OK, HRT might not enlarge my breasts without T-blockers which might make it impossible to function as a male:sad:; that would be a showstopper.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele
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OK, HRT might not enlarge my breasts without T-blockers which might make it impossible to function as a male:sad:; that would be a showstopper.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele
At about six months you become sterile. And remember, your results may vary. Like Michele I felt an almost instant placebo effect of 'rightness' and while whatever the physical effects may come I've ALLWAYS been more interested in how HRT would make me feel... would I get in touch with other emotions? I have found that I also couldn't go topless anywhere anymore ( I have a sister who insists that I only come as her brother... Hmmm, I wonder what she would do if I walked out into her back yard and used the jacuzzi in nothing but a speedo? ) I have had some great hair reduction results with my body hair. I've had about a fifty percent in the dark, thick hairs on my arms, legs , and around my navel. Heck, I stopped shaving around the navel and arrms, I know women with more and darker hair than what I have now. So, results may vary... is a true statement. AND I'm only half way through, it takes about three years for all of the changes to be complete. So, I'm a patient girl, But I AM a girl, and THAT'S what get's me through those moments of depression... Carol
Do you just shoot blanks, or do you get ED and can't perform as a male? How do ******** do both; are their breasts the result of surgery? I want to appear as a woman and have natural boobs, but be able to function as a male when my panties are off.Quote:
Originally Posted by carolinoakland
If you want to have a big hard c00c%, then estrogen is probably not for you. It will lead to both sterility and ED.Quote:
Originally Posted by sfwarbonnet
Quote:
Originally Posted by sfwarbonnet
gawd..you are such a man...
you want some natural boobs??? :lol:
anyway...i'll be honest....i have been on hrt for about 20 months.. i have erections, i still get unwanted erections when i'm walking around in jeans, ugh....and i can easily orgasm, and it feels better than ever (although i beleive this is probably because the hormones help me to feel "right" about being a sexual person, so i'm not guilty and ashamed every time i orgasm)....either no or very little liquid comes out, and i could care less...
my best friend on HRT after 6 months can barely get her penis to move...and when she does she says it hurts alot like a sharp knifing pain when she is hard, and it hurts her so much she cant wait for it to get flaccid...i experienced this very early in my HRT, and then it went away, it hurt BAD...for me it went away..for her it didnt..
so as you can see...there is absolutely NO way to predict it
IF you are doing it for sex (and based on your comments you certainly are)...then the ONLY sensible way to go is breast augments...you could also spend a TON of money and get Facial surgery and you can become much more feminine in appearance...
Generally speaking, you shouldn't get within a mile of an estrogen pill if you still want to function as a male. HRT is for feminizing your body and you can't pick and choose the parts it will effect, and no doctor will touch you if you want to play both sides of the fence...if you want to be a man, be a man.
Karen :g1:
Veronica,
Some men who want breasts may be lucky enough to be sensitive to the chemicals in saw palmetto. It is listed as far back as 1890 as having that effect on both women (increasing mammaries) and men (causing gyne).
My doctor recommended it several years ago for urination problems and low and behold I grew a set of boobs. Confirmed by my endo a few weeks ago as he told to cut out the SP. My testosterone is 332 (241-827) estradiol is 36 (13-54) which is more than most menopausal women and prolactin--useless is men , stimulates milk produciton in women--is 14 (2-16).
good luck with your quest
mandrake out of water
Veronica, I am providing a different point of view as the GG spouse of a MTF. My spouse started hormones in January. She spoke with her doctor about her needs and concerns. Some doctors do take the attitude of it being a black and white situation. Some doctors think like some have posted in here that if you want to have breasts but still be able to function it must be for the wrong reasons. But her doctor, like Linda stated, does believe in the rainbow.Quote:
Originally Posted by Linda Z
My spouse has been in gender therapy counseling for 2 years before starting hormones. She told her doctor that she wants to be able to maintain a sexual relationship with. The doctor put her on a regimen that has resulted in breast growth and still allows her to have an erection. While it does take some work, and as a heterosexual female I do miss the ability to have that certain affect on my spouse simply from a certain look or pose, it works for us. There has been some softening of body hair and slower growth in some areas but not all and her hips have either spread or gotten rounder. It has affected her emotionally. There has also been leg cramps and nipples that are so sore just her shirt rubbing against her makes her cringe.
Yes, my spouse has always felt like she was a female in a male body. However, she has never hated her penis. I have made a lot of sacrafices in staying with her, to include my son and daughter no longer talking to me. Marriage is about compromise, it is about putting someone else's needs above your own. Her choice is because she loves me and she wants me to have happiness too and neither of us wants to lose the other. So her choice has been to live happily today and not concentrate on SRS. We both understand this is not a popular point of view from other's perspectives. As someone else posted, the majority of post-ops end up alone. For her, that is not what will make her happy. Being female is how she feels and how she sees herself. How you see yourself and how you express that is a choice each of us should have the right to make individually.
