rewarding.

Hang in there - be true to yourself, don't make promises that you can't keep but understand the impact on your wife and deal sensitively with her.

[Meghan4now]

Judy,

We love you here and wish you the best, but this has been brewing a long time. According to your past posts, you have spent an incredible amount of time, effort and resources on crossdressing, and seem to relish the idea that you've "gotten away" with it. For years.

You may not like that Veronica has pointed out past posts to you, but she is right. It is time to face up to your reality, and own the results of your own choices. It very well may hurt. A lot. But times up.

[Judy-Somthing]

Thanks everyone for your comments.

I could be wrong at this point but I thinks she's realizing I'm still the same guy she married.

My farther was so cool about life and gave me talks, ya sometimes very long talks but he was the nicest guy.

And even know I like dresses, I mean (Love Dresses) I think I'm a nice guy and I'm pretty sure we'll get past this.

Also I'm pretty sure she expects me to stop, completely. I know I can stop for awhile, for how long, time will tell.

I did PURGE at least half my STUFF, it felt good to let go of stuff I knew I'd never wear again, 56 dresses, 6 wigs.

I still kept the 1st wig I bought 40 years age as a memento.

I didn't purge the vintage girdles, you older girls know how hard they are to find, LOL

Tonight's plan is to get DRUNK, but be nice.

[DIANEF]

Thanks everyone for your comments.

I could be wrong at this point but I thinks she's realizing I'm still the same guy she married.
Tonight's plan is to get DRUNK, but be nice.

Some progress?, lets hope so. I'll join you in that drink. Cheers from the other side of the pond!