Hi Veronica,
What I'm about to say is gonna tick off nearly every TS girl on the board, maybe even some girls I adore;
Taste the rainbow baby!!!
I recently started with a great therapist who specializes in Gender work, and she has many years of experience. She really put my mind at ease about this whole transition thing.
Basically, it is YOUR life and you will need to do what works for YOU, regardless of any well meaning but misguided advice. She said there is no right way to feel comfortable with yourself or deal with whatever your gender issue is. Every person has different needs and every situation is unique.
Don't let the SRS brigade stop you from exploring whatever options you want to explore. These ladies keep harping on safety this and safety that and serious medicine, yadda yadda, ...and they're right. That's why you have a doctor!!!
Personally, I would always trust my doctor and therapist before I would ever entertain the advice of someone on this board who I don't even know is real. This board is great entertainment and there are some great people here (as far as I know) but your doctors are the most important players in this little melodrama. If your docs can understand your goals, than that's all that matters.
I'm appalled at some of the snotty comments and holier than thou attitudes in this thread.
Guess what ladies, there are many different paths to contentment. Some of you just see the word hormone and you jump in like it's your job to protect us poor dumb misguided fools. Well, let me clue you in. I don't really care what you think about whatever my plans are so I generally keep them to myself and my actual friends for this exact reason. I won't be put in the position of defending something that me and my doctors are working on. In fact I just recently had some surgery which was rather expensive but very important for my feminizing goals. Notice I never peeped about it, or the long recovery until now.
I know that the path my therapist is suggesting would be met with a howl of protest from the self professed arbiters of femininity so I save myself the grief by not posting personal details along those lines. This is NOT the place to share intimate details about your life.
It's funny that the same people who yap about safety seem to have no problem jumping in and giving dangerous advice like they're qualified to do so. It's my understanding that a therapist can't give advice on HRT until she's had enough time to get to know the patient and the situation. Then the Endo has to do her research. What are you starting with? What are you wanting to do? What are the risks? These people don't care about your health and safety. No doctor would advise you without at least some very basic information which you haven't provided. The best and only advice you should get is simply; see a doctor.
In general, free advice is worth every penny, but I would say that free medical advice is worth much less. Especially when the advice giver has an obvious bias.
-Misty
GAWD AM I TICKED OFF!!!!
...actuallynot..
your point is well taken in all its provocative glory
people need to do what they want...people make choices about their own safety and their own needs... if you don't do your own research then its on you if something doesnt work out...and one of the biggest things that I've seen is folks with unrealistic and fantastical views of HRT, transition and beyond..
free advice is worth alot more than nothing though..its not the end of anything...its just the start...
google is free...is it worthless? an open forum is a different version of the same thing. and this is an open forum with 100's of years of collective experience.... when i was getting divorced, i posted i was trans on a divorce forum hoping for some advice...once
like you Misty, i know that being smarter than everyone else is a very difficult burden (ahem)..but don't worry i'm not troubled by the contradiction in your posts! i think the worthless information you laid out is just as valuable as my worthless information!!
in the end, i think we are all going through an absolutely brutal destructive process..being trans is unlike anything else...having a "condition" that makes you feel worthless, being surrounded by folks that don't understand at best, and living in a world that mocks and belittles you sucks...and many folks are desperate for any kind of help..and I for one will try every time to help anyone that is going through it..and i think that's what you are doing too, even tho for some reason you feel our discussions are worthless...
one of the most rewarding things i have done since i accepted my fate and started my own feminization is to share what i've learned with others.
OK, I wasn't going to post here. But let's say she get her cake, and candy too. Later we'll see a post, OMG I've got breast, But I Still want to present as a man, how do I hide them, My wife/girl friend has left me because of them. What do I do now.
In my opinion ( opinions are like, well everybody knows that one), Run as far away, from HRT as you can.
If you do not want to live full time, then don't play with HRT.
Asking me if I'm "able" to get an erection is like asking me if I am able to eat glass.
Having a hairless body, almost-B-cup breasts, and alot more hair on my the top of my head have all been welcome, but if I knew that all I would get out of HRT was the death of my male libido and the psychological well-being the drugs have brought, and nothing more, I would have still said, "when do we start?" But I didn't know. And since I was individual with my own unique genetic history and body, my doctor didn't know for sure, either, outside of certain parameters. Like it or not, those parameters, and results are there with the transsexual in mind, as far as I know. Maybe it is possible to customize an HRT regimen. I dunno. I do know that the whole package, for a transsexual, seems to work for most.
Geez, It was ridiculously obvious, to me, at least, that talking to my therapist and my doctor were the best ways to take care of my issues. But I'm also extremely grateful to all the holier than thou folks who were happy to share their experiences and feelings with me along the way, and I haven't felt too many better feelings than giving that back in some small way, when given the opportunity. There was a time when many gender variant people felt and thought they were totally alone, sometimes feeling like they were the only ones, anywhere, who felt the things they were feeling. So now that a measure of guidance, solidarity, community, and yes, sometimes some realistic, no-crap assesments of what may be in store are available, that's somehow a bad thing. Meh.
As always, well said, Kaitlyn.
Hugs,
Melissa:)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Joan Merrie
Says you. I'm so glad people like you don't get to make decisions for the rest of us.
Veronica will do what's best for her.
-Misty
Like I said opinions are like, well you know. That's just mine. I know I wouldn't want to go through life, presenting as a man. Especially one with breasts. If she is going to live full time, that's fine.( to me full time doesn't mean SRS, many of us just cant afford that, I wish I could, I'd have it done today. For me that distended hoo ha birth defect is just something for the wast liquids to come out of.)Quote:
Originally Posted by Misty is Kindafem
Hmmmm, but maybe not provocative enough if you saw through it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele
Oh, no doubt about it girl, there are people out there doing stupid things. Some of them are self medicating which I don't think is a good idea, but even that is none of my business. This is a free country and people are free to F themselves up however they choose to do it.Quote:
...and one of the biggest things that I've seen is folks with unrealistic and fantastical views of HRT, transition and beyond..
Good point, but I couldn't resist the pithy remark.Quote:
free advice is worth alot more than nothing though..its not the end of anything...its just the start...
Yes it is, but it comes with just as much BS and personal bias as any group of people you would find on the street. I'm sorry but transitioning yourself does NOT make you an expert on all things transition related. It makes you a patient. One of many who is experiencing a million different things which are mostly unique to YOU. Your life, your body, your changes.Quote:
and this is an open forum with 100's of years of collective experience....
Oh girl ain't that the truth!Quote:
like you Misty, i know that being smarter than everyone else is a very difficult burden
...wait a minute, were you being sarcastic?
....HEY!!!
Well, to be fair, I was mainly talking about issues like this. Where somebody is giving stern "advice" (sounds like orders to me though) when they don't have enough information for a proper diagnosis. How in the heck are you gonna tell someone what they can or can't do with HRT when you don't even know them? Never met them, never seen a test result, never consulted with their therapist. That's the free advice I think needs to be ignored.Quote:
i think the worthless information you laid out is just as valuable as my worthless information!!
You're right of course except for one little thing; I don't feel the DISCUSSION is worthless at all. That's why I dove in with a fist full of provocation. The discussion will prove to be fruitful, (after the echo chamber has been turned down a notch) but the "run from HRT if you're not me" dogma was not helpful and I felt compelled to walk in waving a freedom flag. There's thousands of girls out there who don't post but can be intimidated by some of that vitriol into more confusion. Rather than see a therapist, they get influenced by the louder voices and start to think that maybe there is only one way.Quote:
..and I for one will try every time to help anyone that is going through it..and i think that's what you are doing too, even tho for some reason you feel our discussions are worthless...
My therapist opened my eyes. There is a smorgasbord of opportunity out there these days and if nobody else was gonna say it, then I am proud to take the heat.
Yes, and it's honest forthright discussions like this that provide the best forum for sharing. I've shoveled quite a bit of BS in my time but one thing I've noticed is that BS always crumbles in the heat of even the most mild debate.Quote:
one of the most rewarding things i have done since i accepted my fate and started my own feminization is to share what i've learned with others.
-Misty
Misty, you are right that "we" tend to sound self righteous when we suggest that only people who wish to transition fully should consider hormones. Maybe we are keeping you away from some rainbow with that advice. But we are also doing two important things: trying to keep you from starting a fairly dangerous drug regime for the wrong reasons, and trying to avoid having to tell you (later) that unfortunately - yes - the affects of HRT are to a great degree, permanent. Regardless of which group of results you get (good or bad).
We really aren't as haughty as we may seem, rather we're trying to save folks from their own foolish decisions. Sure, HRT could work out for some to be a "Boobs but hard Johnson too", with few if any other effects... but it is not very likely that that will be the case.
Just to make it clear, i am not yet on HRT, but intend to get on it as soon as the doctors all agree.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
After doing a lot of reading on the subject, what i do know is the it does make you sterile over a period of time, this apparently varies from person to person, as do the other effects of HRT, what you can do before you start your treatment, is look into getting some sperm frozen, how you would go about that i do not know, as i have not looked into it as i have had my children and really dont want more.
I know Charlene, but that's exactly what I'm talking about.Quote:
Originally Posted by CharleneT
The "wrong" reasons.
Wrong for who? You?
Joan just said she would never want go through life as a man with boobs and I respect that. Why can't you do the same for Veronica?
Look, a lot of you girls who have transitioned have made decisions along the way that I personally wouldn't have made, but I respect you for making them and living out your lives the way YOU feel is best. There are people out there who surgically install horns and fangs. There are people who alter their bodies in any number of ways for any number of reasons. If somebody wants to take a pill to grow an arm out of the top of their head then I'm afraid that's their business and you're just gonna have to live with it.
So what if they complain later that they can't wear hats anymore? Gosh, then we all get the smug satisfaction that comes with being right for once in our miserable lives.
I have no idea what Veronica wants to do, but let's just say she wants to emulate a she-male porn star. So what?!
Many women and men want to have bodies like porn stars. There's a whole plastic surgery industry that's basically founded on the "ideal" look for the female body. So she wants the body and she wants the erection. It happens, it's been done. Get over it.
Too many rules, and tradition is a poor excuse.
-Misty
I do agree that seeing a doctor is best, but it doesn't hurt to also get some info from reputable internet sites, if only to have a list of questions you can bring to your doctor.
Here is your list of desired effects:
This is what HRT does according to the LGBT group at Ohio University:Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
1) Yes to breast growth, but according to members here, how much growth is a crap shoot.
2) No to softer facial features or any other skeletal attribute such as height, size of hands & feet, although the skin will soften.
3) Yes to lessening of body hair (but not facial hair .. you will need facial laser hair removal).
4) Yes to redistribution of fat, but according to members here, only if you have fat to distribute.
5) No to removal of adam's apple.
In addition to the above:
6) No change in voice.
7) Loss of strength.
8) Increased emotional sensitivity, depression not uncommon.
9) Diminished ability to achieve erections and to ejaculate.
10) Sterelity
11) Possible long-term health risks such as thromboembolic disease (blood clotting), and benign pituitary tumors, gallbladder disease, and hypertension.
There are also other options and resources on the site.
to help fight blood clotting, i take a baby aspirin a day. But now even a small prick or cut, I think I'm going to bleed to death, before it stops.
The problem isn't with what V. wants to do, it is with the fear we all live with that someone out there will think to themselves that "if those ladies do that then I can too..." but, for the wrong reasons. Then later, believe that they were led astray by words on a forum such as this one. None of us want to think back and have to say " I could have said something to her ... maybe she would have sought out a gender therapist and found out that it was just a fetish" ...or whatever.Quote:
Originally Posted by Misty is Kindafem
We - as in TS folks - are trying to fix something about our very basic makeup. It is a very different thing from changing your fangs. Which you can change right back pretty easily if you want to do so. Along the way we learn out of need, about the details of transition. Few who are very much along that path would "recommend it to others". We worry that someone will mistake what we say as advice to go off and change your gender because it sounds like fun. IT AIN'T no fun, trust me on that one, please.
Here we talk it out, in extreme detail at times. It might seem to some that it is a thing they'd like to "try out". That is the rub, we want to try as gently as possible, to convince them to seek professional help before going down this road. I mention this because even though it is not often talked about here, you can easily get the HRT drugs without the help and advice of a qualified doctor. You can then dose yourself up, seek what you think you want and find yourself in a heap - and I mean HEAP of trouble. So, yes, we worry way too much about someone emulating us for the wrong reasons. Yes, that does mean that we appear to be "dividing up who is right and who is wrong..." etc. When in fact very few of us ever want to do that, or ever wanted to be here in this position. But here we are and so we get kinda touchy when it seems that someone might be going in a direction that isn't for the right reasons. Yes, that means we feel you must have the "right reasons", because if you don't, and you end up sorry over it, you may be stuck without a way of getting back to where you comfortable. The big issue here that isn't mentioned as much as it should: HRT is a one way street. You start and after a while ( they won't say when ) you can't go back to your normal again. You will be stuck on some form of HRT for life.
You don't like your tattoo ? Laser it off. You don't like that piercing ? Take 'er out. You think your vampire phase is over ? Go to the dentist and get the implants out. This all very different from "I've been on HRT for 9 months and I want my erections back, and when will these boobs shrink back down"???
Gawd... I'm sorry, because I am lecturing here... I really do not want to preach. BUT I really do not want you to think that what I do is a good idea for you, UNLESS it really is.... so sure I'll challenge you on it. My challenge is nothing, nothing at all compared to what you will face if you follow me down this road. Yeah, it sounds so enticing, but it ain't, it just ain't.
As Charlene said, this is a very dangerous path. Is it fun heck no. I've lost all most every thing, i/e mom,dad,brother, both sisters, in laws, some friends, my house that I helped build, nearly lost my job. and came very,very close to ending my life, once my cat stopped me, the last time my wife came in and took the gun from me.
Would I wish this on my worst enemy, he** no. This isn't a fun trip at all. That's why we get over protective if we think someone is thinking she can do it so can I.
PLEASE, PLEASE, think this through, talk to your better half, a qualified therapist, before you jump an this scary ride.
Reine your list is mostly consistent with what i've seen personally
it is possible to see a softening of facial features though, but it usually takes a long time, some girls see that happen post srs even after years of HRT
i've also had friends that didnt see fat move, but after srs they did get more curvy..
it really is a broken record that folks overestimate what the meds can do so its fraught with problems.. one reason for this in my estimable opinion is that we all grow up looking over the fence at femininity but don't really understand it, so we covet what seems most attractive, but otherwise have no clue.....as my friend dave would mutter over his beer...tits and ass, tits and ass, tits and ass...
thats how i felt...then i started the HRT, and it was nothing like i thought, it took FOREVER to fricking start working, my blood work got crappy., etc etc,,...on the good side i learned that living my real female life was worth it, even though it was nothing like what i thought..
now will somebody come over here and help me open this jar of pickles?
This thread has been troubling me for some reason.
1 V. doesn't want to transition to full time.
To me full time is 24/7 365. not back and forth.
2 She wants the effects of hrt, but keep function.
It's possible, but no one knows how your body will react.
For instance, My Dr. had me on a low dose of Spiro. and a high dose of E. What happened was when my E levels go to a certain level, my body converted it to testerone. That was like a death sentence to me. So he upped my Spiro, and lowered my E.
My point is Excessive levels of estrogen can become testerone, so you are going backwards.
3 This is just my opinion. What if you do get your much wanted breasts. You go to the beach or where ever, in male mode, are you going to keep your shirt on? how will you explain you boobs, Gynecomast? well those Male breasts look a whole lot different than female breasts.
We do not mean to be preachy, but this is a dangerous road. please think things through, before you commit to this path.
Hmmm, maybe the idea of personal responsibility is what's really troubling you.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joan Merrie
I'm not gonna transition full time for at least another couple of years. Maybe never. I can't speak for Veronica's plans but so what. YOU bit off full time, maybe we will maybe we won't. You don't approve so just give us your best dirty look and move on with your life.Quote:
1 V. doesn't want to transition to full time.
To me full time is 24/7 365. not back and forth.
Just so we're clear, it's okay for your doctor to experiment with YOUR dosage but it's NOT okay for Veronica? Why? Oh, because you got there first, I get it. You have learned hard lessons and that poor dear has no idea what she's getting into. Well, relax hon, I'm sure her doctor is almost as good as yours, but to be safe, you may want to send your contact info just in case her Doc gets stumped on something.Quote:
2 She wants the effects of hrt, but keep function.
It's possible, but no one knows how your body will react.
For instance, My Dr. had me on a low dose of Spiro. and a high dose of E. What happened was when my E levels go to a certain level, my body converted it to testerone. That was like a death sentence to me. So he upped my Spiro, and lowered my E.
My point is Excessive levels of estrogen can become testerone, so you are going backwards.
Are you gonna keep yours on?Quote:
3 This is just my opinion. What if you do get your much wanted breasts. You go to the beach or where ever, in male mode, are you going to keep your shirt on?
Quote:
how will you explain you boobs, Gynecomast? well those Male breasts look a whole lot different than female breasts.
Yes they do, and that's exactly why we want them. I think it's sweet that you're so concerned about our embarrassment at the beach or wherever, but do you really think I'm so stupid that I wouldn't make the appropriate adjustments in my life to accommodate my breasts? Really? Life isn't a sitcom, where I run out with my (totally straight) buddies and tear off my shirt for a quick game of Top Gun shirtless volleyball. Ooops, OMG look at Johnny! Dude you got boobs!!!
If it makes you feel any better, I won't shave my chest. That way the site of my big hairy boobs will stun them long enough for me to put my shirt back on and pretend like nothing ever happened. Maybe I'll start a biker gang and I'll grow a beard and cut boob holes in my leather jacket.
The world is my oyster!
Thanks Mom, but I'm an adult with a career and a mortgage. I'm fully capable of thinking things through all by my wittle self. No offense, but my therapist has a lot more invested in my particular case than you do. Also, she has a hell of a lot more experience with this stuff than you do. Why can't you people understand that what you know is based on what you've learned about YOURSELF and that there is a full range of possibilities that you didn't consider or didn't choose for one reason or another.Quote:
We do not mean to be preachy, but this is a dangerous road. please think things through, before you commit to this path.
The big wheel keeps on turnin' baby and I will continue to explore options that work for me. My happiness is paramount and I will do what makes me happy. (period)
Maybe someday we'll meet and I'll tip my hat with the arm that's growing out of my head. ...and if by chance that really gets your goat, then that will make me happy as well.
-Misty
Thanks Riene. Though there is one more I'm surprised wasn't on there. Slow/stop of male pattern hair loss. This is the biggest one for me. I find it impossible to face growing older and knowing my hair will progressively get thinner and fall out. I can't see not taking hormones as I move to full time.Quote:
Originally Posted by ReineD
1) doesn't bother me so much. I think there is some legitimacy in all forms of gender expression. At the same time I think there would be unexpected costs associated with the constant switching back and forth, like a never-ending transition, where people never learn how to interact with you from day to day; and/or people will have a hard time taking the female presentation seriously and/or the psychological workload of trying to keep up two lives. But maybe that is what the OP wants. Maybe when the time comes the OP will decide the costs are too high and will decide to stick with one presentation. In either case I tend to think it's the OP's right to live in a bizarre manner if she wants to. Thankfully we all have that right.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joan Merrie
2) Is the one I find a bit disturbing and indicates that the OP either hasn't done her homework, or is living in fantasy land. I think if she was making an informed decision - aware of the risks, she should be allowed to make it - but... this doesn't sound informed to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hope
SHE HAS A DOCTOR!
Sorry for shouting but she said she was going to F'n therapy already. What do you people want?
You ladies remind me of those old biddies that give me dirty looks in the cosmetics aisle at Target.
Let Veronica and her doctor work this out.
Disturbing indeed.
-Misty
[SIZE=2]Naw..[/SIZE]Quote:
Originally Posted by Misty is Kindafem
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Not in a million years...so no worries Misty[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Life is way too short to sweat the small stuff..[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]In the end, no matter what I or others say, many do what they want anyways, regardless of the warnings coming from years of experience..[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]As far as Veronica goes, it doesn't matter to me either way of what she wants...but I'll wish her the best & hope she can find whatever shes looking for...[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Me ka `oia`i`o, [/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE][SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]Aloha ahiahi......:drink:[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
[SIZE=2][/SIZE]
Let's do our best to keep the level of antagonism towards one another down a bit..., k?
True, that. She has a doctor, and a therapist. So why'd she ask around here? Was she looking for opinions or affirmation? Her first response to a few posts tells me it was the latter, and I haven't got a problem with that, or with whatever anyone does with their own body. But ask a question, and yer gonna get folk's opinions. And since the title of this forum starts with the word transsexual, whattya think the prevailing opinion will be? Actually, Veronica recieved a pretty well varied spectrum of responses. I don't know how ya get "snotty" out of the ones cautioning her about HRT, which, even with a doctor's and therapist's help, is still a pretty serious undertaking. She seemed to be asking about the consequences concerning her penis. She asked for opinions. She got'em. You and her are taking a path that is a bit different than most here. You may be aware of alternatives some of us aren't aware of, or frankly, probably haven't even bothered to check into. That's fine. I truly wish ya the best. But I've known many of the people here for a while and I know how gracious and willing to give they can be, and I don't know why the instances of name-calling, accusations, sarcasm, or the seemingly bending over backwards to be contrarian were necessary.Quote:
Originally Posted by Misty is Kindafem
Hugs,
Melissa:)
I see you are asking people for there opinion on how they have been affected, and not for medical advice. you seem to have this already, and roused some feelings i see.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
If you take HRT some or the symptoms are reversible, but it is not guaranteed which ones, i have read that you sperm count can come back, but it might not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
May i ask do you have a partner now, because if you have hrt and change to look more like a woman it may affect your chances in the future to get a partner, just a thought to throw in there.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
I'm not sure that implants would be enough for you, as without any breast fat they will in my none professional opinion look real, also you would still have male nipples..Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
I can totally understand were your coming from, the desire to look like and be like a woman is strong, but there is also another strong feeling and that is that you want to have children in the future.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
There is no right and wrong way to go about things, they just all have different consequence's, people may have opinions and some will be stronger than others, and be expressed differently, and i feel no one on this forum has a right to judge others, as we are all outside what society in genera,l would class as normal, and the whole idea of having this forum is for mutual support and advice, Veronica, my advice to you is to read all the responses, talk to your doctor and make a decision that suites you, and what you think you want for the future, because what you want in the future may change one way or another.
So many responses seem dead set on that if your goal is not surgery then you are not serious. If gender has no relationship to genitalia then what is under your skirt is irrelevant, except to the person wearing the skirt and their partner. In regards to wanting a functioning penis and breasts why does that preclude her wanting to be a woman? Once again, gender identity is not genitilia.
With the attitude that it is all or nothing and that if you are not in the all category than where does that leave the women who cannot have surgery for medical reasons? Are they not real in the opinion of those in this forum? And what message are we giving them by taking that position?
There is also the reality of life. I recognize that my spouse has had to give up a lot of things because of the gender issue. But to become a woman does that mean she has to throw away her brain? Reality is she has a family to support and she is in a male job. In the future maybe she will be able to find something comparable, but to leave her family in the street is not a loving, compassionate, intelligent decision and I respect her more for the fact that she recognizes that she has to balance her needs against the families' needs, which is a very female thing to do in my book.
My spouse is on hormones. I have no problem with her wearing whatever she wants to at the pool. If that means shorts and a bikini top, so be it. If that means going topless, I envy her getting away with it.
If you want hormones make sure to follow the standards of care. Get a therapist and talk with a doctor. If they feel it is safe and that you have gender disphoria then you may get hormones.
Only once I realized what hormones trully mean and would do did my therapist agree to give me my letter. Originally I wanted hormones to make me a female (easy way out) but now I know I am female (had to work at it and learn what it means to be a female) and I haven't taken hormones yet.
For me being a female is not a fun thing but a this is who I am am and I finally feel normal thing and I am having fun while I do it. It can be hard some times but it is so rewarding.
[SIZE=4]WOW, this was an exceptional thread, after reading it all the way through. I did everything WRONG. But I have been living and completely accepted as a woman for over 2 nearly 3 years, complete with female ID. I am likely non-op unless I finally get a nice big $1 million from the suit against the city that fired me solely because I said I was trans and was wearing a wig (had worn for 7 years before transition) and a SKIRT (OMG!!!)
I do not even consider myself a trans person any more, just a woman. (Don't bother with the "you are really a man crap")
I would not tell anyone else to follow my path, but if someone does, it is their choice and their risks, and their considered choice just like it was mine.
I see a lot of related actual experiences posted on here which I think was what the OP was asking for anyway.
To go with the flow: I have B breasts. I have very low sex drive, erections only a memory, ejaculations down to about 25% of what pre transition on a yearly basis was. Quantity
is less than formerly, but even in me I think quantity is dependent on interval between ejaculations. Notable shrinkage of the thing, maybe of those damned berries I would like to discard. They make my panties not fit so well.
Result of 20yrs saw palmetto, nearly 3 years of fenugreek, and six months of estrace vaginal cream, and one month of progesterone cream and estrogen cream. Cream used daily, and applied to my breasts. Saw 1/2 inch over bust measurement increase over the last 2 months.
I was attacked for mentioning the above regimen before by those of the medical religious fanatic persuasion claiming it can't work (must be because only FDA approved regimes with prescription medicine are the only things that can possibly work. At least that is the party line!)
Personally I agree with the probable majority ----- Do NOT go near any HRT hormones unless you are completely serious about transitioning and living as a female. I would rather die than live one day as a (pretend) man.
One thing in my favor - I don't have a spouse, but I have a gg gf that will marry me today just as I am. She also knew me for 16 yrs before transition.
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I'll add my two cents.Quote:
Originally Posted by Empress Lainie
I agree with Misty. Like her, I have avoided discussing hormones on this site due to the sanctimonius knee-jerk reactions which always result. I probably will never transition fully. I probably will never live 100% full time as a female..., nor as a male. But hey, it's my body and my life, so get over it!
Hormones are not all or nothing. A small dose might not affect one's ability to orgasm. It hasn't mine, even after three or four years now. So what has E done for me? It gave me a body I'm happy with, with fat in the right places, small breasts, softer face. But more than that (much more!), it's been like a fountain of youth. I feel young again, more alive, and much more happy than I was before taking E. I'm content, at peace with myself and the world, and a lot of this I attribute to estrogen.
I'd love to be a young, pretty girl. God, yes! I've always felt that i should have been born a girl. But it's not going to happen; even if I transition, I'll be an older woman, good looking at best, but too old to be pretty. Plus, I've got certain family responsibilities. So maybe I'll continue on as I have over the past few years: sometimes I appear as a female, and sometimes I appear as a guy, albeit a feminine guy. Maybe this bothers people, but it is who and what i am.
Cindi Johnson
I'm not going to point fingers, but it seems like some who have posted in this thread need to go back to their therapists for more help.
Just because you know everything to know about YOUR situation, doesn't mean you know jack about someone elses. Everyone is different and drugs react differently to everyone.
For instance, most everyone I know that has to take percocets for pain, it numbs them and some even go completely limp (whole body). Me, I can chew them up, swallow them, snort them (never done that), what ever, and they have no effect on me. Most drugs don't. But estrogen does.
So....
Unless you have indelible proof whether something will happen or won't happen 100% of the time, don't speak about it like it's certain.
This thread reminds me of a saying I've heard many times that has worked very well for the most part for me.
Quote:
It is better to remain silent and be thought a (Fill in the blank) than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt
if you don't want peoples opinions why post at all and why read other posts?
its just information...saying you chew percocets and they don't bother you makes you no more or less credible than anyone else..it has nothing whatsoever to do with HRT.
if i can't share my own personal experience then what should i share?
Good question.... :strugglinQuote:
Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele
IME, many times questions like this are asked, not for answers, but to find validation that what they think or want to do is okay.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaitlyn Michele
[SIZE=2]EXACTLY..!!!![/SIZE]Quote:
Originally Posted by pamela_a
[SIZE=2]Maybe we should all just say F*** it, and let them find out the hard way..[/SIZE]
[SIZE=2]After all, what do we know....:brolleyes:[/SIZE]
I've been reading and keeping up with this thread and really appreciate all of the discussion and even though I've read a lot about HRT I was surprised at the variation in experiences. I'm not on HRT and not sure that I will go there. I've got a lot of professional counseling and issues to resolve before I do, if I ever do, but I know that if I do decide to start HRT that it's going to be a permanent part of me with permanent effects.
So please keep sharing your own experiences as I'm sure that there are others out there that are reading for their own education.
Hugs,
Helen
All we can do is give answers that are based on years of research and personal experience, but like Karen said, what do we know?
GK
That's my point. But we are all stupid and don't know 'nutin.:D:hugs::love:Quote:
Originally Posted by Karen564
After all what do I know, I'm just a trans:JoanMerrie:
Actually several decades for some of us. Then again personal experience and knowledge has not been valued for decades either.Quote:
Originally Posted by GypsyKaren
What a shame that many of these "knowledgeable professionals" were taught what they know by those that had real world experience since what was in the books was wrong.
BTW nice thread hijacking Misty.
Veronica
My little appendage is no friend to me - and the sooner it's gone, the better. I have always considered the "little friend" to be nothing more than a bothersome urine delivery device.
JoAnne Wheeler
Let me clear up a few things here (I really wish I wasn't absent from the site while this thread flared up). My intention here was to be a *******, not someone who goes back and forth from male to female - that's what I do now. My concern is 1) having kids and 2) I don't know what my eventual mate is going to want :/ I have since realized that artificial insemination through injecting my frozen sperm into my wife isn't going to cost tens of thousands of dollars like it costs with a surrogate mother. I posted this because I wanted to try to figure out what I wanted to tell my gender therapist about my goals. I'm still not sure what I want to do here.
I have certainly been told puritanical falsehoods (like how I was told in elementary that alcohol's called a downer because it makes you depressed). I found out from a trans support group that if you start getting issues with erections, it can be reversed, but the sterility remains. It's dangerous when you tell lies like that, because it can add to people ignoring all the good advice.
I also don't believe in thread hijacking (in the way atheists don't believe in God). This thread was my vehicle to asking the questions I needed to ask, but I think it silly to suggest that only I can have my questions answered in it. I do not own this thread.
I don't plan on going to the beach in male mode if I were to transition. I have gynecomastia anyways, so I keep my shirt on just the same.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joan Merrie
I was doing my homework by asking. The thread wasn't any final decision that I was going to take this action or that action. You have to find out what's going on first.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hope
Have you read my posts? I was disappointed to find out what I did, but then I started discussing alternatives. Does that suggest that I was just looking for affirmations? I see I've been painted quite poorly in my absence.Quote:
Originally Posted by Joan Merrie
I do not, I haven't in ages. I know what problems that may cause, which is the primary issue I'm having in figuring out what I want to do. However, the person I am meant to be with may be a confirmed lesbian at this point in time as well.Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizabeth 66
I don't know either, though I do have pretty much A cups from my gynecomastia.. not sure if that will be enough or not for the D's that would be proportional :/Quote:
Originally Posted by Elizabeth 66
Yeah, that's kinda how some of the posts were making me feel, in particular the one which set me off, and which was deleted. And no it's not the information, it's the judgmental attitude that some posters have had.Quote:
Originally Posted by lizlizzie
I never said I didn't want to live as a woman, I said I wasn't sure about losing my penis.Quote:
Originally Posted by Empress Lainie
In finale, I may decide to make the full transition..... I can certainly go ******* in between. I'm a bit irritated when some people decided that I am not woman enough to be discussing this, presuming that my hesitation had to do with me not really wanting to be a woman rather than perhaps having other demons to deal with. Others, who had the same opinion of those people, but who haven't been judgemental are quite appreciated by contrast. If I quoted you and responded in rebuttal does not mean you're in the earlier group, but clarification only.
This thread makes me almost feel bad for having breasts without hormones. Then I realize I don't care and skip on my merry way. And no, I can't go out in public shirtless without feeling naked and exposed so there.
And I am going the slow boat route to hrt because I tried it the other way, tried to rush things, did spiro for a month, flipped the f' out, had an anxiety and tear filled breakdown, and purged.
I guess it is what works for you but I have had to come to grips with my own lack of self acceptance before I decided I am ready to be who I am. Now I am at the point where being accepted by others takes a back seat to me being ok with me. Now that I am ok with that, I am ok with being a woman and transitioning.
on a side note... *******?!? really. What is to me like a certain word begging with n and ending with a savage beating in certain neighborhoods.
If it were a case of asking additional questions or seeking related information I agree. Lack of response from the original poster can take on many meanings. Glad you decided to follow up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
I truly believe we are all seeking our own level of comfort. That means that each of us must find what is right for us. There is no such thing as a single standard for everyone.Quote:
Originally Posted by Veronica Nowakowski
I have seem some take steps that are dangerous for their health and well being... sometimes ending in death or close to it. It is because of these experiences that I (and possibly others) express caution and most of us are trying to prevent seeing others follow that path.
Good luck with finding yours. :hugs:
Veronica
thnx for posting....
Quality of life quality of life quality of life
thats what this is all about
one of the reasons i think some of us can get emotional about this is that we have seen alot of suffering, and much of it has to do with trying to stave off transition or having high hopes dashed ..one of the primary problems being the almost total unpredictability of HRT...and this leads to the default answer of don't do HRT unless you are transitioning...
you are trying to deal with a pretty big issue, and trying to improve your quality of life...its smart to be thinking about risks and rewards...and its smart to get every drop of info that you can get